Cetric de Cornusiac Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, Liq said: Easiest fix is make an option for players to choose in port if they want agressive ai or not (à la smuggler flag) This. I just wrote into same direction while you wrote yours. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccoel1 Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 Just now, admin said: Yes. Just said this above Because mechanics are shared across servers - capital waters act the same way on all servers. As a result owners of capital waters (brits at KPR) can enter battles created near their capitals against privateers (privateers are treated as players). We like aggressive AI on peace server for immersion , not sure if players like it. What do you think? We know players like @hoarmurath from peace server love aggressive ai. I like the AI being aggressive When you attack them only. When I click peace server I expect NOT to be attacked by a freakin lineship fleet. This server is for peace, and battle on YOUR terms only. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Olsen Posted December 4, 2019 Author Share Posted December 4, 2019 3 minutes ago, Cetric de Cornusiac said: This. I just wrote into same direction while you wrote yours. That's what I suggest for decades... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raekur Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 (edited) 42 minutes ago, Wraith said: I think that says more about PvP2 than it does about the Peace server. And you just exhibited the same egotistical attitude as those that were squashed by the PVE players. Dont think that just because someone plays on the peace server that they lack the ability to totally piss all over your cheerios. Edited December 4, 2019 by Raekur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegoLarry Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 13 minutes ago, admin said: Yes. Just said this above Because mechanics are shared across servers - capital waters act the same way on all servers. As a result owners of capital waters (brits at KPR) can enter battles created near their capitals against privateers (privateers are treated as players). We like aggressive AI on peace server for immersion , not sure if players like it. What do you think? We know players like @hoarmurath from peace server love aggressive ai. I guess is about balance; to be chased by AI to much is annoying, to little boring, and being vastly overpowered frustrating. Would be nice to have AI sometimes mix things up a little in OW though, maybe if they attack you can pay some reals for quarter (avoid battle) 500 reals per ship rate or something. Thats just me though would make for some interesting situations, and perhaps something similiar in pvp where attacker can offer quarter Payment for passage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Rainsborough Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 If you're going to get rid of aggressive AI on PvE server why not just get rid of all nations...? No PvE fighting, just trading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angus MacDuff Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 6 minutes ago, Gregory Rainsborough said: If you're going to get rid of aggressive AI on PvE server why not just get rid of all nations...? No PvE fighting, just trading. One of the issues on the PVE server is that the culture, having never been chased, has them building tanky ships which only need fight when the Captain chooses. This puts them at a disadvantage now that they can be hunted. It's very difficult to adjust a culture... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegoLarry Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Wraith said: It's not egotistical, it's just a fact that PvE teaches you very little about PvP. Don't misread me, I'm sure there are plenty of PvE players with the time in the game to know how to sail, group fight, angle and focus fire, leak and demast, etc. etc. But that won't help them at all when they are demasted and then boarded, and their cookie cutter, paint-by-numbers play style all of a sudden is tossed out the window and they have to improvise. All you need to do to understand my perspective on this is watch the panic spread when you Loki into a battle on the PvP server and see ships scatter once they realize they aren't fighting AI and you're no longer predictable, even if the odds are still heavily in their favor. I agree on PvP server can be fun to loki into a battle, but PvE players play on server for many reasons. I sometimes go on PvE because is quite relaxing, friendly, co-operative and suits current playtime, but i love PvP to - each to their own. Edited December 4, 2019 by LegoLarry 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erelkivtuadrater Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 another reason why a game like this needs some kind of alliance system and some kind of trading papers with other nations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cetric de Cornusiac Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 30 minutes ago, Gregory Rainsborough said: If you're going to get rid of aggressive AI on PvE server why not just get rid of all nations...? No PvE fighting, just trading. How. Very. Funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet Sun Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 I'm a new player, have had the game for two days and I'm just amazed about how angry people are in this forum. However, I have enjoyed the game a lot and had really amazing interactions with other players in the PvE server, so I would like to give feedback to make it better. I like the idea of risking being attacked by the AI, but I also like having a relaxing sailing where I can attack the AI from time to time on my terms. A possible suggestion is that the trade missions come with an associated risk of running into AI privateers and that we can assess this risk when accepting the mission. That tells players they may be hunted and adjust their expectations. I also like the idea of being able to choose on port, whether I want to be attacked or not, or better still, for choosing the level of accepted risk. I wouldn't mind being attacked by fleets of my BR or maybe a little higher as I'm sailing, but I would probably not enjoy running into a massive privateer armada on my rank 5 trader snow. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Gregory Rainsborough said: If you're going to get rid of aggressive AI on PvE server why not just get rid of all nations...? No PvE fighting, just trading. Players from Peace server are correct. The nations are at peace thats why agressive combat AI should not attack players - as it is against the name of the server. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainhos Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 What is going on? Just lost my Indiaman fleet to grossly overstrong privateers with no chance of escape. 4-5 days of grinding and over 5million reals of cargo sent to the bottom. Some people might think that this is funny, but they belong on the PvP server. No more quiet trading on what was a PEACE server. I will not be playing again. I am really VERY angry. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeBoiteux Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 13 minutes ago, admin said: Players from Peace server are correct. The nations are at peace thats why agressive combat ships attacking traders is against the server name. Then rename the Peace server Call it something like 'PvE server' (ie Player vs Environnement, ie Player vs AI) and let agressive combat ships attack... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuckleUpBones Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, admin said: What do you think? Just when the peace server pop is on the rise (most likely trading update success) an untested and insecure feature is introduced, on a live pubic server no less, Dev’s must monitor this trial very carefully. At face value there should have been some ROE (for peace). 1) All 7th and 6th rates exempt from AI aggression, to allow for all new players a clear and unobstructed start to the game. 2) Horizon escape, players must be able to spot aggressive ships and make a run for it (running for it is part of OW game), that means speeds should be normalized and aggressive AI identity. 3) Aggressive AI should start off as single ship fleets, not x8, alot of players on the peace server are not there for the 'hardcore' application, though this is the Dev’s intention it is not the immersion of some of the players (and I suspect the largest group that will quit if this fails). These ROE and the eventual knowledge of aggressive AI locations and routes is (or would have been) the safest way of maintaining peace server pop for this introduction. PS, 4) The two fleet ship perks should now be reduced to 2 points each to balance trader vs aggressive AI warship, in that a player trading can sail with a warship escort (still doesn’t help progressing players though). Edited December 4, 2019 by BuckleUpBones 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouth of Sauron Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 1 hour ago, admin said: Players from Peace server are correct. The nations are at peace thats why agressive combat AI should not attack players - as it is against the name of the server. Does this include pirates? A way around this situation would be to make all hostile AI pirates. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paco de Lezo Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 Dear developers, I don't think it is right for AI to become aggressive (killer), deploying huge forces against a ship, making the game really tedious. The rookie players have their days counted, the trade will be again separated from the game and the lonely players will find it very difficult to continue in it. I ask you to reflect and rectify this action. Estimado desarrolladores, no creo acertado que la IA se convierta en agresiva (en asesina), desplegando unas fuerzas enormes contra un navío, haciendo que el juego se vuelva realmente tedioso. Los jugadores novatos tienen sus días contados, el comercio será otra vez apartado del juego y a los jugadores solitarios se le hara muy dificil poder seguir en el. Pido que reflexionen y rectifiquen esta acción, por favor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CageyMoose Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 (edited) Not sure how I feel about this to be honest. I lost an Indiaman to a raider fleet earlier today. While I do like the idea of some risk and challenge, I feel the idea could be better implemented. The fleet which attacked me was travelling at a much higher rate of speed then I was. There was no chance to avoid the engagement and I was not afk when attacked. Edited December 4, 2019 by CageyMoose 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Rainsborough Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 3 hours ago, admin said: Players from Peace server are correct. The nations are at peace thats why agressive combat AI should not attack players - as it is against the name of the server. If they're at peace why are different nation players allowed to attack the AI of other nations? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toblerone Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Gregory Rainsborough said: If they're at peace why are different nation players allowed to attack the AI of other nations? greg … stop it. We all know that all these comments of PVP server players are posted here just because they would like a server merge to get more easy cannon fodder. So I guess that PVP players should just leave alone PVE server players in discussing with devs what they deem to be right for their server. Edited December 4, 2019 by toblerone 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickC Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 Just remove the agressive ai entirely from the peace server please. On the PVE server combat should only happen when the player chooses it to happen. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDread Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 (edited) One of the principles of game design is balancing risk versus predictability. Good games include danger, but make that danger transparently calculable, so a player knows "If I do X, I'm accepting this much danger. If I do Y, I'm accepting a different amount." If you want to keep aggressive AI, make it respond to something the player might do that would then provoke it. IE - attacking a country's AI ships could make you vulnerable to attack by AI reprisal fleets for 30 minutes afterwards. It's simple to avoid if you want to - don't do PVE fighting near the enemy capital zone where the ai fleets patrol - it's predictable, so if you want the challenge you know how to find it, and the rewards those fleets drop make it worth the risk to encourage players to gamble on it. Edited December 4, 2019 by TheDread 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decatur Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 @adminI think aggressive AI on the peace server isn't necessarily a good thing. I do see its merit and value for the PvP server to help make ganking harder. But for the PvE server, I wager I speak for myself and several others, when I state that I/we are not a significant fan of this development given that people are told it's a calm environment at server selection. People here play for the peaceful environment and to appreciate all the good work that was put into the game. From beautiful graphics, using it as a trading simulator (remember seeing some comments about that in the past), or just the thrill of testing themselves, at their leisure, against bigger ships/fleets. To ensure people can do this, @Liq's idea is sound. Adding a player controlled system as to whether or not they'd like aggressive AI to be able to attack them seems fair. However, it may be easier coding just to remove it from the server entirely. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Steensgaard Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 I think the idea is really cool, but the size of these fleets seems ridiculous to me ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Steensgaard Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 (edited) 54 minutes ago, TheDread said: One of the principles of game design is balancing risk versus predictability. Good games include danger, but make that danger transparently calculable, so a player knows "If I do X, I'm accepting this much danger. If I do Y, I'm accepting a different amount." If you want to keep aggressive AI, make it respond to something the player might do that would then provoke it. IE - attacking a country's AI ships could make you vulnerable to attack by AI reprisal fleets for 30 minutes afterwards. It's simple to avoid if you want to - don't do PVE fighting near the enemy capital zone where the ai fleets patrol - it's predictable, so if you want the challenge you know how to find it, and the rewards those fleets drop make it worth the risk to encourage players to gamble on it. I really like this idea! Maybe you could also buy a permit to trade in enemy waters, etc. I love the concept of it all, I think it just needs a bit of adjusting and tweaking and expounding upon. Edited December 4, 2019 by John Steensgaard 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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