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Cumulative hotfix notes for patch 35

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41 minutes ago, admin said:

i agree its not perfect

but we found the compromise that somewhat works in the majority of cases and it is better than all previous one sided implementations. All other solutions are worse (including the real time sailing in OW and instances with 14 days travel across the map - same speed sailing will solve all tagging issues but will make game unplayable for some)

Nothings perfect. I am just saying that imo you nailed it with the 2 min timer. You said yourself its logical. Why give up something logical for something that makes no sense and has the potential for stopping ganks? It doesn't really. Most times the person ganked is dead by the time his friends come. 2 min is the view range a ship can see a battle in open sea. Perfect. 

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3 minutes ago, HachiRoku said:

Why should the player that gets caught sailing a traders brig get the advantage of reinforcements?

Hey, i'm a believer in the 2 min timer for both sides.  I don't believe in reinforcements at all, but i'm working within the rules that we have.  Devs already said that this is the ROE we will go forward with.

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3 hours ago, admin said:

Normal for the War Server (risk, adrenaline etc).
Attacking a light 6th rate in a frigate is a Gank = and Wasa counterbalances it, stumbling upon your battle by actually sailing in the OW creating targets for others. Someone could have caught that Wasa on the way to your battle, but did not. 

Attack targets stronger than you. Why do you need to gank an AI trader in a frigate? Nautical question... For a friend.

 

by the way
Peace server allows attacking AI 6th rates without risk. 

Let the Wasa attack my frigate in OW, you call it ganking, I call the Wasa player's skill.

The Wasa  joining an ongoing battle with a frigate vs a brig, that you would call "counterbalancing", I call it ganking. Especially since the frigate had no chance to prepare for or evade that situation.

In my eyes it is an art to single out an enemy ship and attack it, so that it won't get any support. This roe simply declines this option. 

And yes, I usually hunt traders in a privateer to avoid being jumped by far superior ships, but quite often some guy joins on my side, which I dislike, too.

Battles shall close after 2 min. That was good for a long time and, at least in my eyes, the best and fairest solution.

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1 hour ago, Wyy said:

this is exactly my point to admin, its illogical that the battle stays open for so long, instead of changing the RoE from hard timer they should try to give us the players reasons to NOT go out in gank squads of 5+ ships

Game is a sandbox and players define their goals and rewards themselves. We do not plan to give you any reasons to not sail with 5 friends to win!

Attempts to create fair environments were tried multiple times. 
Not sure if players remember, but we several attempts for equality for example rookie zones. Which were deserted and empty (despite amazing proposition - cheap shallow ships and equal fights). 

Those attempts have not delivered anything except alienating those who love to sail with friends. People love sailing with friends and love to win. You are proposing to cut this content from players (stop them sailing with friends) under the pretense of solving ganking. We fell for such feedback before without thinking of the other side. But we learnt as we continue developing our first MMO.  Every feature must take both solo and grouped player into account. Not only one of them.

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5 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Hey, i'm a believer in the 2 min timer for both sides.  I don't believe in reinforcements at all, but i'm working within the rules that we have.  Devs already said that this is the ROE we will go forward with.

Devs have said many things and then changed their minds. Besides that even if its here to stay I complain about real life things that I cannot change either all the time :) 

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Most of the time those 1v1 circles in patrol zones are empty, people talk about how they want fair engagements but most of them don't even bother.  It is pretty obvious that this is not want people in fact want.

On the other hand the shallows PZ is usually full, the reason for this is, I assume, is the low cost of your loss. You simply get any old ship and go out and have fun. This should be duplicated and improved because this is what people want.

Super mods, super ships all this stuff is detracting people from simply having fun.

Edited by Raf Van Boom
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18 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Hey, i'm a believer in the 2 min timer for both sides.  I don't believe in reinforcements at all, but i'm working within the rules that we have.  Devs already said that this is the ROE we will go forward with.

then you have to make a stand and speak up for yourself and tell your own meaning about it, else the devs will create alot of mechanics they THINK the majority would like but hate.

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6 minutes ago, Wyy said:

then you have to make a stand and speak up for yourself and tell your own meaning about it, else the devs will create alot of mechanics they THINK the majority would like but hate.

I argued hard at the time and many agreed, but the decision was made.  I can live with what we have as there are plenty of advantages for my play style in it.  I just always thought it was terribly unrealistic.  Yes, I understand the irony of using the word "realistic" in a computer game....

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11 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

I argued hard at the time and many agreed, but the decision was made.  I can live with what we have as there are plenty of advantages for my play style in it.  I just always thought it was terribly unrealistic.  Yes, I understand the irony of using the word "realistic" in a computer game....

Aren't you usually found in newbie areas?  I seriously hope none of what you spew affects the devs decisions here.

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17 minutes ago, Raf Van Boom said:

Aren't you usually found in newbie areas?  I seriously hope none of what you spew affects the devs decisions here.

They would probably listen to a reasonable argument over a childish ad hominem attack.

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50 minutes ago, admin said:

Game is a sandbox and players define their goals and rewards themselves. We do not plan to give you any reasons to not sail with 5 friends to win!

Attempts to create fair environments were tried multiple times. 
Not sure if players remember, but we several attempts for equality for example rookie zones. Which were deserted and empty (despite amazing proposition - cheap shallow ships and equal fights). 

Those attempts have not delivered anything except alienating those who love to sail with friends. People love sailing with friends and love to win. You are proposing to cut this content from players (stop them sailing with friends) under the pretense of solving ganking. We fell for such feedback before without thinking of the other side. But we learnt as we continue developing our first MMO.  Every feature must take both solo and grouped player into account. Not only one of them.

What do you even mean?

the RoE encourages sailing "with" friends over a covering distance of 20 mins so you can allways backup, while the 2 min timer encourages sailing in a tight squadron (rendering distance) fair for both attacker and victim that can tell how many there are, buth the 2 min timer also encourages solo play

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1 hour ago, admin said:

For example if the battle is in the La Habana Harbor -

Where should we move the spawn and how useful it will be? Will we move him inland or across cuba?
What about panama area - how useful that moved person be if he spawns in the pacific. 

This is my idea. Like in the second picture there is line between lands and there is basic boundary according to land shape. Circles does not need to move far away from each other, but from the battle. If it is an cramped area like La Habana, good opportunity for secondary battle in battle for late joiners.

Circles can get close to each other, or move away from each other on the symmetry line, but they always move far away from land, so no more circle on land. This is PVP server, why would join circle be on land, this is sea battle, we come from the sea.

They stop moving after a set time, and battle may close afterwards cause joining would not make sense.

hard land join.jpg

join idea.jpg

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18 minutes ago, AeRoTR said:

 

The idea is not bad, but i think it woud work when the circle stays in OW on his Position. But the drop in point in the battle will slide away from the Center of the Battle.

Lets say 100 to 200meter from the nearest join point after the battle startet per min. it slide away in the instace.

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30 minutes ago, AeRoTR said:

This is my idea. Like in the second picture there is line between lands and there is basic boundary according to land shape. Circles does not need to move far away from each other, but from the battle. If it is an cramped area like La Habana, good opportunity for secondary battle in battle for late joiners.

Looks good.  I'd hate to be the enemy who ends up joining between two square forts, but that is always the risk when you join an inshore battle.

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1 hour ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Looks good.  I'd hate to be the enemy who ends up joining between two square forts, but that is always the risk when you join an inshore battle.

I think much better than what we have, as circles are moving, circle will be next to fort. So it is your decision to join or not :)

This idea can be simplified or improved.

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4 hours ago, admin said:

Attempts to create fair environments were tried multiple times. 
Not sure if players remember, but we several attempts for equality for example rookie zones. Which were deserted and empty (despite amazing proposition - cheap shallow ships and equal fights). 

I loved these, people couldn't hide behind their fleet ships, so it was just them and you =D

Good times solo pickle hunting...

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9 hours ago, Doug Maoz said:

I loved these, people couldn't hide behind their fleet ships, so it was just them and you =D

Good times solo pickle hunting...

and the fleet ships actually counted as BR so they locked out others joining. We use to catch US players all the time in the shallows with fleets.  They never learned that fleets never helped them, just caused them to lean on a crutch that did mean crap.  Even if they got fleets into the battle we just shoot sails and blow pass them so they fall behind.

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5 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

and the fleet ships actually counted as BR so they locked out others joining. We use to catch US players all the time in the shallows with fleets.  They never learned that fleets never helped them, just caused them to lean on a crutch that did mean crap.  Even if they got fleets into the battle we just shoot sails and blow pass them so they fall behind.

The question is: what was a veteran like you doing in the rookie zone?

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22 minutes ago, Serk said:

The question is: what was a veteran like you doing in the rookie zone?

It was the shallows, I do enjoy a good fight in the shallows and back on GLOBAL you found US all the time in the shallows.   So why not fight them.  Really dude there was very little rookies on this game back when it had a rookie zone.  

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@admin

Okay, today i was in the Nassau Patrol and i must say the first Time it doesent feels like a Ganking Zone more Balance in the Zone.

3 Battles most even numbers.

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26 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

Way more important to fix its ROE than trading, rvr, the absurd timesinks, the grind, nation unbalance...

To be fair, reforming the ROE in the patrol zone was long overdue.

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2 hours ago, Serk said:

To be fair, reforming the ROE in the patrol zone was long overdue.

Tbf if they had pulled their shit together earlier we wouldnt need a pz

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On 8/23/2019 at 8:56 AM, admin said:

Game is a sandbox and players define their goals and rewards themselves. 

"Game is a sandbox" and instanced battles don't exactly go hand and hand here.  Quasi sandbox would perhaps be more appropriate.  

A shift towards a more sandbox-esque environment would be to allow battles to be open indefinitely with the load in distance changing dynamically based upon how long the battles been open.  I think this was last seen with your signal perk way way back.  I've always thought it's preposterous that a battle can theoretically close within my view distance and there is nothing you can do to get in.  History books are riddled with anecdotes of captains coming across a battle in progress or even hearing the guns for miles drawing ships to that location to investigate.  

Personally I've always been a fan of slower OW speeds and battles open indefinitely.  A game more fitting of the sandbox designation.

Edited by Severus Snape
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1 hour ago, Staunberg said:

Anybody been in Nassau Pz after the change in RoE? Is it still the Big gankparty with 1-2 vs 10 ore has the change in RoE made a different. I am asking because, Well first of all I have dropped Shroud because of the unballanced, and because with soe many players, from one nation in a very little place, I have been thinking a 2 min join timer will make very little different.

 

9 hours ago, Jim Beamreach said:

@admin

Okay, today i was in the Nassau Patrol and i must say the first Time it doesent feels like a Ganking Zone more Balance in the Zone.

3 Battles most even numbers.

 

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