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Patch 30: Combat and boarding feedback

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6 minutes ago, angriff said:

So now if I never win a PVP combat because the ships of grouped up PVPers are all OP with the PVP rewards that are no longer doubloon purchasable, then my DLC ship will never be OP like theirs and never get combat medals ever to buy OP upgrades.  Vicious circle and why players quit

A bit of an exaggeration but it is true that combat medals should also be given when doing assists (like pvp marks before).

This all or nothing (kill/not kill) is not going to be good. 

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15 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

A bit of an exaggeration but it is true that combat medals should also be given when doing assists (like pvp marks before).

This all or nothing (kill/not kill) is not going to be good. 

Admiralty rewards for kills and assists will come in the due time (maybe next week)

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@admin watching ultimate admiral: age of sail its quite immersive watching marines firing muskets at close range targets, when is this coming to naval action? Because it really should

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@admin Demasted by a Belle Poule in FOUR hello kittying hits?! 

And you really consider this damage model to be a success and the saviour of the game?

Tell me why anyone should continue to spend up to an hour or more looking for a fight that is ended by four hello kittying shots?

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3 minutes ago, Neads O'Tune said:

Demasted by a Belle Poule in FOUR hello kittying hits?! 

With what guns ? What charge ? What shot ? From what distance ? Where did the shots hit ?

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52 minutes ago, admin said:

Admiralty rewards for kills and assists will come in the due time (maybe next week)

"Will come in time" "maybe" all words or phrases used to deflect

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1 minute ago, Hethwill said:

With what guns ? Carros

What charge ? Define "charge"

What shot ? It's a carro, but that could mean anything, let's face it there is so much inconsistency right now

From what distance ? 250 at least

Where did the shots hit ? As tempting as it is to put a smart arse answer here. The masts?

 

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Okay, Carronades at 250m.

I suppose they hit the LOWER section and not the middle nor the top, taking by your "smart arse" comment.

What caliber of carronade ?

 

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1 minute ago, Hethwill said:

Okay, Carronades at 250m.

Did they hit the Low, middle or top section ?

 

The bottom, as denoted by the complete loss of the mast. The mast was already falling before the player was even a third of the way through the broadside

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Yes, can carry from this weight up to this weight :) 

Look, you either give ALL the correct data or the post is "lost" because it lacks all information.

It is like reporting a "bug". Without info there's zero chance to even start to verifiy it.

So yeah, talk about smartarse attitude. Reckon one needs to be smart first...

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5 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

Yes, can carry from this weight up to this weight :) 

Look, you either give ALL the correct data or the post is "lost" because it lacks all information.

It is like reporting a "bug". Without info there's zero chance to even start to verifiy it.

So yeah, talk about smartarse attitude. Reckon one needs to be smart first...

I am not privvy to the loadouts of the enemy, i can only go on what I have available to me, and that is what I have given. 

Not sure how much experience you have but when someone sinks your ship and you ask what they are using you usually get one of two responses: 

"HAHAHAHAHAHA NOOB!!!!!!!"

Or a load of made up bullshit

 

The point still stands that 3 minutes battles are NOT good game-play especially if it takes an hour to find said battles.

Additionally, if you don't have the prepared perk then it is pointless going into battle it seems now.

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14 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

Yes, can carry from this weight up to this weight :) 

Look, you either give ALL the correct data or the post is "lost" because it lacks all information.

It is like reporting a "bug". Without info there's zero chance to even start to verifiy it.

So yeah, talk about smartarse attitude. Reckon one needs to be smart first...

So... unless the enemy was beyond stupid it was either 24 (top deck) or 32 pd carros (main deck).
I know the post you refer lacked info (It's creator is prone to rage-y reactions sometimes :P) but a little thinking can go along way.

The point was quite clear to see in my opinion:
@Neads O'Tune is of the opinion that a bell poule with a fairly standard loadout killed a mast at medium-ish range with 4 shots is.. well... problematic, to put it in a safenotogetbanned diplomatic way. Regardless of the ship he himself was sailing (that info is actually really the one missing :ph34r:).
I share that opinion. Damage across the board needs to be nerfed a bit. Carronade damage particularly so.

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3 minutes ago, Tom Farseer said:

Damage across the board needs to be nerfed a bit. Carronade damage particularly so.

yeah, and I'm not against bigger guns doing more damage - it's just that damage all seems high.

Lineships absolutely should have a devastating broadsides to 5th rates and smaller
Smalls ships shouldn't be fighting lineships without some serious tactics and maneuvers

but I think we could all benefit with lowering damage from all cannons across the board. I believe the Admin has already stated that next patch we should expect changes and so far, I like all the adjustments that they plan to do.

Edited by Teutonic
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2 hours ago, Hethwill said:

With what guns ? What charge ? What shot ? From what distance ? Where did the shots hit ?

Probably carronades that are OP 

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10 hours ago, admin said:

This is an issue of DPM disparity which is exaggerated for some overgunned ships 
Hercules mixed gun DPM was 1700 in the old model and 3400 in the new - doubling damage output. This is causing too much importance on first shot, to the point that second shot does not matter. 
We are working on balancing this

Here is the rationale
Gun captains used powder to control the penetration power (1/2 1/4 1/3 charge). Ideal charge was that provided enough power to generate as much splinters as possible (just enough to be penetrating the hull), overcharging caused nice accurate holes on both sides (low damage to hull). Undercharging did not penetrate. 
Carronades were short and used low powder thus generated a lot of splinters and were easy to reload and maintain.

But their damage was definitely not equal to the long gun damage. As energy was not enough. 

As a result
Carronades should not generate so much damage but should generate as much splinters as before. + some tweaks to HP on lower level ships must be applied.

Overall penetration should be lowered across all guns slightly. And HP for some low ships should be rebalanced. 
The gap between carronades, mediums and longs should be lower. 

 

Please don't nerf carronade damage too much or you will remove one of the reasons small ships carried them. They allowed a ship-sloop or brig (Rattlesnake/Niagara) to carry much more weight of shot than their size would allow at the expense of range. Some larger ships had them on the QD for close range work and loaded them with shot and grape to clear the enemy decks. Several thoughts:

1. A carronade should have a similar damage output to a long gun of the same caliber. Reduce medium range accuracy and damage.

2. Limit availability to ships that used them especially on main gun decks - ie; large frigates, LeRequin (that also balances LRQ with other 6th rates). 

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Capturable ships should reward you more than sinking one. If you go into battle and cap a ship, you should get more reals and xp for that than just by sinking the enemy ship. I hope this comes into the game as soon as possible, it will also give purpose for capping ships.

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14 hours ago, Neads O'Tune said:

Not sure how much experience you have but when someone sinks your ship and you ask what they are using you usually get one of two responses: 

"HAHAHAHAHAHA NOOB!!!!!!!"

Or a load of made up bullshit

Despite you're right imo with the pointed out problem (unless you were in a T-Brig or so - therefore plz give Infos on your used ship) I wouldn't agree to this.

It's like in real life: if you are polite, you usually get a polite answer.

Edited by Palatinose
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I must say that I love the new damage model in combat. It feels rather realistic, gives every braodside more weight and helps in finishing smaller ships more quickly. Together with the slower turn rates it requires now more precise positioning in battle.

The "20 mins open for weaker side join rule" turns out to be also a very good idea, so gankers should now be more careful. Spreading more small NPC's around capital is good, though I still don't see the benefit of these bigger NPC groups. If someone wants to fight NPC's in a group he would surely rather take a fleet mission then to rely on random spawn.

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1 hour ago, mikawa said:

I must say that I love the new damage model in combat. It feels rather realistic, gives every braodside more weight and helps in finishing smaller ships more quickly. Together with the slower turn rates it requires now more precise positioning in battle.

The "20 mins open for weaker side join rule" turns out to be also a very good idea, so gankers should now be more careful. Spreading more small NPC's around capital is good, though I still don't see the benefit of these bigger NPC groups. If someone wants to fight NPC's in a group he would surely rather take a fleet mission then to rely on random spawn.

Forgive me if I'm wrong but you sound like someone who spends a lot of time doing PvE in home waters (as is your right) and from a PvE point of view then yes this patch is great if you like taking out a 1st rate and attacking large groups of smaller AI. 

But from a PvP perspective the current damage output is a negative change for the game for many reasons. 

As for the new ROE, it is open to abuse by those same "gankers" And is a major step backwards in my opinion in its current form.

Edited by Neads O'Tune
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First experienced of a mate of mine with todays damage changes:


"New damage model is still [censored]. Caught a herc coming out of battle with AI tagged him before he realised and was able to repair, was down to half hull one side. Just happend to be the side I spawned beside with Prepared and sunk him befor the timer even started.
Actually two salvos but the first one just f**ked him over."

Guess damage is still a bit extreme...
Granted the Hercules was at half hull HP but still, the first salvo should have an impact but it shouldn't decide the outcome of the whole battle.

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7 minutes ago, Tom Farseer said:

First experienced of a mate of mine with todays damage changes:


"New damage model is still [censored]. Caught a herc coming out of battle with AI tagged him before he realised and was able to repair, was down to half hull one side. Just happend to be the side I spawned beside with Prepared and sunk him befor the timer even started.
Actually two salvos but the first one just f**ked him over."

Guess damage is still a bit extreme...
Granted the Hercules was at half hull HP but still, the first salvo should have an impact but it shouldn't decide the outcome of the whole battle.

Hercs are a bit of a glass cannon now.  Sounds like a combo of a bad Herc driver and a great tag.  Was you mate's ship carrying heavy guns?  This may be exactly what we want.  He never should have let himself be tagged that closely.

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