[[PvP2] Vive La France]

That'd be why everyone has to stop saying "you did this" and "but you did that first". Both can win if you drop the blame game and start over.

[[PvP2] Vive La France]

At this point the pirates are worked up into such a frenzy there is no face saving way for them to get back out.  Someone would have to cave and with the ego's we are dealing with, that would never happen.

 

On the French side, we have nothing more to lose.  We knew the path ahead of us.  We knew we would be pushed into making our stand with few or even no ports.  We had no real alternative but to take that path anyway.  And we're having a blast in the meantime.

 

So what would you suggest as a way that the Pirates and French COULD work together at this point?  There is nothing that the pirates need or want from the French except for them to just go away and stop being a pain in their rear (figuratively and literally given the part of the map we're talking about).  Some might call it a mere annoyance with no real impact on the big picture.  The fact that we are expending so much energy here and in the game dealing with it says its not entirely inconsequential.  There is nothing the pirates would be willing to give either as their position has and continues to be one of "we'll just take all your ports and wipe you out" as if that will ultimately solve anything.  

 

This is the problem.  We are playing two different games and keeping score in two different ways.  There is so far no common ground to even begin to have reasonable dialogue around.

While the problem of egos (as well as the problem of their number stemming from a deeply flawed horizontal organizational structure of "clans within nation") is a separate one and deserves a whole separate thread, I do believe that the French have something to lose. 1) while you are creating a tight group of hardcore PvP players for your nation, you lose prospective players who are turned off by your geopolitical situation and lack of opportunities to explore the game to its fullest, 2) current situation is breeding long term hostilities and prevents future discourse and possible collaboration between Pirates and France. While it might not have an immediate impact on your enjoyment of good PvP action, it could have drastic consequences for the future game when pirate mechanics are reworked and map is reset. If you refuse to negotiate in earnest, you are denying yourself a potential ally in the future (if not ensuring that you've made a permanent enemy) - that is not a prudent policy.

 

I believe that Pirates actually need strong France in order to compete with US and Brits (look at the bulk of European history and struggle to maintain balance of power). Pirates could definitely use a second front against US and Brits that France could provide from its secondary holdings in Louisiana. That second front would free up pirate clans to retake Bahamas and end internal division caused by US occupation. As those ports are all shallow, retaking them will have to be a numbers game. In that game, experience level and ship size will not matter. Allies that bolster numbers and lack of enemies that prevent reinforcements, however, will prove crucial.

 

Tensions appear to be high between the two nations, yet both have some interests that can be fulfilled in a mutually beneficial manner while ensuring that good PvP action is available to all without having to sacrifice other aspects of the game. Earlier I outlined what I believe to be a decent start to not only restoring Pirate-French relationship, but also building a productive alliance that would allow both nations to improve their geopolitical situation. While the particulars of that plan can be negotiated, it appears that no such negotiations can begin until egos and blame flinging can stop. I would strongly advise both parties to set aside past transgressions however real they might be, put on some big boy pants and engage in a big boy diplomacy. What this thread has become is meaningless and if either one of the parties is not willing to even try to work together (without bringing up past events), then you are all effectively wasting your time with this meaningless back and forth banter. 

[[PvP2] Vive La France]

Way to go, guys. Keep slinging some more blame at each other instead of trying to figure out if we can actually work together instead of approaching a meaningless cutter v cutter PvP that we could've done in the Bahamas in the first place...

[[PvP2] Vive La France]

Ladies and Gentlemen, having fought in a few PvP battles against the French in the South East and having followed the deterioration of Pirate-French relationship for some time now, I would like to address both sides. French captains, as well as representatives of various Pirate clans make a lot of good points in this thread. What none of you do, however, is offer real tangible solutions to the current predicament affecting both parties. France is currently being forced to resort to guerrilla warfare and abandon hope of returning their possessions which would help to attract and sustain new recruits. Pirates are currently a nation (due to the game mechanics) divided among its numerous clans each with their own agenda and plans, none with a capacity to execute them individually. Pirates are also overextending themselves in the South East while losing all of their original holdings (which causes further split between various clans and factions). If the current state of affairs is to continue, US and Brits will eventually divide the map in halves and annihilate Spain and French holdings in the West. Given their prior attempts at cooperation (and lack of Swedish cooperation), Dutch are likely to be sponsored and encouraged by the Brits to advance to the East, while Brits will likely assault Sweden and Pirates from the North West. Neither France, nor Pirates will benefit from such developments. While arguments about testing the efficacy of guerrilla warfare do have merit and France can absolutely refuse all cooperation and resort to such actions, keep in mind all of the communal ties that players that could have joined France will be making instead while playing as US or Brits. The reset will come eventually. Will there be enough new players to then build a strong French nation if all of the players now will be used to flying other flags? Strong France now will attract more players later. Strong Pirate-French relationship now will similarly benefit both nations once pirate mechanics are reworked and map is reset. Long term goals of both groups appear to be mutually beneficial and can be achieved if both groups work together. In order to achieve very specific objectives I humbly propose that blame for miscommunication, rudeness, and other past offenses be laid aside while we all work towards a mutually beneficial future. In order to do that, I humbly propose the following:

 

1. In order to rebuild relationships and French Nation: All ports south of French Capital should be returned to France (with the exception of Saint Joseph and its iron/hemp/oak). Pirates need France as an ally if Bahamas are to be retaken and if US and Brits' advance is to be halted.

    

2. In order to establish a better working relationship between Pirates and France, 1-2 clans should relocate to West Florida and assist France with holding off US/Brits while establishing a second home for France. These forces would also apply pressure on US from the West, while the rest of the Clans retake Bahamas and apply the pressure from the East. While the French might lack numbers to successfully utilize both of their areas, their ownership and occupation of Louisiana is crucial to halting US advances and will provide them with plenty of PVP action. In the case of Dutch invasion of France, Pirates shall designate a clan that will assist in repelling such attacks if help is requested. Clans can have a rotating duty roster of who will be stationed at Camp du Roy for those purposes and use the time to farm bigger ships, XP and gold.

    

3. Spain has to be sponsored and encouraged to join Pirate-French coalition. Their survival is paramount to halting Brits from advancing further East. Furthermore, once a measure of success can be demonstrated in the Bahamas and West Florida, Danes and Sweden can be enticed to open another front and split Haiti between them. After that, there should be an evenly matched 3 v 5 war that will give all the PvP everyone wants to everyone on the map.

    

[Угрозы банов от американцев]

Имеет место быть правило гласящее что по содружественным суднам (окрашенным зелёным цветом во время сражения) стрелять нельзя. Я лично не согласен с тем что это правило распостраняется на пиратов, но пока оно в силе, по зелёным стрелять нельзя. Кстати, легко доступную информацию на эту тему на русском языке я тоже не вижу.