Keeping your national flag in battle with allies

[Pelennor]

Hi,

 

Example of actual situation:

If a US player, allied with GB, join a GB vs Spain battle, he will raise GB flag during battle.

 

Suggestion:

The US should keep his original national flag in battle.

 

Why?

There is actually many way to identify if a ship is friendly or enemy:

- name color top of the ship (green/red)

- players list (tabulation)

- battle map

- proximity map

- name color when you point camera on ship (white/red)

- flags

 

Before diplomatic patch, every player were able to join a fight, regardless his own nation and nations involved in battle. That situation justified the fact that flags were important to identify friendly/enemy ships.

 

But since diplomatic patch, situation is very clear, everybody knows who is allied with who. So, the GB player of my example above will necessarily identify US flag as friendly and, if not, many others way to recognize enemy from friendly exist, as described.

 

Conclusion:

Flags are, I think, a capital part of ship personality and, just like in reality, should not be removed for any situation.

Battle beauty and intensity will be enhanced with different colors fighting side by side for their cause.

[Skully]

Here-be-Trouble

Who do we pull to which side?

If a French tags a Danish and an Independent/Pirate sail next to them. On whose side does the Independent/Pirate end up?

Or if two Clans decide to go to war, but they are allied on Nations, whose side gets the other Nationals sailing along?

As for Outlaws, they can be considered 1 man Clans.

I think the only solution is having a multi-sided battle in which each Clan forms a side. Then let the RoE stances dictate who you are allowed to shoot.

Well, we have a week to ponder the issue.

However, the notion of a 2 sided battle (with just 2 flags) is deeply ingrained into the engine. It only knows two teams: "Left" and "Right".

And this notion goes far back.

Battles never had 3 sides in history. Having 3 sides (free for all) is a recipe for a mess.

How mexican standoff works is described best in the Tarantino movie "Reservoir Dogs". The sneaky one is always a winner.

3 way battles will encourage waiting and hiding and will change dynamics where last one and sneakiest one wins, this is not the behavior we want to motivate and encourage.

There is also a post from admin in which he states a problem determining winners in a multi-sided battle, but I can't find it anymore.

So first admin has to be convinced to take a look. Then after the look and realization of complexities, we'll have to convince him to take another look.

And then hopefully devs will be able to address this "shortcoming" of the combat engine.

Edited September 1, 2016 by Skully

[Lucas Corso]

I believe the OP is not talking about 3 sided battles but normal battles when allied nations join. I too would like to retain my national flag in those circumstances.

Edited September 1, 2016 by Lucien Delmonte

[Pelennor]

Sorry if I haven't be clear enough, English isn't my mother language : I m not talking about 3 sided battles.

 

I basically suggest a minor graphic modification concerning flags in battle.

[Skully]

I know, but it is all tied together.

 

Once you have multiple flags in battle, you have multiple sides on the conceptual level.

 

Since there is already a problem with alliances and not having multi sided battles, might as well try and tackle it properly. Otherwise you'll keep running into trouble within the pull circle.

[Skully]

To make it more explicit: on PvP1 France is allied with both Danmark-Norge and Sverige. Suppose a Dane attacks a Swede and a French is sailing within the tagging circle. Which side goes the French on?

 

The whole point of Alliances was to prevent situations like:

 

"Mon Dieu! Je levai le mauvais coleurs!"

"Wot? What's the bugger saying now?"

...

"He raised the wrong flag!?"

And there he was, sailing a British flag. Apparently he had blindly picked one from his cabinet.

"Tell him, if he wants his Victory, state his intentions to the British, give a prayer to his gods and bloody open fire!"

...

"D'accord, je vais vous donner un salut au canon et rentrer dans son pays."

Some shots where fired from the French Constitution missing their mark completely.

"He didn't pay for this? What is he going on about?"

And before we even got to the answer, the French Constitution broke off the engagement.

"..."

Mon Dieu! How can the gods expect the French to get alliances right!?

[Lucas Corso]

I think you are over analysing the original proposal. What is being asked for is a cosmetic change only, with the underlying mechanism kept the same. I do not know if this difficult or even possible, but it does no harm to ask!

Edited September 1, 2016 by Lucien Delmonte

[Skully]

I think you are over analysing the original proposal. What is being asked for is a cosmetic change only, with the underlying mechanism kept the same. I do not know if this difficult or even possible, but it does no harm to ask!

Up until the moment the Tribunal opens up by either Sverige or Danish Captain demanding justice as they got shot by a ship sailing a French flag.