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BrutishVulgarian

Ships speed at different points of sail

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This is the speed of ships at different points of sail, with no cannons.  I'll add more ships.

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The question mark for "head to the wind" means speed kept fluctuating, but it seemed more forward than backward.  
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Brigs updated 3/6/2015
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Nice one!

Would have been better to have the values in a polar speed diagram without the distracting ship icons though.

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Thanks for this, I've been going back to my favorite ships and learning their quirks and simply enjoying them. Keep it up!

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Interesting that taking the cannons off increases speed on beamreach but not downwind.

Edited by Prater

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Interesting that taking the cannons off increases speed on beamreach but not downwind.

Makes sense. Removing all that weight high above the waterline will make a vessel stiffer, and heeling creates a lot of drag.

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It seems counter intuitive that a fore and aft close hauled is faster than in broad reach... and even more that it is faster than in reaching.

I do acknowledge their superiority over a square rigger, which is much slower close hauled, and that running is slow because of wind shadowing... but I have to question travelling faster up-wind in most conditions.

I have found one modern yacht polar which seemed faster in close hauled than in reach and broad reach, but the majority are symmetrical (with the additional option of flying more jibs, spannakers etc in reach and running*) or slightly faster with rather than into the wind. **With additional sail area reaching and running are potentially much faster with these sail types. Obviously the polar of a modern yacht may have little to do with a schooner rig, or yacht rig from this era, but I'd still expect the schooner to be the same or faster downwind than up (and faster in reaching than running by a significant amount)... They will still "fly away" from square riggers on broad reach and close hauled, but without it seeming exaggerated.

 

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It seems counter intuitive that a fore and aft close hauled is faster than in broad reach... and even more that it is faster than in reaching.

I do acknowledge their superiority over a square rigger, which is much slower close hauled, and that running is slow because of wind shadowing... but I have to question travelling faster up-wind in most conditions.

I have found one modern yacht polar which seemed faster in close hauled than in reach and broad reach, but the majority are symmetrical (with the additional option of flying more jibs, spannakers etc in reach and running*) or slightly faster with rather than into the wind. **With additional sail area reaching and running are potentially much faster with these sail types. Obviously the polar of a modern yacht may have little to do with a schooner rig, or yacht rig from this era, but I'd still expect the schooner to be the same or faster downwind than up (and faster in reaching than running by a significant amount)... They will still "fly away" from square riggers on broad reach and close hauled, but without it seeming exaggerated.

 

That depends what the actual angle of broad reach is, I suppose. And how far the booms can sheet out.

 

I won't pretend to know much about schooner performance, but many fast square-rigged frigates could achieve close-hauled speeds only 2-3 knots slower than their best speed sailing large (broad reach). So it's not unreasonable to imagine that a schooner or cutter would be similarly disposed to upwind sailing. Certainly many of them have reason to misbehave with the wind on the quarter.

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It seems counter intuitive that a fore and aft close hauled is faster than in broad reach... and even more that it is faster than in reaching.

I do acknowledge their superiority over a square rigger, which is much slower close hauled, and that running is slow because of wind shadowing... but I have to question travelling faster up-wind in most conditions.

I have found one modern yacht polar which seemed faster in close hauled than in reach and broad reach, but the majority are symmetrical (with the additional option of flying more jibs, spannakers etc in reach and running*) or slightly faster with rather than into the wind. **With additional sail area reaching and running are potentially much faster with these sail types. Obviously the polar of a modern yacht may have little to do with a schooner rig, or yacht rig from this era, but I'd still expect the schooner to be the same or faster downwind than up (and faster in reaching than running by a significant amount)... They will still "fly away" from square riggers on broad reach and close hauled, but without it seeming exaggerated.

 

That's one of the reasons I'm posting these, I can't visualize what the best points of sail for a fore and aft vessel with a "perfect" keel should be.    It probably "feels" faster when sailing close hauled, with the wind in your face and all, but it's been so long since I sailed, I no longer remember.

Cerberus

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I ask you, how can a ship no one has ever heard of, before this game, outpace the noble USS Constitution?  'Murica!

Only in freedom hating directions.

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It seems counter intuitive that a fore and aft close hauled is faster than in broad reach... and even more that it is faster than in reaching.

I do acknowledge their superiority over a square rigger, which is much slower close hauled, and that running is slow because of wind shadowing... but I have to question travelling faster up-wind in most conditions.

I have found one modern yacht polar which seemed faster in close hauled than in reach and broad reach, but the majority are symmetrical (with the additional option of flying more jibs, spannakers etc in reach and running*) or slightly faster with rather than into the wind. **With additional sail area reaching and running are potentially much faster with these sail types. Obviously the polar of a modern yacht may have little to do with a schooner rig, or yacht rig from this era, but I'd still expect the schooner to be the same or faster downwind than up (and faster in reaching than running by a significant amount)... They will still "fly away" from square riggers on broad reach and close hauled, but without it seeming exaggerated.

 

In a general sense modern rigs are still faster on a broad reach than close hauled. Also while modern rigs have spinnakers for downwind sailing, the schooners in game have square sails - and some could also set stuns'ls when sailing large.  

 

That depends what the actual angle of broad reach is, I suppose. And how far the booms can sheet out.

 

I won't pretend to know much about schooner performance, but many fast square-rigged frigates could achieve close-hauled speeds only 2-3 knots slower than their best speed sailing large (broad reach). So it's not unreasonable to imagine that a schooner or cutter would be similarly disposed to upwind sailing. Certainly many of them have reason to misbehave with the wind on the quarter.

 

One point to add about fore & aft rigged ships upwind performance is that they could sail much closer to the wind than a square rigged ship. Square rigged ships normally could only sail to about 65 degrees on the wind, whereas fore & aft rigs sail to about 45 degrees. I noted that the speed diagrams are marked as 45 degrees so I thought I'd point that out. Not sure how well this is implemented in game partly due to the exaggeration of the effect of the stays'ls as has been brought up before.

 

This is an effect that should have an impact in the open world when ships are sailing longer distances. Fore & aft rigs sailing upwind would have to tack less and sail a shorter course to their destination than a square rigged ship. Of course this is why trade routes developed with following winds and why schooners were a popular design on the east coast of the US.

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I knew the ST was that fast, I thought the Victory was slower than that though.  Do remember that this is without the guns on board.

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The Brigs are way too fast now.  Seriously they shouldn't be faster than Frigates, not enough sail to accomplish that.

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Brutish, can you update the list? I think just Navy Brig and Brig needs to be changed. Thanks :D

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