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Admiral Olsen

AI fleets attack traders on PvE

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18 minutes ago, CageyMoose said:

While I do understand the decision, the raiders did add a sense of tension while sailing in capital waters of other nations. As someone who lost a ship to raiders earlier today, I will miss seeing them removed. In the end, it was my own fault for not being more aware of the waters I was sailing in. As long as a player maintains situational awareness, the raiders, I feel are fine.

With respect to nations being at a tense peace, could the raiders not fly under some sort of pirate flag as a solution to that argument? Just a thought.

The removal is to solve the PVP problem as players can join on the side of privateers.  We know some tension is good for the Peace server. And pirates never signed any peace agreements. They will come back slightly reworked.

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5 minutes ago, captainhos said:

Yeah, that's all very well Admin, but I lost 4 good ships and 5 million reals in your little "experiment". Thanks for that.

That was not an experiment. Agressive AI in some form is absolutely necessary for immersion as Passive NPC turn the world into a static picture. 
They will come back in a different form to Peace (Pve server) some day (as pirates or raiders). 
They are removed to close the bug allowing players to enter those battles.

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I think youre forgetting that some players like a static picture. That's why they are in PvE in the first place. No stress, peaceful trading.

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Maybe if aggressive AI only operated close to shore, then the traders might have a chance. I was confronted by 11 ships, far out to sea, 5 of them 1st rates, the rest fast 3rd/4th/5th rates. how is this fair? You are in danger of losing the whole purpose of having two different servers. We will end up with PvP and PvPlight. A lot of players love to play your game without having to look over their shoulders all the time. At least you should give them the option to have their hard work destroyed in an instant... 

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uhhh

I actually thought I might escape these, even with how close they spawned, because this guy was kitted out to be fast.  then my escort rammed me, would not let up, turned me 225 degrees around from my original heading, left me in irons hit from all sides - sunk in seconds.

bye bye, super fast ship I liked.

yeah, I'm actually pro npc aggression, but this isn't fun at all.

Screenshot from 2019-12-05 00-19-09.png

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2 hours ago, captainhos said:

Yeah, that's all very well Admin, but I lost 4 good ships and 5 million reals in your little "experiment". Thanks for that.

Just pixels in a game. Lost also my ocean yesterday due explosion of an sinking ai. I didn't read that they removed fire shock. So u guessed he was just in fire. Went for it to loot (but didn't shot to risk the fire shock) I was next to the ai. Boooom.   All gone lol. Rip 6 Privateer chests.    But life moves on. Learn from it and do it better next time. Btw you can always drive away from the ai. They aren't clever at all. Also when I received a buff for them. They now sometimes angle there ships and try to avoid getting killed by only showing one boardside 

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1 hour ago, Lukas97Austria said:

 Btw you can always drive away from the ai. They aren't clever at all. 

Sorry, but you are wrong: You cannot drive away from them in open world. They are too fast and tag you anyway. But the worse thing is: Even if you can get away from them in the battle itsself and get out,  lets say one of your three traders, this trader will not be save, because he will be attacked immediately after the first battle is over by the same privateers as before. No chance to escape. If you got attacked by one this fleets you best tear down your sails and let them kill you. This is not "attacked by NPC", this is simply "destroyed by NPC". Ganking at its best ... done by NPC ... 

Edited by Merlinor
spelling mistake
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4 hours ago, admin said:

Это был не эксперимент. Агрессивный ИИ в той или иной форме абсолютно необходим для погружения, так как пассивные NPC превращают мир в статичную картину. 
Когда-нибудь они вернутся в мире, отличном от мира (Pve-сервер) (как пираты или рейдеры). 
Они удалены, чтобы закрыть ошибку, позволяющую игрокам вступать в эти битвы.

Наверное лучшее решение защитных вод было в первой попытке, очень очень давно до открытой альфы. Если помнишь у столицы стояли различные по наличию кораблей флоты и активировались, если подходили вражеские игроки. И у защитного флота не было бешеной скорости. Они просто отгоняли вражеских игроков от столичных вод. И как только вражеские игроки отходили, то защитный флот возвращался в места базирования.Да, была проблема, эти флоты активно фармили игроки ))).

Сэр из Техаса верно подметил, надо изменить составы рейдерских флотов. Убрать бешеную скорость, у игрока должна быть возможность уйти от преследующего НПС флота. И дать возможность входить защитному флоту в бои под столицами. Была же ранее такая функция у них. Правда вопрос с BR останется, тут нужно как то "успокаивать" защитный НПС флот. А то в небольшую стычку будут заходить все НПС флоты, до полного состава портовой битвы (25х...).

Также для PEACE сервера, наверное, были бы полезны небольшие каперские флотилии. Для поддержки тонуса и опыта игроков ))), но, это мое мнение. И разнообразия игры. При этом каперские флотилии это скорее 5 ранги, максимум 4. И скорее в небольшом количестве. Это же не флот Дрейка для разграбления.

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11 hours ago, admin said:

Attack will be switched off tomorrow or day after tomorrow on the Peace server. AI will consider effects of peace agreements just like all other players. 

this changing only about peace server? So on PvP foreign traders will be killed by Privatiers and this is ok? And trader coudnt dock in others capital?
@admin

Edited by OkiDokki

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Have been listening to a lot of people on the Peace server complaining about having aggressive AI...most of these people AFK sail so are not actually playing the game...the come back from time to time to see where their ships are but only want to trade and attack AI when it suits them...for them this game play acceptable and the content that they want...and they should be allowed to play this way and have the ability to opt out of any aggressive AI.

I welcome aggressive AI as I actually enjoy a challenge...but lets make is so that the player actually has a chance to survive the encounter and would be dependent upon their skills as a Captain...and base the fleets on the BR of the player fleet.  Just an idea.

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Dear Developers

 

Please consider the following Thoughts:

These fleets can only function properly in PvP in the way you are having them now, but not in PvE.

Let's take Gustavia, for example: In the immediate vicinity are Dutch, Prussian and British ports. If the action radius of these fleets remains as wide as now, players from these nations will no longer be able to go to their own ports. What if they operate shipyards or other buildings there?

A viable solution needs to be found and this solution must be very different from the one on PvP.

For example you can drastically reduce the radius around the nations capitals, to get out of this dilemma.

And they should be reduced in speed and fighting-power drastcally as well. In the moment this is not „agression“ but „slaughter“, because the attacked have no chance to escape. Even if they get out of the battle they get immediately reattacked by the same fleet. In the moment you are dead without any chance of salvation in a trader when you get attacked. So it is a dead sentence for your own ship, when you go nearer than 40k to a nations capital, exept you are in a ship which is small enough not the get attacked. .

 

Greetings Merlinor

 

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9 hours ago, Lukas97Austria said:

Just pixels in a game. Lost also my ocean yesterday due explosion of an sinking ai. I didn't read that they removed fire shock. So u guessed he was just in fire. Went for it to loot (but didn't shot to risk the fire shock) I was next to the ai. Boooom.   All gone lol. Rip 6 Privateer chests.    But life moves on. Learn from it and do it better next time. Btw you can always drive away from the ai. They aren't clever at all. Also when I received a buff for them. They now sometimes angle there ships and try to avoid getting killed by only showing one boardside 

It's not only pixels.  This is the worst argument I see around here.  In this game, more than any other I play, these "pixels" represent hours upon hours.  Of real life, that could be spent doing something that actually produced something of value.

Yes, life goes on, it's just a game.  But it's more than pixels, it's time spent.  When that is not respected by a game developer, the shop closes.

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Different people want different play-styles -- make it a win-win for everyone.  Many want to play in a system where the NPCs don't tackle you, leave that as default.  Change the functionality of the otherwise useless Loki Rune on the PvE server to be an 'opt-in' flag.  If you carry the Loki Rune in your cargo, you are opted in to being attacked by raiders/NPCs on the Open Sea.  Everyone gets to play the way they choose.  Problem solved. :)

 

Edited by Jonathan Latimer
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3 hours ago, CaptainCaveMan said:

Have been listening to a lot of people on the Peace server complaining about having aggressive AI...most of these people AFK sail so are not actually playing the game...

In their mind they are playing the game. They paid up to 40 dollars for the right to sail AFK. 

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Just now, Gregory Rainsborough said:

Why can I not afk sail in enemy waters any more? :(

If @Admin would give us lookouts...…."Sail Ho..."

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1 hour ago, Pad Seayew said:

It's not only pixels.  This is the worst argument I see around here.  In this game, more than any other I play, these "pixels" represent hours upon hours.  Of real life, that could be spent doing something that actually produced something of value.

Yes, life goes on, it's just a game.  But it's more than pixels, it's time spent.  When that is not respected by a game developer, the shop closes.

Time is valuable as it is finite to each person, however your "pixels" have no value what so ever...it is just a game, so you should be playing for fun and experience that you have when playing and interacting with other players...

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41 minutes ago, admin said:

n their mind they are playing the game. They paid up to 40 dollars for the right to sail AFK. 

WTF, 90% of war server is pve, how can you ‘concur’ that the peace server players are not playing the game when they are doing exactly the same thing, BS.

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1 hour ago, Angus MacDuff said:

If @Admin would give us lookouts...…."Sail Ho..."

This is really needed @admin 

give us that crew warning when enemy ship is half way of view range ? at least a warning just before getting tagged, you have to accept sometimes too much afk sailing, so let us watch that netflix a bit more comfortable.

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@BuckleUpBones Peace server isn't the war server. Many individuals pick the peace server because they're players seeking something else out of the game. Some may use it as a trade simulator, others a greater social focus than what PvP may offer, others may simply wish to enjoy the game's beautifully crafted world, etc. So@admin's statement in my opinion is absolutely right. They've paid money just like everybody else to play the same game, and to ensure they could play the game in the manner they wished to play it, they joined the peace server to do exactly that. 

@admin Might I propose @Jonathan Latimer's comment? Perhaps carrying a loki rune in the hold of your vessel would allow you to be targeted by an aggressive AI fleet. But since it's risk vs reward, maybe make the AI fleet: (a) match the Battle Rating of the player or their Battle Group? Then setting the vessels they see to match the BR in some random fashion? (EG: A 900 BR ship might see a 900 BR ship, or a mix of ships that reach 900 BR) and (b) making these ships worthwhile to be attacked by (seasoned woods in the cargo hold, significant doubloon payouts, gold chests, etc.) This way the immersion occurs, but its up to the players selection to participate, and makes the new challenge rewarding for them.

Edited by Decatur
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1 hour ago, Decatur said:

Perhaps carrying a loki rune in the hold of your vessel would allow you to be targeted by an aggressive AI fleet. But since it's risk vs reward, maybe make the AI fleet (...)

Too complicated. And people will rant after being attacked and claiming they "forgot" to remove that loki rune from their hold, or it was among a dozen other things on their fleet ship, etc...

No, it's simply better to have a multiple switch in game settings where you can finetune further a general allowance to get attacked by NPC.

Fleet size... allowed rate... if you just alternatively want to pay a ransom and go... whatever...

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3 hours ago, admin said:

In their mind they are playing the game. They paid up to 40 dollars for the right to sail AFK. 

Right on !!  Thanks again.

This game allows players to spend thousands of hours with the game running while attending to other tasks.  Without an AFK option the game would be diminished.  Creating new ways to punish players for sailing, and doing other stuff, will result in less players sailing.   If we get attacked and sunk while we are are away, it is our own fault.  We are not hurting anyone by having the game running and not attending it: the alterative is that the game would be off.  No AFK = No Play.  Creating poison against absent players will not increase the number of PvP opponents.   Absent players are targets for raiders.  Recently, I left and tended to chores while inside an enclosed bay protected by 2 round and 2 square forts.  I was waiting for the wind to change and took the time to adress RL stuff.  When I returned I was sunk.  I chatted with the raider and he said that the forts do not deter him.

  I've never understood what there is so much hate directed toward AFK players.    

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@Cetric de Cornusiac I do agree that it's certainly a complicated thing to code relatively speaking. However, I am of the mind that carrying those totems, whether or not people forgot, would be at their own risk. If the switch would be easier, then maybe that's the way forward for implementing the AI. I merely wished to ensure that something that was already coded into the game could be made use of and possibly incorporate the Dev's hard work. I suggested that the random element be added as we do already see this to some extent in hostility missions, and adding greater rewards would make participating in these battles both challenging and rewarding. 

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17 hours ago, captainhos said:

Yeah, that's all very well Admin, but I lost 4 good ships and 5 million reals in your little "experiment". Thanks for that.

Unfortunately while devs continue to make changes as if NA is still in Beta it's best to sail junk or just wait for the dust to settle. 

 

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