Zerg tax

[Bach]

What does this have to do with stockpiles ? Would you not have a bigger problem with 500 players with single third rates verses 25 players owning 20 third rates? I fail to see how the ships per player is at issue. Is not really just imbalance between nations?

Ok let's take your example. A 500 player British Zerg is pushing East in the Antilles each one owns 1 3rdate and is using it there. A much smaller Spanish fleet decided to attack the zergs rear holding back in the Gulf of Mexico. To use the 3rd rate to have a maximum series of x20 high BR port battles this Zerg would have to turn around and spend a day sailing back to the gulf to fight the Spanish. While doing so a French group counter attacks the Antilles. This forces the Zerg to split up into 250 Antilles and 250 Gulf. They can't bring the full force of the Zerg to every front.

Now let's go with the same Zerg but stockpiles 3rds all over the Carribean.

500 players teleport back to the Gulf hop into waiting free 3rd rates and attack 20 Spanish ports anihilating them all. But the French attacked so 3hrs later the teleport into those warehoused 3rds and annihilate 20 French ports. Since this Dutch guy called this Brits mom a name 3 hrs later they teleport to South America and Destroy 20 Dutch ports. 60 maximum strength PB in 9 hours.

You just can't have teleportation and stockpiles of free top end warships without creating game dominant zergs. I don't think I have the answer. I'm just suggesting this is something worth looking at.

Edited February 25, 2016 by Bach

[Aetrion]

It's like the problem with health potions in MMORPGs. It doesn't matter how expensive you make health potions, if you allow people to drink one after the other with no restrictions the most powerful players will always be the ones who have stockpiled so many health potions that they can just heal themselves infinitely. That starts to instantly break the game because now anyone who wants to be competitive needs enough health potions to just always chug one when they take damage, and consequently everyone has to do the grind to stockpile them. If you try to make people use the potions more judiciously by making them more expensive all you're really doing is creating a huge barrier to entry for competitive play, because someone, somewhere is still going to grind out enough of them to just keep slamming them down and be invincible. People who don't have the time to grind for the potions then simply can't compete and leave the game. The only solution is to add a limitation that is independent of cost, like a cooldown or carry limit.

 

Not every problem can be solved by just adding more cost to things. Some stuff just needs independent limitations. 

 

For example, make a player's crew into an actual number of people on your payroll that cannot be instantly replenished when a whole mess of them die or are captured. Instead they recover over time, maybe 1 guy every minute. At that point you can't just throw away a 3rd rate, because it doesn't matter how many more durability points or extra third rates you have stashed. If everyone on board died you can't crew another one for several hours. Using smaller ships immediately constitutes a significant reduction in your risk, even if you are the richest player on the server. Also, having smaller ships that can pick up lifeboats and escape from the fight will suddenly play a huge role in whether or not you can sustain an assault or if your loss of life instantly becomes so catastrophic that you're reduced to using 7th rates.

 

 

If you just try to slam more cost on everything to balance it out all you're doing is making sure fewer and fewer people have the time required to break it, and everyone who doesn't simply won't be competitive.

Edited February 25, 2016 by Aetrion

[Slamz]

People who don't have the time to grind for the potions then simply can't compete and leave the game. The only solution is to add a limitation that is independent of cost, like a cooldown or carry limit.

 

 

Hmmm. What about a cooldown timer for bigger ships?

 

Like if you lose a 3rd rate, you are locked out of taking out another 1st - 3rd rate for......20 hours? So basically you can get back into one tomorrow but you're done for the rest of today: time to use something else.

 

Of course this might drive some die-hards to quit the game. If they can't sail the best ship in the game, they don't want to sail at all! But it would help keep the ships diverse and no amount of stockpiling would let someone drive around in 1st rate after 1st rate after 1st rate, hopping right into their next one every time one gets sunk.

[Aetrion]

Well, like I suggested, if your crew became an actual count of personnel under your control it would create a variable "cooldown" for huge ships, and also enable the devs to introduce a whole bunch of systems pertaining to rescue operations or crew capture/ransom to let people manage how catastrophic their crew losses are.

 

And sure, that might offend people who think playing the game an inordinate amount should afford them special treatment, but hey, there should simply never be a point where you have so much money that you can just buy your way past all limitations. If you can break system by grinding enough the broken state will simply be the competitive baseline. That's what we're seeing with 3rd rate zergs right now, and once a couple clans have pushed enough of their members to the point where they can build a 1st rate every day you're going to see those stockpiled and unleashed in zergs too. It's simply inevitable that people will adopt those kinds of tactics if the only thing preventing them is not having that much time for the game.

Edited February 25, 2016 by Aetrion

[Quineloe]

Bach, for a start, the TP cooldown is 4 hours, not 3.

[The Spud]

I don't think we need to narrow down a game, so it becomes playable for both casual and high end players. We need to broaden up the game so it is enjoyable for all types of players. We need:

- More Mission Types

- In depth economy, allowing casual players to narrow down to one specific resource type, so they can be of importance to the nation but one a narrow scale.

- More ships

- Diplomacy

-...

 

The game should not be a long mission grind towards the end game Port Battles, with a PvP every now and then.

It needs to be broadened up in features, so you don't realy feel like "having seen it all" so fast.

 

The game can not only rely on hardcore players as a playerbase, as this will shorten the lifespan.

 

The more players the better, without limmiting the hardcore players.

[Reki]

There is some potential to this idea.

 

I'd like to see ships of 4th rate and below exempted from such a tax.  Make it expensive to own 3rd and higher.  I've also suggested maintenance costs for sailing (not for parking/keeping, but for sailing) where there is a cost to operate the ship for each day you're out at sea.  Make this cost exorbitant for 3rds and above.

Very high grind potential, yes)