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Fresh Start – Wipe information for War and Peace servers.

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6 minutes ago, Papillon said:

Remember the Pray button?

Nope, i'm a noob.  More communication would reduce it for sure, but I do in fact fault people for ridiculous speculation.  It accomplishes nothing on these forums. 

 

55 minutes ago, toblerone said:

Now call me cynical, but this is the only logical explanation I could see for an asset wipe in peace server.

If this guy honestly believes this, he's a...…..well, I won't speculate.

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3 hours ago, Tenet said:

You don't understand, because you never tried playing as a ship-collector on PvE.

1. Game-labs failed to implement Port Mechanics on the PvE server, people have no direct access to the port modifications. 

2. The crafting system is entirely RNG based, with very slim chances of "perfect" ships. 

3. The new ELITE Ship Note system is entirely RNG based, with very slim chances of "perfect" ships. 

4. Collectors like building and playing perfect ships (and do crazy things with them like solo group missions). 

Now, this may not be as exciting as sinking a [WO] Santisima fleet off the coast of Port-de-Paix, but it is what such people do for fun.

When this wipe is announced, without a corresponding solution to the RNG / luck based crafting mechanics, a lot of the progress these people have achieved will be removed for no reason other than Admin's whim. The fact that some player has a Golden or Purple Lo/Wo L'Ocean doesn't hurt anyone else on the server. These people on the PvE server tend to be the most helpful with new players, answering questions in Help, softening the blow when rookies lose their ships, and giving away or selling ships at discount. 

If you watch the Path of Exile GDC Post Mortem on youtube, you will notice that they advocate for wipes after releasing new content. The reason it works is because new content brings new and returning players, and the expected wipe allows both to plan a fresh start.

Naval Action has no new content. Players who quit have little reason to come back. There will be a small uptick in users after release, a few more DLC's will sell to those too foolish to understand servers are likely to close, and when that dries up, goodbye NA for everyone. If we are extra lucky, someday the server and game source will be released so the community can host and finish it. 

Can you tell me what the winning lottery numbers will be for this Friday while you're at it, Nostradamus??

Kthanks!

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43 minutes ago, Papillon said:

Looks like ship wipe may encourage more people to buy DLC ships, particularly those who wouldn't before.  Not saying that's intended, but sure seems like a logical result.

Not me. I am wondering if I will come back at all.

It would not be funny for devs either, if for every customer who buys a DLC ship after losing their crafted ships (and does DLC ship bring you a gold one? Let me doubt it), three other customers  would swear to themselves they won't buy any game-labs products in the future, because of their disappointment here with Naval Action, or rather, some ill decisions taken towards community. That means for devs three times no sold copies for "This Land is My Land" and three times no sold copies for "Ultimate Admiral" and ... and... and... whatever comes next. Just for forcing people into buying a DLC at NA release. Which is probably in many cases not resulting in a purchase either. Altogether, a high stake poker game and bad math.

And I even did not mention the influence of another shit storm wave of steam reviews to come with release. I know I argued strongly in favor of dev's case back then when we saw the "Banned Privateer Revenge Campaign" affair, but this was... before my own fanboyism started to get strangulated now with the "no ships and mats" decision for PvE peace server. And it is still no fun for me having to write this.

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50 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Are you sure it has nothing to do with the fact that they may be changing the stats on mods and/or ships?

No trouble at all on PvE peace server. Never was. I was still sailing ships built months before which still could have upgrades of the same icon type (like two gunpowder upgrades or two hull improvements) next to each other. Did it bother anyone? No. They would not know it if I did not tell them.

In addition, we have minor patches all the time with maintenance which change stats of mods or ships and no big wipe is necessary. Is it possible you didn't notice yet?

35 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

If this guy honestly believes this, he's a...…..well, I won't speculate.

Indeed. I won't speculate now.

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12 minutes ago, Cetric de Cornusiac said:

No trouble at all on PvE peace server. Never was. I was still sailing ships built months before which still could have upgrades of the same icon type (like two gunpowder upgrades or two hull improvements) next to each other. Did it bother anyone? No. They would not know it if I did not tell them.

In addition, we have minor patches all the time with maintenance which change stats of mods or ships and no big wipe is necessary. Is it possible you didn't notice yet?

Indeed. I won't speculate now.

1 player has poods, the other doesn't....

As long as the AI can't use f11 or posts on forums, nobody on PvE server cares...how comes the PvP guys cant even imagine that we cooperate , not compete ?

As to poods and gifted ships: Taking a gift away is (selfcensored )

Edited by Jan van Santen
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3 hours ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Now you're just posting made-up crap.  It's not a whim.  If they're wiping something on the PVE server it's because they have to.  They're even compensating to some degree. 

 

PVP has the same chance of your so-called perfect ships.  I agree that PVP does have the port bonus system over you and  I fail to see why PVE server cant have that, but c'mon, don't make shit up.

I've been trying to craft a golden L'Ocean since the beginning of the "new era" of RNG, For months I've flodded the market with blue ships, up to 155 or so of them. With just 4 purples, and 0 gold. I never ever gotten a single gold ship.  Granted, pre-elite this would not have made a big difference.

Now though crafted ships in the PVE server are just useless, elite notes would stomp them pretty easily. That makes a crafter like myself having to waste, well at this point millions and millions of doubloons, to try and get a ship by far inferior to one even the most casual "carebear" can attain by attacking a single L'Ocean. Also spending loads more on buildings, for stuff we don't even get in our server.

Early Access bullshit aside (" there is no reason whatsoever to wipe pve server", not that I believed that for a second) which comes out of someone's ass, the PVE partial wipe, which was of course expected to be something the devs would change their minds on , is a mere gimmick to buy themselves time to make people play the game more, by obtaining again the stuff they had before, a mere pathetic way to get some small player retention by re forcing grind. No new content, no new stuff, just dead trading, dead crafting, and some silly RNG. 

Really looking forward on the release, the 5 newcomers being ganked to shit in the war server, and the 2 coming to pve discovering there's not much to do at all.

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1 hour ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Are you sure it has nothing to do with the fact that they may be changing the stats on mods and/or ships?  Can't have the old with the new....so it would need a wipe....Then they give you redeemables to ease the burden....But I suppose it's easier to speculate about nefarious plans, lol.

No, since in this case a ship wipe and upgrade wipe would have been more than enough. No need for wiping doubloons, reals, ports, materials, permits and - what's more important - outposts and buildings (now that building upgrades are so expensive). 

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3 minutes ago, JoeForKyo said:

 

Really looking forward on the release, the 5 newcomers being ganked to shit in the war server, and the 2 coming to pve discovering there's not much to do at all.

He could do the "tutorial"..oh wait, the moment he reaches the first exam he will ask for STEAM refund :)

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5 minutes ago, JoeForKyo said:

I've been trying to craft a golden L'Ocean since the beginning of the "new era" of RNG, For months I've flodded the market with blue ships, up to 155 or so of them. With just 4 purples, and 0 gold. I never ever gotten a single gold ship.  Granted, pre-elite this would not have made a big difference.

Now though crafted ships in the PVE server are just useless, elite notes would stomp them pretty easily. That makes a crafter like myself having to waste, well at this point millions and millions of doubloons, to try and get a ship by far inferior to one even the most casual "carebear" can attain by attacking a single L'Ocean. Also spending loads more on buildings, for stuff we don't even get in our server.

Early Access bullshit aside (" there is no reason whatsoever to wipe pve server", not that I believed that for a second) which comes out of someone's ass, the PVE partial wipe, which was of course expected to be something the devs would change their minds on , is a mere gimmick to buy themselves time to make people play the game more, by obtaining again the stuff they had before, a mere pathetic way to get some small player retention by re forcing grind. No new content, no new stuff, just dead trading, dead crafting, and some silly RNG. 

Really looking forward on the release, the 5 newcomers being ganked to shit in the war server, and the 2 coming to pve discovering there's not much to do at all.

nooooo … we are pathetic speculators. The PVP gods of war (a.k.a. as Misters know it all) have the right answers also for the PVE server where they did not even play.

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27 minutes ago, toblerone said:

No, since in this case a ship wipe and upgrade wipe would have been more than enough. No need for wiping doubloons, reals, ports, materials, permits and - what's more important - outposts and buildings (now that building upgrades are so expensive). 

Adding insult to injury, weeks ago, a moderator ( I think , he had a green name) came online to answer some of our questions, and directly he stated that it would be a nerf regarding only pvp related upgrades and that we shouldn't have anything to worry about.

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Guys.. PVE accounts for what?  50 players?     Feel blessed they have a dedicated server for you few.     

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7 minutes ago, JG14_Cuzn said:

Guys.. PVE accounts for what?  50 players?     Feel blessed they have a dedicated server for you few.     

There are more then 50 players. 50 is in the Moment more the difference between PvP and PvE Server.

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32 minutes ago, JG14_Cuzn said:

Guys.. PVE accounts for what?  50 players?     Feel blessed they have a dedicated server for you few.     

There it is. The disdain and condescence we usually associate with "PvP heroes", which drives people away from your favorite hunting grounds into our server and lets you drain your own swimming pool.

For a time, early this year, we had higher new player numbers added to server than you, for that reason. The peak was around february, early march when in the high 200's. Not that you ever noticed if someone wouldn't tell you.

Why numbers dropped again to now around 150's as peak? I don't know, but it certainly does not have to do with our community. It would be far worse if we had that social climate which shines through with this your statement.

Edited by Cetric de Cornusiac
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3 hours ago, Papillon said:

I don't think you can fault people for that.  Speculation is a direct result of lack of communication.

Remember the Pray button?

Need new Pray button.

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49 minutes ago, JG14_Cuzn said:

Guys.. PVE accounts for what?  50 players?     Feel blessed they have a dedicated server for you few.   

All MMOs need a sustainable spawn rate but NA pvp sustainability feeds on that very spawn rate, killing it.

^^ is a classic forum example! 🤣

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PvE is the only reason I still play Naval Action. The only reason I would have recommended it too. But in it's current state, it is the biggest mess it has been in since steam EA release. In just under 2 months time the PvE server has been reduced to something I cannot even describe, compared to the build this time last year.  The ships are unbalanced, the NPC's are over buffed (For new players especially) the Elite NPC are a great addition for end game content, but at the same time decimated ship crafting by not giving crafters access to Port Bonuses on the PvE server.

I could care less if there was even a complete wipe, but with the shallow crafting and more grind added to an already big grind makes me want to give up on this game all together. Fixing the problems currently on PvE cannot be that difficult to accomplish, but for some reason, I feel the few things that are needed will be ignored and this title is DOA. Don't get me wrong, I want this game to flourish and to grow. I want to recommend it to all my gaming friends. This game could be a top tier indie game. Such great potential being abused currently IMHO.  Maybe if the Dev's came on and played PvE (Friendly and helpful gamers) for a few day's and not PvP (A Toxic Sh**hole) They might just find what most if not all of us find in this game, something wonderful and not that hard to fix. If they really wanted PvE to be a so called " relaxing place" to get away from PvP madness, one would think a relaxing place would have BALANCE to it. You know, relax, get balanced..Hint, hint

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I have played NA since it's inception and early Steam delivery.  I have gone through many past wipes.  I don't have the rationale for the latest wipe. Assume from what I read that it could be financial.  This wipe appears very drastic.  Fortunately, I left the PVP version quite some time ago because I found that the large amount of time I consumed in attempting to be a good clan member and building on the game in buildings, ships, crafting and trading took up quite a bit of my time.  I am retired, so I know that I may have more time than many of those who are still working.  I recognize the many comments regarding the time devoted to the game.  I'm in the same boat!  What I become concerned with is having the unknown regarding when the next full wipe will take place.  While building back up is fun in a manner, there is time spent doing so and there is a sense of accomplishment in the process.  However, there comes a time when the hours devoted to the game have to be examined to see what the alternatives might be.  Truthfully, I love the game and have talked it up with youngsters thinking about the game.  In a way, I think some of those I have sold the game to are leery with the status of the game as being a beta and the continuous wipes taking all the rewards they have already attained.  It would be great to continue with the game, but I am concerned that there comes a time when judgment must prevail regarding the future assurances that changes which set us all back won't be occurring with the same frequencies we have experienced since the early development of the game.  At some time, the development has to come to a stage that says "That's it. You have a product that may face certain changes to make associated fixes and corrections, but the game will stay the basic game and future wipes will not become an annual event"  Guess like many of you, I will have to see what occurs.  This is not to say that I wouldn't go on to see how the latest wipes have made changes. But like many, I am starting to question my gaming time in an arena where at least annually the game is completely rebuilt and many of us lose what we've built.  Take care Mates, see you on the high seas for as long as we can.  

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OMG, here we go again. I thought the riff between PvP and PvE was long gone. It saddens me to see it rear it's ugly head again.

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25 minutes ago, Horatio 15 said:

But like many, I am starting to question my gaming time in an arena where at least annually the game is completely rebuilt and many of us lose what we've built. 

It would be reassuring to know that the release wipe is the final one. 

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7 hours ago, Angus MacDuff said:

 If they're wiping something on the PVE server it's because they have to.  They're even compensating to some degree. 

PVP has the same chance of your so-called perfect ships.  I agree that PVP does have the port bonus system over you and  I fail to see why PVE server cant have that, but c'mon, don't make shit up.

Have to? Why? Feel free to post screenshots or forum links to a detailed explanation relevant to the PvE server.

PvP can decide to give a ship Lo/Wo + Hull 4, PvE has to roll the dice on an Elite Note, and can get silly stuff like Lo/Fir with Hull 3, on a lucky roll. 

That's not "the same chance", since the refit slots are just part of the RNG. 

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Why does this whole thing feel like a clearance sale at a store? Everything is just put out on display, nothing is organized and the employees don’t care. It certainly does not feel like a grand opening.

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4 hours ago, Vernon Merrill said:

Can you tell me what the winning lottery numbers will be for this Friday while you're at it, Nostradamus??

I bet the number of people online 3 months after release will go down to the same numbers as now, or lower.

How many developers do you think are still working on NA content, versus that new Frontiers game?

How long will the servers be maintained while operating at a loss after release?

7 hours ago, Papillon said:

I'm not sure why you continue to antagonize people with your poor and erroneous assumptions on this forum about what they do or do not do in the game, but take it elsewhere pal.

I do play on the PVE server and I do happen to think it's a good compromise.  That's my opinion or I wouldn't have stated it, take it or leave it, but don't presume to tell me what I am on any server.  If you don't agree with it keep your own opinion.  You neither play my character nor have a clue how I do.  Stick to your own playstyle and don't presume to tell me mine after a few thousand hours in the game.  And your toxicity lately on this forum is part of the problem with player base morale.  Don't continue to send me PM's either to harrass me off the official forums as you have, you are on my ignore list there.

I can apologize for the false assumption, though I specifically spoke about Ship Collectors. Your opinion is noted, but I don't see the arguments in support. Everyone has an opinion. I have my opinion on whether NA PvP is worth playing, and have no arguments convincing enough to bring people I played with back into the game.

Regarding this false allegation of toxicity, I can safely start a tribunal showing the screenshots of our PM exchange, where it will be easily visible who was toxic. 

5 hours ago, toblerone said:

The move was prepared in advance by making prices for upgrading buildings (at least to highest tiers) horribly high. Hence, by wiping assets at launch, PVE veterans will be compelled to stay online a lot of hours to grind back their assets (mainly in order to re-build shipyards level 3), so game population will stay high for at least some days and newbies will tell "oooooh …. how many players there are here". And when the period for the refund is gone, well …. newbies will not be important anymore.

Now call me cynical, but this is the only logical explanation I could see for an asset wipe in peace server.

That is quite realistic. It's the simplest and most typical explanation. I touched on it with the Path of Exile reference, there is definitely a post-wipe activity spike as people go through the motions before they realize it's not new enough of an experience. I didn't think about the refund angle, nice catch. 

Edited by Tenet
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4 hours ago, Vernon Merrill said:

Can you tell me what the winning lottery numbers will be for this Friday while you're at it, Nostradamus??

Kthanks!

he is actually correct though, the game is shallow if this is the contents thats going to come, everything is a huge grind without a reward in the end and stuff becomes boring, this is why people quit because they cant be arsed doing the grind to max rank because there is nothing special in the middle ground.

The trading isnt worth it. There is nothing special owning San Marcos instead of Pampatar (growing forests, all the same port bonuses, admirality upgrades better then eu trader upgrades). Its considered a valid tactic to tag people into combat, leave after 5 mins and retag with a bigger force. There is literally NO High Risk = High Reward system. There is no reward for making top 3 on pvp Leaderboard (IMO this should be a HUGE reason to draw people into PvP). The Flags and Paints were made DLC which i highly disagree with, as these are perfect objects that could be put into the game as reward for actually doing in game stuff.

These are just a few i could bother writing down atm because you wont probably read this anyway, i got alot more coming if you need more reasons why Nostradamus is spot on, and alot of these problems have gotten good workarounds suggestions afaik, and i would guarantee if just a handful of these would be tested and the game wouldnt feel as a huge grind there would be alot more players than staying, even if the wipe would be announced.

If you like the game as it is Vernon so be it, but alot more people had hopes for it to become something bigger because the game genre got a huge potential.

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