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Seasoned Woods poll

Do you like the addition of seasoned woods?  

230 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you like the addition of seasoned woods?

    • Yes
    • No
    • I like the general idea but would (slightly) adjust them, by.. (post below)
  2. 2. Do you believe it will create an imbalance?



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10 hours ago, Stars and Stripes said:

Reload mods will smash ships fast. 12 min repair is 13 or 14 broadsides and more with reload mods and carros.

you're basing your facts of that you're hugging a large ship with carronades, nice ofc you would win, but that only happens if the player you face doesent know what to do.

I played with a guy that ran 12pd carronades on endymion with boarding mods, hugging inexperienced guys in 1st rates that wasnt able to hit him, but if he faced an experience player he would just pull out and run.

This is the equalient of that if you play any other game and have alot more knowledge than a more or less new player you could beat him with your monitor turned off

Edited by erelkivtuadrater
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8 hours ago, Stars and Stripes said:

No I don't think so.

In your game your sailing around in a Fir Fir Santi with repair mods; invulnerable masts, speed mods and only firing a couple of broadsides.

Buy hey. You get it. 😂😂🤣🤣

 

Your apparent comprehension of what I wrote is as lacking as the “logic” you base your arguments off of. Do you have any facts or informed opinions to counter the points I made in my previous reply to you, or do you prefer to just troll in the patch feedback thread?
 

If I was unclear in any point, I am happy to explain in further detail if you’re actually curious to understand why these overpowered bonuses are bad for the balance of the game. But something tells me you’d prefer to keep your incorrect ideas and hide behind the kind of trollish comments as above. 
 

In response to the one point you bring up: I only said that fir ships still have their uses if you read a sailing profile chart for a ship with a mega stack of speed mods. Again I’ll leave it to you to investigate that and see if you think there might possibly be any use for a ship that hits the speed cap at multiple sailing angles.

 

Oh, and btw, fir first rates were great before the speed nerfs 🙂


 

7 hours ago, Jack Jones said:

Funny thing is all those on here crying have all the mods already

Forgive those of us who are “crying” if we choose to point out massive imbalances that punish the players who aren’t super skilled and competent enough to get the OP gear.  Don’t you worry about our access to OP gear, in time we’ll each have a full fleet of seasoned ships. 
 

But ask yourself if it’s worth it to further widen the skill gap between a skilled veteran player and someone who has done maybe 10 port battles in their entire time in the game. Isn’t it punishment enough for that player that he sinks every time he meets a decent player in a somewhat equal battle? Does he need to be punished further because his nation can’t get good port bonuses, and his access to seasoned woods is severely limited? Is this what you’re supporting?

 

Back when I was just getting my feet wet in PvP, I could get a ship that was comparable to my enemy’s ship without any issue. If I lost it, I could get another easily. We even had durabilities back then (there’s good and bad with that, granted), so the mods (which were cheap and somewhat balanced) lasted a while. 
Unfortunately modern NA punishes the losers so hard, many don’t stick around long enough to get good. And that’s a shame. 

 

6 hours ago, Jack Jones said:

DLC ships allow new players and casuals to play in decent ships right from the start.

 

Maybe your argument is that players should just buy the DLC. And if that’s the case then I guess there’s a fundamental difference in how we view the role of the dlc ships. I think they should provide an easy way for someone to sail out and fight in a ship that is better than a shop frigate or AI capped ship. I don’t think they should have to be relied on as the only way players in a nation without access to port bonuses and capabilities to get seasoned woods can get a competitive ship. See the preceding paragraph for why easily obtainable competitive ships should be built into the game. 

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3 hours ago, erelkivtuadrater said:

I played with a guy that ran 12pd carronades on endymion with boarding mods, hugging inexperienced guys in 1st rates that wasnt able to hit him, but if he faced an experience player he would just pull out and run.

Exactly! 
 

I fought a player who sailed an Endymion with a DPS build (I think he said 12pd carronades....might have been the same player you speak of lol)

Anyways he had a friend in a Bellona with him. I was sailing my Wapen. I could outrun the Bellona, but the Endymion was trying to hug my side until he sank me. 
 

I faked a couple tacks and eventually pulled enough distance to demast him and he ran back to his Bellona friend and I escaped. 
 

DPS builds only work when the player you’re fighting is inexperienced enough to not know what to do against it. 

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19 hours ago, Stars and Stripes said:

How so ?

You think you can have a system that is fair for all playstyles??

So 1 guy plays 4 hours per week is going to find the game as easy as someone who plays for 10 hours and he will have everything that someone who has 3 alts and plays for 29 hours a week.

Not possible.

All that extra playing time should be enough of an advantage, plus a modest level of increased mods. That's fair. Superships that require huge reals & grinding time is not.

Any more advantage than that & the new, or occasional, players say "what's the point?", then leave. It happened right after release, and it's been happening for the 2+ years I've been playing.

It's easy to prove my point. We used to have more players, now we have less. And it's not getting better.

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Grinding for woods is not content. Seasoned woods was the norm, not the exception.
Wasn't on the road map. Nobody asked for the addition of MORE wood types in the sandbox.
LH expenditure and the high requirement, appeasing more power to the top.

Edited by Slim McSauce
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5 hours ago, Wraith said:

 the developers did a huge disservice to the game. Basically all we have is a race to the heaviest broadside weight, on the fastest gun platform possible, for content.

  •  

It should have stopped at Speed built Bellonas. 14+knt SOL's of course make everything obsolete. 

  •  
Edited by Slim McSauce

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1 hour ago, Slim McSauce said:

It should have stopped at Speed built Bellonas competing with frigates. We were so close, then Wasa and nothing was real anymore.

  •  

Those who think 74s cannot out run frigates are mistaken (deeply) This misconception also influenced us initially. Not anymore. Its incorrect and we suggest everyone to burn this outdated and incorrect standard out of their mind 

If you read any real literature on the age of sail by the end of 1820 only 3 classes left. Building ships longer than 65-70 meters was impossible, building shorter ships was useless. 

Design settled on the best determinant for success of the vessel = max broadside weight per length = which gave best speed and firepower for class.

  • Long one deckers (heavy and super frigates) (fastest)
  • Long 2 deckers (3rd rates) 
  • Long 3 deckers (1st rates) 

Speed fit Bellona cannot compete for speed with long hull frigates in our game and could not catch endymion in reality. But Bellona (properly fitted) can outrun any shorter ships - which is correct and historical. Because main determinant of speed is hull length and sail power to this length and weight. 

A properly built 74 could be faster than any light ship due to hull speed and number of sails (power to weight). 2nd rates quickly died out because they were costly but did not have broadside weight per length). 

PS
We balance for light breeze that's why rattlesnake is faster currently. If and when we implement wind power it will become more varied, and there will be cases where 1st rates catch everyone.

 

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29 minutes ago, admin said:

 

We balance for light breeze that's why rattlesnake is faster currently. If and when we implement wind power it will become more varied, and there will be cases where 1st rates catch everyone.

 

Will we get proper sailing profiles as well?

sea03.thumb.jpg.5f82ed9ca685f2d1f1e593c3272b5ee4.jpg

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4 minutes ago, admin said:

We balance for light breeze that's why rattlesnake is faster currently. If and when we implement wind power it will become more varied, and there will be cases where 1st rates catch everyone.

You did not balance for any type of wind except the one we have. If you did balance for a "light breeze" a 3rd rate's sails would not fill completely as they do. The ship would have a max speed of 14kts but only reach 10. Light ships would be using all their performance and not even be measured in performance the same way as ships of the line.

A light ship speed would be determined how strong it's masts are, and how stable it's shape is from capsize in heavy gusts, where it's performance is strained.
A heavy ship would not have to worry about it's mast breaking or capsize as much, and would be a more straight forward measurement.

If you ever did decide to go the wind route. It would be almost too late. You've filled all performance niches with gear bonuses.
Your gear determines how fast your ship goes, not the wind or the conditions of battle.
 

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2 hours ago, admin said:

If and when we implement wind power it will become more varied, and there will be cases where 1st rates catch everyone.

I look forward to variable wind speeds.

Can you tie in mast HP to wind speed? 

So if you set too many sails and the wind is too strong, your masts might carry away (or be shot away very very easily)?

I think this could be good for depth of combat. If you sail a ship and set all sails, you might be faster than the ship sailing more conservatively, but turn your yards too hard into the wind or have a cannonball hit your mast and it falls.

The chase scene from Patrick O'Brian's Desolation Island comes to mind. I've quoted the relevant part here:

[Context: the Leopard has been stalked by the Waakzaamheid for quite some time. In rough weather in the roaring 40s, the Waakzaamheid is closing in. Jack has just pointed a stern chaser and it fired...]

Quote

 

But for a moment he could not understand the cheering that filled the cabin, deafening his ears: then through the shattered deadlights he saw the Dutchman’s foremast lurch, lurch again, the stays part, the mast and sail carry away right over the bows.

The Leopard reached the crest. Green water blinded him. It cleared, and through the bloody haze running from his cloth he saw the vast breaking wave with the Waakzaamheid broadside on its curl, on her beam-ends, broached to. An enormous, momentary turmoil of black hull and white water, flying spars, rigging that streamed wild for a second, and then nothing at all but the great hill of green-grey with foam racing upon it.

‘My God, oh my God,’ he said. ‘Six hundred men.’

 

Its fictional....but I think it could probably happen. 

 

Would be cool to see that in the game.

Also, I highly recommend that book. The building suspense as Waakzaamheid chases Leopard through the roaring 40s is top-notch writing, as is the norm with the Aubrey-Maturin series.

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6 hours ago, admin said:

Speed fit Bellona cannot compete for speed with long hull frigates in our game and could not catch endymion in reality. But Bellona (properly fitted) can outrun any shorter ships - which is correct and historical. Because main determinant of speed is hull length and sail power to this length and weight. 

A properly built 74 could be faster than any light ship due to hull speed and number of sails (power to weight). 2nd rates quickly died out because they were costly but did not have broadside weight per length). 

PS
We balance for light breeze that's why rattlesnake is faster currently. If and when we implement wind power it will become more varied, and there will be cases where 1st rates catch everyone.

If and when you implement that, then everyone will sail speedfit 3rd rates, because we don't have historical limitations due to needs for crew, upkeep and wear, and because people will always try to sail the best possible ship. So you have to balance it some way, so the frigates and light ships still be usable. And it has to be done not only with raising cost for heavy ships - that just adds more grind and doesn't resolve probled of DLC 3rd rates you are planning to introduce - such ship being able to outrun and catch frigate will rule the sea (good for money, but bad for the game).

P. S. You are trying to make more historical and realistic mechanics for sailing, gunnery and other things very important for tactical battles (instance) - that's good. But everyone lives in OW, and so there you should also introduce more historical and realistic mechanics both for realistic OW sailing (proper storms, shallows, possibility of get wrecked etc) and boring maintenance issues (economy, supply, upkeep, recruiting crew, tropical diseases) etc.

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8 hours ago, admin said:

Those who think 74s cannot out run frigates are mistaken (deeply) 

Naval Action need Montanes ;)

And 3d rate (74), Redutable and Implacable need more speed then 10,6

Edited by Rolando

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10 hours ago, admin said:

Those who think 74s cannot out run frigates are mistaken (deeply) This misconception also influenced us initially. Not anymore. Its incorrect and we suggest everyone to burn this outdated and incorrect standard out of their mind 

If you read any real literature on the age of sail by the end of 1820 only 3 classes left. Building ships longer than 65-70 meters was impossible, building shorter ships was useless. 

Design settled on the best determinant for success of the vessel = max broadside weight per length = which gave best speed and firepower for class.

  • Long one deckers (heavy and super frigates) (fastest)
  • Long 2 deckers (3rd rates) 
  • Long 3 deckers (1st rates) 

Speed fit Bellona cannot compete for speed with long hull frigates in our game and could not catch endymion in reality. But Bellona (properly fitted) can outrun any shorter ships - which is correct and historical. Because main determinant of speed is hull length and sail power to this length and weight. 

A properly built 74 could be faster than any light ship due to hull speed and number of sails (power to weight). 2nd rates quickly died out because they were costly but did not have broadside weight per length). 

PS
We balance for light breeze that's why rattlesnake is faster currently. If and when we implement wind power it will become more varied, and there will be cases where 1st rates catch everyone.

 

could these bellona also repair to 100% sails after a couple of frigates did some chain-work on them? Every 5 min. of course. And recruit new sailors from salt-water? I dearly love your/our game, but you should pay attention with making realism on some sides while keeping fantasy on others. Humbly, Gene

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@admin I like your ideas of implementing different wind strengths!

Could we also get storms, which wreck ships if the sails aren’t trimmed or the vessels isn’t manoevered properly relative to huge incoming waves?

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11 hours ago, admin said:

there will be cases where 1st rates catch everyone

I don’t think, that this is a good idea:

Granted, long and heavy ships have an advantage over shorter and lighter vessels, when it comes to strong winds or even storms.

But the difference between a superfrigate and a first rate in terms of hull length is not that much, and should be mitigated by the the differences in width, draught and available area of sails.

That in mind I doubt let’s say the HMS Victory could have caught up with the USS Constitution under any circumstances.

In addition you should think about how you want to balance ships ingame imo - if first rates would be the most tanky, damagedealing and fastest (although limited to certain windconditions), why should we sail anything different?

Edited by Navalus Magnus

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4 minutes ago, Nooop said:

They nerfed DLC breakup wood yield! Now you get nothing but trash.

It depends. Today I received from breaking DLC and Admiralty ships around 150 Seasoned Logs. 

Just RNG... 

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9 hours ago, Genevieve Malfleurs said:

could these bellona also repair to 100% sails after a couple of frigates did some chain-work on them? Every 5 min. of course. And recruit new sailors from salt-water? I dearly love your/our game, but you should pay attention with making realism on some sides while keeping fantasy on others. Humbly, Gene

Yeah, leave smaller ships as faster or else the meta will become nothing but 3rd rate and above....#savesomelovefor5thrates 

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the way we collect this new wood and permit is bad. We have enought farm on AI don't add this PLZ.
The rest of the patch is good.

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My greatest fear is seasoned woods will be used against me and others like me to exclude us from some missions and activities.

I was told in the past "sorry fella, you don't have good ships and/or modifications". Will I suffer from this happening again?

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1 hour ago, Real Pit Pinsel said:

People who like to do PVP are forced to PVE and I do not see that. One would have to be able to earn the wood just as much with PVP missions.

Much like the Peace server players who hate the thought of forced PVP, we on the PVP server (at least some of us) hate the concept of forced PVE.

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In the past, golden ships were normal and people always fought each other and now you have 20 million gold ships in the harbor like museum pieces if you're lucky enough to get a golden one, I built a good 200 and it was not a golden one How should one remain competitive in the pvp?

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2 minutes ago, Mouth of Sauron said:

technically you're not forced to PVE.  You're just forced to buy the DLCs   🙂

buy and you become your wood xD. randomly

Edited by Real Pit Pinsel

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