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I wanted to ask the developers if it is planned to introduce some other Spanish line ship (I remember winning the survey years ago)

hehe sorry I don't know much English. I just hope we can see more Spanish heavy ships. we only have the santisima

USA didn't build any first rate in the NA timeframe. I can't remember any dutch first rate of the late XVIII century, maybe because of shallow waters. The game has already a few russian ship

I think the devs should add the Spanish as well as more ships of other nations. That includes Russian, German or US ships...I would rather have a wide variety of beautiful ships rather than worry about geographical "immersion"...everyone has a different take on "immersion". 

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3 minutes ago, Yoha said:

I think the devs should add the Spanish as well as more ships of other nations. That includes Russian, German or US ships...I would rather have a wide variety of beautiful ships rather than worry about geographical "immersion"...everyone has a different take on "immersion". 

US ships already in the game:

USS Niagara

Rattlesnake

Prince de neufchatel

USS Constitution

USS United States

________

As to the germans, they didn't build that many ships and they already got the Wappen in game. 

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2 minutes ago, Lars Kjaer said:

US ships already in the game:

USS Niagara

Rattlesnake

Prince de neufchatel

USS Constitution

USS United States

________

As to the germans, they didn't build that many ships and they already got the Wappen in game. 

So if a nation already has at least 1 ship in game, no more are needed?

Both the Connie and USS are essentially the same ship, and are not particularly very good at being 3rd rates. The rest are small ships.

I would like to see more line ships of EVERY nation, and I think my previous posts on the matter have made this clear. That includes Russian, German, and US ships even though some people may dislike it due to their geographical "immersion" purism.

New Dutch ships great! New Spanish, great! Portugese ... why not!

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5 minutes ago, Montagnes said:

5 US ships.

4 Russian ships.

2 spanish ships. One of them, impossible to craft.

 

Enough said.

What is the BR total for each of those nations?

A Niagara does not hold the same significance as a Santi. That being said, I'm cool with more Spanish ships because they are very beautiful ships. Maybe get them some smaller rated ships to balance their tree out.

Edited by Yoha
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2 minutes ago, hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh33333 said:

That ship has absolutely no place in game unless it was to be artificially nerfed beyond any realistic representation. Even excluding the shell guns it was armed with, the standardised 32lbs across all decks still have a broadside weight far beyond any other ship of the line in the game, this advantage is only magnified if we consider only decent penning calibres. Theres plenty of other earlier ship of the lines from the 32lbs on all deck era that would still far surpass everything currently in game and be utterly broken, yet alone choosing a later one with shell guns. It may well have been designed and built over a long period thats within the games era but its eventual completion date and associated ordnance certainly does not fit.

I would be ok with a gun nerf, they have tweaked plenty of other ships' gun payloads so far. If they left it around the broadside weight of a L'Ocean or Santi it would be appropriate. 

We all know they tweak the armor values on the ships for balance-ish.

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5 minutes ago, hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh33333 said:

I would like to see hms dreadnaught in game as well so long as they give it a broadside weight similar to L'Ocean or Santi and tweak the armour values /s

Well that ship would be WAY outside of the Naval Action time period while the USS Pennsylvania 1837 is at the very end of the Naval Action time period.

Edited by Yoha
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2 hours ago, Yoha said:

What is the BR total for each of those nations?

A Niagara does not hold the same significance as a Santi. That being said, I'm cool with more Spanish ships because they are very beautiful ships. Maybe get them some smaller rated ships to balance their tree out.

You do know that the US didn't really have a navy in this timezone right?

I don't wanna see fantasy ships ingame.

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1 hour ago, hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh33333 said:

It was sarcasm, the point being yes most the ships in na have had their gun loadouts and armour values tweaked for balance; often being equipped with the strongest guns they had during their service. A ship that needs its weakest historical armament considerably nerfed (in overall weight, individual gundeck calibres and the total exclusion of its shell guns) to even be on a level playing field with the strongest 1st rates in game, is not one thats appropriate for balance 'tweaking'. That is before even considering the artificial nerfs that would be needed to compensate for over half a century (compared to victory/santi) of structural and sailing improvements. The result would be a ship in game that in no way represents its historical capabilities.

It doesn't have to be true to history, it just has to be balanced. The devs have deviated a lot from history in order to make so many ships from different times be somewhat balanced. I don't see why they can't do it some more. 

The Santi and other first rates were still competitive in the early to mid 1800s.

By all means I think the devs should add other ships than the USS Penn first, but it would be nice for there to be a ship of every rate for each nation eventually.

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4 minutes ago, Lars Kjaer said:

You do know that the US didn't really have a navy in this timezone right?

I don't wanna see fantasy ships ingame.

The US had a navy starting in 1776...you know, the same time period as many of the famous ships in NA...like the HMS Victory (1765), and before even the L'Ocean (1790). 

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2 hours ago, hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh33333 said:

I would like to see hms dreadnaught in game as well so long as they give it a broadside weight similar to L'Ocean or Santi and tweak the armour values /s

This one, I presume?
https://threedecks.org/index.php?display_type=show_ship&id=121
or this one?
https://threedecks.org/index.php?display_type=show_ship&id=3987

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Getting back on topic...

More Spanish ships would be nice too...especially since the poll indicated most people wanted it.

I just hope the devs don't ignore all the other beautiful tall ships that were not necessarily present in the Caribbean or not part of more famous navies at the time.

 

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1 hour ago, hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh33333 said:

 

1 hour ago, hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh33333 said:

The 1906 one! :) a sarcastic example to illustrate how ridiculous adding a ship like the 1837 USS Pennsylvania would be. Needing a totally made up armament, far far weaker than it was historically equipped with, with a nerfed sailing profile and armour to make it remotely balanced relative to the other 1st rates in game, some of which are well over half a century older.

Both the ships you linked are good examples of ones appropriate for the time frame naval action

Do you realize how many of the ships in game don't have their true historical armament? The only reason the USS Penn had the next gen of cannons was because its construction was delayed due to budget issues.

If the devs ever decide to add a US first rate (USS Penn) then I'm 100% with them using the in game gun system rather than adding more modern cannons.

Edited by Yoha
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Lets take a look at some other ships from the same year, as bases for consideration if this might be to late a date for beeing included into NA:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rainbow_(1837_ship)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Gorgon_(1837)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Sirius_(1837)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Great_Western

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Fulton_(1837)

Edited by Durin
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4 minutes ago, Durin said:

Lets take a look at some other ships from the same year, as bases for consideration if this might be to late a date for beeing included into NA:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rainbow_(1837_ship)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Gorgon_(1837)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Sirius_(1837)

Galleys were still being used in the 18th and 19th century. Many tall ships were in service well into the latter half of the 19th century.

Should we remove any ship that was in use during Galleys and after steam power? If the devs want to give us a concrete date range of ships they will only consider, that would clear up some of the debate.

Let's get the more famous ships in the game first and then round out each nation with at least 1 ship of each rate. 

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12 hours ago, Yoha said:

Should we remove any ship that was in use during Galleys and after steam power?

No, we should have older ships in the game, no question about that. But for steamage technology? absolutly not!

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39 minutes ago, Durin said:

No, we should have older ships in the game, no question about that. But for steamage technology? absolutly not!

thats not what he said

 

he is saying there were sail ships still used when steam became the main power source. which is true. IE clippers

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57 minutes ago, BoatyMcBoatFace said:

thats not what he said

Yeah, and there where also wooden sailing ships layed down and build during the steam age, using modern fabrication methods like industrialy forged iron knees, machine planed planks, iron masts and steel cables for rigging ;)

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38 minutes ago, Durin said:

Yeah, and there where also wooden sailing ships layed down and build during the steam age, using modern fabrication methods like industrialy forged iron knees, machine planed planks, iron masts and steel cables for rigging ;)

None of which have any actual effect on anything other than durability in the real world, unless you can provide evidence that somehow those ships went faster because of machined planks vs hand cut ones.

 

Or any other criteria you want to have a go at. 

 

The big picture here is that the age a ship was laid should not be an automatic disqualifier for inclusion unless one can find data supporting that it had actual advantage over a ship 20 years prior it. Picking an arbitrary number and claiming everything after that point is too modern is a fallacy. 

 

 

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The current timeframe is 1715(Ingermanland) to 1814 (Hercules) right?

Dont you think there are enough awesome ships in this timeframe so we dont need to consider far more modern vessels that would require to get nurfed af to make them work?

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