Torpedoes down to funk.

[WelshZeCorgi]

Is anyone finding the torpedo mechanics a bit, funky? Like when they have a mind of their own and they fire on the nearest, least threatening thing, (i.e. cargo merchantman) even though you needed them to hold their fire for a more important (and dangerous) target later. (i.e. the heavy cruiser next to the unarmed merchantman) 

They also seem to fire at the most inopportune moments, often firing on a target that is changing speed and direction, usually trying to avoid a previously spotted spread of tins or just as it's about to get broadsided by a school of torpedoes. At best, the torpedoes launched are wasted because the target immediately sinks from the initial torpedo strikes, or it still completely misses, because the target engines get damaged, slows down and the next torpedo spread swims harmlessly off the bow of the ship. 

Sometimes, they also fire only 1 or 2 or 3 torpedoes out of a x4 torpedo launcher and are then stuck in reloading and will not fire the remaining torpedoes still in the launcher even when they're 100m away from the BB or CA about to squish them.

Also, trying to coordinate a torpedo run against a target seems obtrusively difficult, with your limited order options, formation sets and limited friendly AI usually setting you up to get your torpedo boats and destroyers to get blown out of the water one by one because the ships slow down in front of the enemy guns at close range in order to maintain formation or because they took a hit that caused the slightest flooding and/or engine damage and want to fall to the rear. 

And because of that, you can't get a torpedo armed division of boats or destroyers to coordinate their turn from forward abreast to line, in order to give that perfectly deadly broadside spread from multiple ships fired at the same time from multiple directions. Right now,the best you can do is line your ships up so that they fire their torpedoes one at a time, which greatly diminishes their effectiveness, especially if you have the numbers. 

I get that this would happen with crews and sections that are conscripted, untrained, green, new to fighting in a division or still learning to coordinate and communicate with other ships, but there should be a difference if it is an experienced crew with captains well versed in coordination, communication and section/division torpedo fighting tactics.

Edit:

Also, it's a bit to easy to get hit by an unnoticed torpedo as well. Those flashing "!" signs only last a second, so if you were off inspecting the damage you inflicted on the enemy flagship 20nm away at the moment the enemy torpedoes were spotted and didn't catch the "!" sign before they went away, you were going to be surprised to find your ship suddenly sinking a minute later. I think having the AI try to auto-evade torpedoes for ships under your command would be helpful. 

 

Also would like to add that putting on multiple launchers, like two 1x tube launchers or four 4x tube launchers, doesn't make the TB or DD fan out the spread of torpedoes when firing multiple launchers, instead doubling up on one spread, so that if it fires two 3x tube launchers, the patter will have 3 lanes, each with 2 torpedoes in each lane.

This is opposed to firing 6 lanes, each with only one torpedo to spread the torpedoes out to cover as much space as possible, maximizing the chance of a hit. 

Edited January 10, 2020 by WelshZeCorgi

[WelshZeCorgi]

Also bad: since some hidden algorithm not visible to players decides when a torpedo is fired or not, sometimes you bring the target into torpedo range, level out so that you're no longer closing with the enemy, then just sitting there watching the enemy blast your torpedo boats out of the water one by one wondering why they're not firing their torpedoes, despite being in decent range with a good, wide enemy flank being presented to them to fire on. And you lose battles like this often. And it's rather frustrating when that happens. 

Edited January 9, 2020 by WelshZeCorgi

[akd]

That’s not my experience, but I agree there should be a little more feedback on the torpedo targeting process.  However, really don’t want to see torpedo crews acting like automatons.  Torpedo warfare was a hugely uncertain undertaking, especially early in the era.  These are not u-boat captains waiting patiently in ambush.  Having torpedo attacks not work as expected should be the norm, not the exception.

[WelshZeCorgi]

I know, but the way and reason why torpedo attacks don't always work in game vs in real life are different, with the in game version feeling artificial and obtuse. Like, "this torpedo attack didn't work because you didn't have the high actions/click per second of a StarCraft pro player", vs "your torpedo attack failed because your equipment was faulty, or you crewed your TBs with people the army rejected or conscripts or two boats lost contact in the foggy weather and gave away their positions prematurely trying to re-establish sight of each other. 

If we don't want our crews, torpedo or otherwise, to feel like automatons, and I'm all for that, there should be a better mechanics and systems to help reflect or convey that.

[arkhangelsk]

I don't experience most of the problems you mention. Here's how I fire torpedoes. First, turn torpedoes OFF until the moment you want to fire. Just the ability to do so gives you a real edge over real admirals. Next, drive your ships into what you think is the perfect position. When they are in the perfect position, manually designate the desired target to make sure they are on the right one, then turn the torpedoes to AGGRESSIVE. Then the only problem left is getting them to fire. If the torpedo tubes are above decks, see if they are turning slowly to the right direction. If they are underwater tubes, try a slow parabolic turn to get the target into that narrow firing arc and remember that maybe it is not pointed straight at the enemy ship (lead). When ship number one fires, detach it, use the Auto-Retreat function and focus your efforts on getting Ship #2 to release its torpedoes, and so on until they have all fired.

By the way, if you want to do any advanced formation work, I suggest manual control of individual ships. I know everyone likes the Turn Together, but in real life that takes a lot of training to pull off especially if the ships are of different types. Since the system cannot stop you from stringing different type ships into a division, we are left with this fail-safe system of auto ship control...

[disc]

I have noticed torpedoes often fail to launch when the attacker is second or third (or so on) in the division, and the division is on converging-parallel course with the target. Generally this corrects if the division begins to pull away from the target track.

I think this may be a product of some (maybe primitive) friendly-fire avoidance logic. I suspect the ship will not launch if a friendly ship (in the same division?) will cross the torpedo track within some timespan, regardless if the chance to hit is negligible.

On the other hand, I have seen a ship sink itself with torpedoes. The torpedoes launched, then the vessel immediately turned into two of them and blew up. It took perhaps one second from launch to destruction, if that.

[WelshZeCorgi]

Also would like to add that putting on multiple launchers, like two 1x tube launchers or four 4x tube launchers, doesn't make the TB or DD fan out the spread of torpedoes when firing multiple launchers, instead doubling up on one spread, so that if it fires two 3x tube launchers, the patter will have 3 lanes, each with 2 torpedoes in a lane. This is opposed to firing 6 lanes, each with its one torpedo to maximize the chance of a hit. 

Edited January 10, 2020 by WelshZeCorgi

[WelshZeCorgi]

20 hours ago, arkhangelsk said:

I don't experience most of the problems you mention. Here's how I fire torpedoes. First, turn torpedoes OFF until the moment you want to fire. Just the ability to do so gives you a real edge over real admirals. Next, drive your ships into what you think is the perfect position. When they are in the perfect position, manually designate the desired target to make sure they are on the right one, then turn the torpedoes to AGGRESSIVE. Then the only problem left is getting them to fire. If the torpedo tubes are above decks, see if they are turning slowly to the right direction. If they are underwater tubes, try a slow parabolic turn to get the target into that narrow firing arc and remember that maybe it is not pointed straight at the enemy ship (lead). When ship number one fires, detach it, use the Auto-Retreat function and focus your efforts on getting Ship #2 to release its torpedoes, and so on until they have all fired.

By the way, if you want to do any advanced formation work, I suggest manual control of individual ships. I know everyone likes the Turn Together, but in real life that takes a lot of training to pull off especially if the ships are of different types. Since the system cannot stop you from stringing different type ships into a division, we are left with this fail-safe system of auto ship control...

They're going to have to work on streamlining that workflow, if getting good torpedo runs out of your ships require that much mindless repetition for each and every battle involving torpedoes, there needs to be an effort to reduce the amount of fiddling, clicking and micromanaging.