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If you remove the in game economy then traders stop trading, the trader hunters stop sailing because they can not find traders, the PvP'ers get less action in OW and stop going out into OW. So this forces me to:

23 minutes ago, Beeekonda said:

u mad?

1+

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5 minutes ago, ashley said:

This happened when Ratt came out as well, everyone complained and said the game is gonna die.

Seems every DLC comes with a free helping of salt.

The rattv/leopard killed the aggy.

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Just now, Beeekonda said:

idk unless they are poods or bloomfields they are not needed as DLC (cuz then nobody gonna buy then) which will create more salty topics

Any special cannons, longs, or carros would be welcome in a Cannon DLC.

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On 1/31/2020 at 10:02 AM, Beeekonda said:

idk unless they are poods or bloomfields they are not needed as DLC (cuz then nobody gonna buy then) which will create more salty topics

People buy fewer ships because they now have DLC ships. Once we have DLC ships for every rate, there will be almost no need for ship crafters. (Assumimg most people have DLC ships)

Every cannon type should be enabled on the cannon DLC just like every wood type is available to ship DLCs. People will naturally pick the best options but at least they are given the illusion of a choice.

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On 1/31/2020 at 8:00 AM, Yoha said:

If we have ship DLC, then I don't see the problem with having Cannon DLC. Cannons are a much smaller part of the in game economy than shipbuilding is.

Depends on your metric.  Cannons and Reps are frequently crafted, bought, and sold.  Perhaps more often than ships.  Aside from DLCs, many ships are very easy to obtain.  I've never built a ship but bought lots from the Admiralty.  They are cheap.  I've sold the majority of the Admiralty ships, and always for more than I buy them.  I've sold hundreds of thousands of reps, and some lads have a great business selling cannons.  It's a lot of fun.  I've spent exponentially more on repairs.  Even with all of the ships I've lost I've likely made more on selling ships than I've spent on them.

Many players craft most of their ships themselves or get them from their clan.

Be a shame to remove the opportunities from crafting cannons (or reps): it would eliminate a huge amount of content.

Not all ships can be purchased as added content.  DLCs are healthy for GameLab's cash flow, but let's not go overboard because we are bitter that disposable ships can be redeemed daily.

Edited by Macjimm
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Crafting in the game became obsolete when they redid it 3 years. We had to craft all the materials for the ships, gather and "assemble" them at the final crafting port. Now you use the raw resources, and really don't get the same feeling, it also took away a huge market for traders that wanted to compete in selling stuff needed for crafting like iron ingots, furnitures, barrels, knees, carriages etc. It was a really immersive system, yes it took maybe 10 clicks and you would have to wait 5 minutes to be done with all the crafting. But it has worked for games like WoW for 16 years.

This also created a natural link with the players doing different stuff, trying to arrange certain markets and plans for ships. Now you can literally login > click harvest (whatever wood or hemp etc you want) > and craft the ship. You can say its good for gameplay as you get ships out faster for the guys that mostly want to fight, but it take away a big immersive part of the game, which should IMO be important in a Age of Sail game, which is trying to be as immersive and realistic as possible although keeping it playable. What could have been done is some kind of hybrid of the two systems, if you had the raw materials you could craft the ship, which would take you through the crafting process of all the sub object of a ship, and you could still also 

Now to swing back on topic, i personally don't like the dlc's we have imo they should be cosmetics, but since we already have them they should be craftable through permits ingame (think the Redoutable is like this, since i've seen people have several in their ports). I dont think a cannon dlc would be good, because what cannons should be dlc, it would limit the small amount of trading and economy between players that are still trying to make a business out of  it, and would create the game even more shallow imo

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4 minutes ago, erelkivtuadrater said:

Crafting in the game became obsolete when they redid it 3 years. We had to craft all the materials for the ships, gather and "assemble" them at the final crafting port. Now you use the raw resources, and really don't get the same feeling, it also took away a huge market for traders that wanted to compete in selling stuff needed for crafting like iron ingots, furnitures, barrels, knees, carriages etc. It was a really immersive system, yes it took maybe 10 clicks and you would have to wait 5 minutes to be done with all the crafting. But it has worked for games like WoW for 16 years.

This also created a natural link with the players doing different stuff, trying to arrange certain markets and plans for ships. Now you can literally login > click harvest (whatever wood or hemp etc you want) > and craft the ship. You can say its good for gameplay as you get ships out faster for the guys that mostly want to fight, but it take away a big immersive part of the game, which should IMO be important in a Age of Sail game, which is trying to be as immersive and realistic as possible although keeping it playable. What could have been done is some kind of hybrid of the two systems, if you had the raw materials you could craft the ship, which would take you through the crafting process of all the sub object of a ship, and you could still also 

Now to swing back on topic, i personally don't like the dlc's we have imo they should be cosmetics, but since we already have them they should be craftable through permits ingame (think the Redoutable is like this, since i've seen people have several in their ports). I dont think a cannon dlc would be good, because what cannons should be dlc, it would limit the small amount of trading and economy between players that are still trying to make a business out of  it, and would create the game even more shallow imo

The intermediate goods crafting was a great idea that provided depth to the economy, but it ultimately didn't give rise to a large group of merchant players, as clans generally just handled it all internally anyway. I built a rather large trading company in GB at the time, supplying multiple active clans, and most of what I sold was still the raw materials (logs, ore, etc), not the intermediate goods. So I understand why the devs did away with it.

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The old crafting system was indeed very good for immersion and I agree it's sad to be gone (people also accumulated crafting experience when doing parts only, that has vanished). Now that we have a growing number of DLC ships ready for immediate use, maybe it is time to revert to the immersive crafting system. Because the argument "guys do not want to have a clickfest, they want fast action with a ship" isn't true anymore - for this there is a variety of DLC choices now. Or purchases from shops. Shipwrights need a new appreciation, as they more and more become meaningless as stated by others in this thread.

--

However, I am not optimistic it will happen because one of the rules of current politics of devs is, not to take away anything from players they already got. And they got lazy fast crafting now. :(

Edited by Cetric de Cornusiac
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Just disallow port bonuses on redeemable ships. Let them keep their seasoned woods, but leave port bonuses exclusively to crafted ships.

It makes sense, too: the DLC ships have the in-game moniker of "imported". Why would an imported ship (sailed from Europe, presumably) get a port bonus for a Caribbean port if it wasn't built there?

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4 minutes ago, GrubbyZebra said:

The intermediate goods crafting was a great idea that provided depth to the economy, but it ultimately didn't give rise to a large group of merchant players, as clans generally just handled it all internally anyway. I built a rather large trading company in GB at the time, supplying multiple active clans, and most of what I sold was still the raw materials (logs, ore, etc), not the intermediate goods. So I understand why the devs did away with it.

i experienced it in another way. I remember when i wanted to craft ships, i kept say materials for the ship hull in Belize, and i bought canvas rolls and cordage and oakum from the shop because it made it easier for me then to haul it from misteriosa, it created a market, and i could contact that player if he wanted to provide me with more materials later on for deliveries etc.

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15 minutes ago, erelkivtuadrater said:

i experienced it in another way. I remember when i wanted to craft ships, i kept say materials for the ship hull in Belize, and i bought canvas rolls and cordage and oakum from the shop because it made it easier for me then to haul it from misteriosa, it created a market, and i could contact that player if he wanted to provide me with more materials later on for deliveries etc.

I wasn't saying there wasn't a market. I sold my excess intermediate goods on the open markets, as well.

I'm saying there wasn't a significant enough market to keep supporting it. If they had found a way to organically encourage mid-level crafting, then it would have been different, but when everybody can craft anything easily, then the intermediate goods market becomes redundant.

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3 hours ago, The Geth said:

Just disallow port bonuses on redeemable ships. Let them keep their seasoned woods, but leave port bonuses exclusively to crafted ships.

It makes sense, too: the DLC ships have the in-game moniker of "imported". Why would an imported ship (sailed from Europe, presumably) get a port bonus for a Caribbean port if it wasn't built there?

Because it is believed to have an European port bonus which is considered to be superior to anything produced in the colonies?

(Just assuming 'port boni' don't have to be necessarily connected to the place where you redeem your ship, thus no correlation to port investments there)

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1 hour ago, Cetric de Cornusiac said:

Because it is believed to have an European port bonus which is considered to be superior to anything produced in the colonies?

(Just assuming 'port boni' don't have to be necessarily connected to the place where you redeem your ship, thus no correlation to port investments there)

As far as I can tell, the port bonuses are in fact connected to the port in which you redeem the ship: redeeming a ship in a port with no investments will always result in no bonuses.

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28 minutes ago, The Geth said:

As far as I can tell, the port bonuses are in fact connected to the port in which you redeem the ship: redeeming a ship in a port with no investments will always result in no bonuses.

Are you still talking about DLC redeemables? I do. And they do not depend on local port boni. I should know, because I redeem DLC all the time, have no port, and still get my port boni - randomly.

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By not having a cannon DLC, it forces players who don't want to do econ, to have to do some econ or mooch cannons from friends. A cannon DLC would allow players to equip their ship (DLC ship or crafted) and avoid econ if they wish to do so.

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1 hour ago, Cetric de Cornusiac said:

Are you still talking about DLC redeemables? I do. And they do not depend on local port boni. I should know, because I redeem DLC all the time, have no port, and still get my port boni - randomly.

Strange, the few times I've done this result in no bonuses. I don't know, could've been a fluke I suppose.

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