Pirate Mechanics Vote

[worst2first]

I am a new player but I want the game to be as close to historical reality as possible while still being fun. I support Blackie's suggestions.

 

While there were Pirate settlements they were rare and were often in disputed / unclaimed territory or in areas unknown to the national navies. Perhaps a mechanic could be developed where pirates are able to establish secret havens that aren't visible on the map to other players. They could be discoverable and once found, the pirates would either have to relocate or risk the destruction of their haven. This could lead to a fun game of cat and mouse with national navies hunting out pirate havens only to have them pop up somewhere else.  I don't know if that would work but I do not want to see the pirate faction just a renamed faction that functions exactly the same as the others.

 

I also don't think pirates should be building 1st and 2nd rate ships. Pirates relied on speed, cunning, and ruthlessness. I'd like to see the game find ways to allow pirates to play in a style similar to real pirates. In my opinion, the pirate faction should kind of be a prestige class that is very challenging but fun with unique game play mechanics.

[drogoran]

http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/10656-what-if-pirates-were-the-neutral-team/page-1#entry189103

gets my vote

 

if they intend to keep pirates as a nation that is probably the best way to do it

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

and nats shouldn't be able to capture ships at all.

No thanks. That "feature" was the absolute worst idea ever in PotBS.

[ShadyMonk]

Why should you limit any faction at all?
What Nation A is able to do, so should Nation B.
It just happened that Pirats are considered a Nation like Neutral is also a Nation and without major attribute settings to ALL Nations I don't see why Pirates should be limited in any way.

[drogoran]

No thanks. That "feature" was the absolute worst idea ever in PotBS.

well removing the ability of nationals to USE the captured ships would put a stop to the in my view issue of people capturing ships to use as risk free throwaway cannon fodder

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

then stop asking to nerf pirates b/c nats wouldn't just capture boats for themselves.

 

Privateers would, most certainly.  I've been an advocate for the need to have reputation with the Admiralty as a Naval Captain, whereby you follow orders, are assigned a ship with extremely inexpensive repairs, and that ship gets better the more you follow missions, destroy the enemy, and/or send captures to the Admiralty.  Privateers would pay cash for their ships, be limited to a maximum ship size, and could keep/sell what they captured.

 

That said, I want pirates to be pirates, not a nation with a black flag.  I think it's time to just rename y'all to Neutral, change the flag accordingly, and call it a day.  

[Black Bart]

Why should you limit any faction at all?

What Nation A is able to do, so should Nation B.

It just happened that Pirats are considered a Nation like Neutral is also a Nation and without major attribute settings to ALL Nations I don't see why Pirates should be limited in any way.

 

well because have you not noticed when you create a toon on a nation, nations goes from (Easy-Very hard) !!! there is NOTHING that are diffrent from any nation atm... all are equal, it just happens to be that pirates have large player base because "Hollywood"   either they should remove that "skill" req for a nation or rework nations, wich i hope !! because nations need to have up´s and down´s compared to others.  els its just comes down to wanna play the most carebear nation..

[Haratik]

well removing the ability of nationals to USE the captured ships would put a stop to the in my view issue of people capturing ships to use as risk free throwaway cannon fodder

It's only risk free throwaway blah blah blah if you don't mount any quality mods on it. Otherwise the description doesn't match.

Not allowing capture of ships by an organized nation is extremely laughable and deserves a Leo Caprio meme.

[Vandarix]

Privateers would, most certainly.  I've been an advocate for the need to have reputation with the Admiralty as a Naval Captain, whereby you follow orders, are assigned a ship with extremely inexpensive repairs, and that ship gets better the more you follow missions, destroy the enemy, and/or send captures to the Admiralty.  Privateers would pay cash for their ships, be limited to a maximum ship size, and could keep/sell what they captured.

 

That said, I want pirates to be pirates, not a nation with a black flag.  I think it's time to just rename y'all to Neutral, change the flag accordingly, and call it a day.  

Exactly Privateers would send to admiralty and have to request permission to take hold of the ship. Meaning No you wouldn't be able to just capture there would be a ranking and earning process.

 

If They nerf pirates for "Realism" They better do the exact same thing to nats.

 

Also Privs didn't sail 1st and 2nd and pretty sure third rates. So, that realism would be on par with nerfing pirates ability to sail them.

Edited February 21, 2016 by Vandarix

[Poe]

Course the "reality" is that 1-3rd rates were like unicorns in the Caribbean.

 

If they want reality we would all be in sloops, brigs and the occasional frigate anyway.  But that isn't the reality they want...

 

I personal think pirates should be something you earn, not something you click.  Join a nation, murder 12 friendly's and you get to be a pirate.

 

Pirates can false flag and dock and sell anywhere at a loss (they are fencing stolen goods) they should also get some bonus to break down ships (extra crap) to offset the price hit they would take to craft.

 

You could maybe spend some stupid money and buy your way back into some nations favor, but it would have to be whatever the under pop (and thus desperate) nation was.

 

Pirates can sail whatever they can steal, if they could gather enough shit to build a first rate, with as much as it would cost them in addition, hey whatever.

 

That said, pirates should raid ports for a cash and commodity payout and not capture or defend shit.

 

Course I also think they should get rid of the NPC's and make people earn the xp from pvp... So I may be cray cray.

 

Just my take on it.

[Haratik]

First rate vessels were certainly rare. Second rate, uncommon. Third rates were not, however. There was plenty of fighting to be done in the region between the organized powers of the day, and I'm aware of quite a few battles that were fought in the Caribbean that included line ships larger than fourth rates.

Not trying to nitpick, just set the record straight for the misinformed and the uneducated ????

[Black Bart]

i dont care what they do, but something need to be done with pirates, no point in calling the nation "Very hard" when all are equal... fix this !  make something simple but would effect all in the nation. just make them diffrent and "hard" so carebears and hollywood wannabes gonna leave that nation

[Zisme]

Wow the Pirate bashing is crazy...lets nerf them..then lests nerf the US...they had 4 ships made that had 100 guns..and they never sailed the caribbean they went over to the Mediterranean.Should the game regulate you to a Fourth Rate only? If the Devs wanted the Pirates to be special they would have been that way to start..they are like any other nation..but with a black flag.  

[Haratik]

Wow the Pirate bashing is crazy...lets nerf them..then lests nerf the US...they had 4 ships made that had 100 guns..and they never sailed the caribbean they went over to the Mediterranean.Should the game regulate you to a Fourth Rate only? If the Devs wanted the Pirates to be special they would have been that way to start..they are like any other nation..but with a black flag.

There's not much you can do to nerf the US. True, their line of battle was never as powerful as the more established nations of Europe, and only a few ships launched ever saw service. However, only one or two American ships of the line were ever pierced for or carried more than 90 guns, the rest mostly mounted anywhere from 74-86. Also, those ships of the line that did serve, were not only in the Mediterranean, but also off the coast of Africa and in the Pacific Squadron as well. At least one such ship of the line, the Independence, also saw brief service in the Gulf of Mexico, off of Veracruz, which, if I'm not mistaken, rests in what we call Caribbean waters. Also take note that part of the ingame's current map includes the Eastern Seaboard from what is now Florida all the way up to Virginia. So why would the US be nerfed from a historic area of operations hmm?

Lastly, why do people continue to believe that pirates ever existed as a nation? The ignorance is astounding! I blame Hollywood.

[Zisme]

I don'y believe it was a nation...and Never said it was.But in the game it is and we should leave it at that. ...but since you want pirates to sail ships they historically did ..then lets have the US as well.infactwhy let any nation sail ships they didn't produce..if you want it you have to take it as a prize...but you are right my ignorance is crazy......

Edited February 22, 2016 by Zisme

[worst2first]

I would have no problems with nations being restricted to ships they actually used but think about how many ship models the devs would have to create. I'm not sure that's realistic.

 

I suggested some mechanics that would allow pirates to have interesting but different game play mechanics from the other nations.

 

If the Devs wanted the Pirates to be special they would have been that way to start..they are like any other nation..but with a black flag.

 

 

 

You do realize this is an alpha and many parts of the game are nothing more than placeholders right?     

[Zisme]

This is not in alpha anymore...this is an open beta game.

[Black Bart]

This is not in alpha anymore...this is an open beta game.

 

nahh... think you need to read up on the game mate..  there is a reason "pirates" have (Very-Hard)  there has not been implantet anything nation stats..  all are equal atm, so they gonna change that.

[KrakkenSmacken]

I we are stuck to raiding, then we need to be able to try to impersonate as honest traders (fly the flags) and dock where we please.

 

No magic (Hey this guy is a pirate) in the selection window.  

 

You see the flag, and unless you recognize the ship (ships should have names distinct from the player), or get close enough to observe the captain (player name),  then the pirate gets into the port and can do some business.

 

Now I realize that with durability there could be a maximum of 15 ships captured(copied) from a single 5 durability hull, so that reporting a ship (name) as captured would involve some risk if you had durability left. It would still be a more interesting way for us pirates to try to sneak around being all pirate like and stuff if we could impersonate any nation.

[Vega]

They're lucky they get such toys. There are plenty here that remember how it was on PotBS. The only ship larger than a frigate that could be legitimately crafted was the Poseidon. The Hyperion and the Wenden refit (can't be bothered to remember the name, I preferred frigates) were the only ships of the line that pirates could access without capturing them first. That is, until Portalus started doing their premium slide to oblivion and added a 2nd rate refit.

If the combat mechanic for pirate vs pirate gets smoothed out, and access to ships of the line gets drastically limited, the outcry will be great, but I have a feeling that instead of quitting, you'll see a majority of those players fleshing out other nations, or bloating already fattened nations like GB, or USA, and the only players remaining pirate being the hardcore minority.

 

As one that remembers well PotBS, I couldn't have put it better. I'd be staying pirate and pretty happy about it. I would just suggest that any big changes to pirates be made before the official release (though I don't think they'll happen, from Admin's point of view), because if they happen after the release, then all hell will surely break loose. I think limiting at least crafted 1st and 2nd rates and getting us restrictions on diplomacy would be a nice start already. I'd rather have those restrictions and some fun perks than be part of a nation, but again thats just me. Here's to hoping, anyway.

Edited February 24, 2016 by Vega

[Sarversauce]

This is a simple vote, asking two main questions. Pirate Port Capture/Raiding and Pirate Crafting. I have set out the questions so that it will be very easy to determine as a community, where to draw the theoretical line.

Yes, Pirates would still be able to obtain SOL's (through capture and trading). Yes, a Pirate could make another account and use it as a crafter. However, it would make the appearance of SOL's for Pirates a much rarer thing, as well as increase the value of it to the faction.

 If Pirates aren't ever allowed to take and hold Ports, Pirates should be able to make their own "Pirate Haven" on a plot or parcel of shore line any where in the world. If you want it to be more accurate to the actual history of the world, then give Pirates a place to make their own Homes.  It would be VERY cool for Pirates to set up their own Hide Outs on shore so we have places to Raid and launch attacks from.  We would also require Letters of Marque so we can be included in Port Battles.

I'm just saying this in response to the possible National players (who are more numerous than Pirates) who will typically rally behind a "Nerf Pirates in RvR" philosophy. Because that's what happened in PotbS. There were 3x as many Nationals than Pirates, and their tear drops filled an ocean compared to Pirates when it came to getting game changes from the Community.  I'm wary of that happening here.

[Amendus]

Like I said many times, a great solution is this:

 

Each port generates taxes, for normal nations this creates competition between clans. Pirates however can fight eachother so they should be able to capture their own ports. This will create fierce competition between clans.

[Natan]

I'm all for the pirate restrictions if we get buffs to compensate, Special crafting, battle buffs, etc.

[Eishen]

Plainly , a Pirate "nation" as currently  in game is simply an absurd idea.  Pirates crafting anything is a closely second to that one btw

 

For playability having free ports more than cover pirate needs , "pirate ports" are really not needed (btw neither historical) , tortuga is best represented by a free port .

 

If some "end game" is needed personally will make pirate conquered/raided ports revert to neutral ,  give access to pirates to neutral ports , forbiding outpost building on them.

 

It will make life harder for pirates? SURE, but hey that is in the very hearth of the concepy pirate "no  quarter" attitude.

 

Pirates should be game´s hard mode. 

[Eishen]

.......

 

No magic (Hey this guy is a pirate) in the selection window.  

 

You see the flag, and unless you recognize the ship (ships should have names distinct from the player), or get close enough to observe the captain (player name),  then the pirate gets into the port and can do some business.

 

.....

 

 

An interesting option could be letting pirates choose the flag they want, but marking as "contraband" to allow players from that nation attack, combined with not showing "contraband" in any ship (IA included) until they are ant engagement (attack circle) range