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dc1962

Sailing at an angle to reduce damage

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I was wondering is someone has a good video or insight into how best to steer your ship to avoid full damage by enemy fire? Another player pointed out that I sail too much to the broadside to the opponent and take more damage as a result. I guess you try  to present your bow as much as possible until you turn to fire? Thanks,

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Use the manual sails... try to coax your adversary into shooting at you and cause your ship to angle at the last moment. Difficult to learn and even harder to achieve against good players that are patient.

Also know this... this is a very deep game, the more you play it the better you will generally get at it. 

If you haven't already please look at the Tutorial missions, the Trials will get you in good shape for open world as well. After this it will likely be up to you to learn from your in game mistakes and other players.

Learning to sail your ship will take some time. My advice is... stick with your ship until you feel you have mastered running that ship. Don't jump into a frigate until you have figured out how to run a brig. Take your experience from here, and sacrifice yourself in outnumbered battles against many foes in Capitol waters. Always run ships you can afford to replace, as you will lose some.

Presenting your bow is a good idea... but... good players will de-mast you at close range if you do this. I recommend exploring boarding as well, it is very important to know how to board well. Boarding can be a nail biting experience for newer players, be patient, plan your attacks, defenses and musket volleys carefully.

Most importantly... take notes about failure and always leave port with a plan for combat, and a plan for escape.

Good luck sir and fair sailing.

Three cheers for the Frigates and their Captains!

 

Edited by LIONOFWALES
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25 minutes ago, dc1962 said:

I was wondering is someone has a good video or insight into how best to steer your ship to avoid full damage by enemy fire? Another player pointed out that I sail too much to the broadside to the opponent and take more damage as a result. I guess you try  to present your bow as much as possible until you turn to fire? Thanks,

Just watch some 1v1 videos on youtube, it's easier to notice during duels, if you really need a video of it. How to best do it is going to depend on the ship you're sailing. Just start trying it and you will learn by experience. You shouldn't really tank with the bow though, a 45 degree angle is probably around where you want to be if possible. As long as you are not parallel to the enemy's guns you will won't take full damage. The greater the angle the lesser the damage taken. Distance is also relevant though, the closer you are to the enemy's ship the greater the angle need to bounce their shots. 

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In general you want to angle just enough to bounce reliably and no more, too much and you'll just take bow shots which unless you have a mod will tear you up pretty quickly.

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The thing about most videos and other explanations is that they don't give the keyboard commands while saying why they are doing it and for how long. I've sunk by a handful of players who perform the exact maneuvers that AI are able to perform. The most notable one that I cannot manage no matter anything I try is when sailing broadside to broadside parallel, then within 5 seconds being able to angle 45 degrees to enemy while still sailing in the same straight line, not lose any speed, take the hit bouncing most of the shots, then turn back parallel for my shot. No idea how this is done...and watching videos, doing tutorials, and reading peoples instructions does not help when I'm sitting here pressing WASDPL]f9altf4ctrlaltdel and nothing happens. lul

Edited by van der Decken
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@van der Decken are you good at manuel sailing, depowering at correct times, tacking without problems, turning tack into reverse sailing, able to change exiting tack directions quickly? If can do those, you can angle your hull :) It is also anticipating when enemy will finish reload or fire. 

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6 hours ago, van der Decken said:

sailing broadside to broadside parallel, then within 5 seconds being able to angle 45 degrees to enemy while still sailing in the same straight line, not lose any speed, take the hit bouncing most of the shots, then turn back parallel for my shot.

That is not possible.... at all. Ingame physics model forbids it :D
Once you even touch your rudder you lose speed. Period. Same goes for turning your yards out of auto-skipper position. You will start decelerating.

As for manual sailing in general I can warmly recommend @Grunf's video on the basics here.
The general idea of "angling" is that unless your are actively shooting a broadside you should never be prarallel to any enemy ship. betwwen 40° and I'd say 65° is optimal for bouncing cannonballs off your hull while not taking raking shots that start killing crew, guns and structure.
Another thing is speed. Lot's of people always sail as fast as they can. Good players tend to slow down on certain maneuvers and let them overtake them. Behind your enemiy is usually the better place to be. Also once you pass a certain speed threshold where your rudder has good effect and you turn your fastest any additional speed will just make your turn radius bigger, causing the enemy to seemingly turn faster while they actually just turn tighter.

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There was also another maneuver that was highly effective, particularly in line of battle, Crossing the 'T' was something sometimes  seen with the slow, cumbersome, ships of the line where maneuverability was limited. Generally  line battles were slogging matches abeam or side by side to each other, if an Admiral  felt that sufficient damage was being dealt to his opponents he could approach at around 90 degrees to the enemy course to bring maximum gun-power to the weaker bows or sterns as they passed. To do so often meant giving up wind advantage and generally was done toward the end of a battle, so, it was a risky maneuver as heavy damage could be taken on the approach. At Trafalgar Nelson broke with convention by opening the battle by allowing the Franco-Spanish fleet to cross the 'T'  as the opening move,  his intent was to break up the enemy line early on,  so,  a two line approach to the enemy was adopted, giving him a tactical numerical advantage as the Van (front)of the enemy fleet were separated from the the centre and rear, playing little, or, no further part in the battle.  

Some players in game will attempt to cross the 'T' early on, generally at the stern, where the structure is weakest and guns are fewer and lighter, if, any are there at all, especially in small ships,   The Captain who can keep the most speed and maneuverability will usually win, or, sometimes, force his opponent to withdraw, if, he can.  In these fights timing and practice are two of the keys to winning, you may lose ships learning, but, it will be worthwhile in the end.

There are Captains around who are happy to do 1v1, and, it is from these you will learn the most, albeit at a price, they will know very early on if you are inexperienced, they will sink you, unless they are having a bad day,  even the best Captains run out of luck, or, make mistakes occasionally, some of these Captains may also offer, or, give advice if asked.   

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I've learned a fair bit watching live fights on twitch. As others have said , vids on youtube, but make sure they are recent as the game has gone through a few changes

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On 3/11/2019 at 4:46 AM, Tom Farseer said:

That is not possible.... at all. Ingame physics model forbids it :D
Once you even touch your rudder you lose speed. Period. Same goes for turning your yards out of auto-skipper position. You will start decelerating.

I should've said "seems like no loss of speed". I know they do lose speed, but against AI and some of the best captains, it is so little speed loss it feels like none at all. The image right hand column is what I experience and cannot reproduce. Me on left, enemy on right, blue line is sailing path, red arrows are firing (the two red arrows for enemy are optional timing of when they fire). 
KGKqP91.jpg

I also know that some of the super pros have keybinds to press one single button allowing these maneuvers, but I have no idea how that is done.

Edited by van der Decken

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I think it's just mods. AoSH alone is a huge turn buff, you could probably pair it with mods and other books to make it pretty OP. Next time check their rudder and see if their stalling their ship on purpose.

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This is a *really* bad idea IRL.

Guns can at close range pass shot through both sides if the gunner wants to.
The near side injury is limited with a clean pass-through, limited splintering, and a significant injury on the exit from the far side.

Angling strongly isn't sufficient to keep the shot out. If you attempt it you involve *a lot more* of the side in failing to stop the shot, dump a lot more energy into the near side, over many feet of length instead of a few inches, holing several frames instead of *maybe* one, and generate a lower number of a lot larger splinters.

Inside the structure, you would see more casualties, but fewer significant injuries to ordnance and other equipment. Because you only damage one side, but damage it more, the long term accumulation of battle damage may be a wash, or may favour *not* angling.


In game is silly, because it is assumed that 'armour' and structure are two separate things, and that wooden armour is effective at stopping iron shot. This is fundamentally false. Wood is *terrible* at stopping iron shot, and if the wood is the structure it *will* be torn up even if the shot isn't passed through.
Importantly though, ships are quite large. Shot holes are subcalibre, and structures redundant and large. The damage caused to it (except below waterline holing) is almost certainly exaggerated to a substantial degree, 300 or so shots are needed to even approximate the 1.5% 'void' of the existing gunports on a typical side, and even allowing for some linear framing and a weakened area around the hole, a single broadside isn't a structural destruction, or substantive weakening of what limited 'protection' the structure does provide - the void % would slowly creep up, but overall 'thickness' is undiminished.

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The shot from British frigates bounced off the hull of the USS Constitution... for alas she is made of iron! said the surprised British frigate Captain.

25 minutes ago, Lieste said:

In game is silly, because it is assumed that 'armour' and structure are two separate things, and that wooden armour is effective at stopping iron shot. This is fundamentally false. Wood is *terrible* at stopping iron shot, and if the wood is the structure it *will* be torn up even if the shot isn't passed through.

It has been tested. But I do understand the science of wood and therefore get your point … sometimes round balls do funny things... like roll and bounce. But if the wood is not dense enough and does not split well, and also is more splinter resistant than oak, and doesn't dry out entirely... then round balls can bounce at an angle... even on the flat for that matter. I only mention this because some crude efforts in modern testing has been done, and I am pleased to report that Live Oak had the capability to bounce rather large round balls, the thickness is also incredibly important, and perhaps may have only worked on the Yankee built super frigates and also larger ships like thick and heavy line ships.

And yes... the armor is the planking and structure put together, other smaller frigates and light ships would have had nearly no such chance for bouncing any shot. And as for the exaggerated damage, I am totally with you on that... there is a reason why they grappled and boarded, they didn't just want the enemies ship... they also had to kill the crew to really win, they had to force a submission, and if enough damage was not done to the crew by the broadside(s) to force surrender, then demasting and/or stern raking were in order for the stubborn enemy until they lost the will to fight or the Captain gave the order to strike their colors.

Three cheers for the frigates and their galante captains.

Edited by LIONOFWALES

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