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A lot of people have the perception that pvp is unbalanced/unfair because they don't have the best books/upgrades. Why not make them all available in the admiralty store for doubloons?

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Where is the longtime motivation for new players?

if a beginner captured a trader brig with (random) doubloon drop,can buy all the fancy stuff(upgrades, Skillbooks), and all old veterans tried over months to collect books, like 5 rings?

Why not give all new players max rank, so they can sail biggest ships from beginning???

 

For me, your suggestions sounds more like a joke.

Tell me, what should players do ingame for next weeks, months, years?

I think, players need motivations like super rare things ingame for longtime fun.

 

BTW. Atm they can do few traderuns and buy super upgrades, i cant see problems to get upgrades, ships etc.!!

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31 minutes ago, PG Monkey said:

A lot of people have the perception that pvp is unbalanced/unfair because they don't have the best books/upgrades. Why not make them all available in the admiralty store for doubloons?

I wonder where from other PVPers get their books/mods smh

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13 minutes ago, Beeekonda said:

I wonder where from other PVPers get their books/mods smh

I have mine but I see people saying they wont fight because the enemy has better ships/upgrades. So make them easier to get and remove that excuse to avoid pvp :)

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Where did the players know, that their opponents do have better upgrades or ships? Are their trading screenshots or talking about in pm about things, like poods, upgrades, shipbuild?

You only see, enemy player in ow, rest will be surprise for everyone, and its fine.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Salty Sails said:

Where did the players know, that their opponents do have better upgrades or ships? Are their trading screenshots or talking about in pm about things, like poods, upgrades, shipbuild?

You only see, enemy player in ow, rest will be surprise for everyone, and its fine.

 

 

Oh well as long as we have our nice stuff everything is fine I guess...;)

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I mean admiralty sells mods for everything: Speed, Thickness, HP, Speed, Penetration, Masts and so on.

It also sells a bunch of books.

The other mods/books can be found on AI, Mats in traders hold, bought from players/market.

 

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1 hour ago, Salty Sails said:

Where is the longtime motivation for new players?

if a beginner captured a trader brig with (random) doubloon drop,can buy all the fancy stuff(upgrades, Skillbooks), and all old veterans tried over months to collect books, like 5 rings?

Why not give all new players max rank, so they can sail biggest ships from beginning???

 

For me, your suggestions sounds more like a joke.

Tell me, what should players do ingame for next weeks, months, years?

I think, players need motivations like super rare things ingame for longtime fun.

 

BTW. Atm they can do few traderuns and buy super upgrades, i cant see problems to get upgrades, ships etc.!!

First off - you are basically giving new players max rank from the start, it doesn't take long to grind the levels.. Secondly the endgame is in the shipknowledges that really can be a pain to grind.. and thirdly - mods doesn't and never should represent "endgame" content.. Mods as they are atm are unrealistic, unbalanced and simply restraining PvP... That won't change by making them readily available for all - imagine a battle, unlimited sail repairs, limited chain and neither side can demast the other due to elite french rig refit, kirimati mast etc.. Atm at least the one who doesn't have the mast upgrades sinks..

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32 minutes ago, Salty Sails said:

Where did the players know, that their opponents do have better upgrades or ships? Are their trading screenshots or talking about in pm about things, like poods, upgrades, shipbuild?

You only see, enemy player in ow, rest will be surprise for everyone, and its fine.

 

 

Hit a mast 30 times without the opponent repairing sails and the masts still stands - safe to assume.

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Long ago we mostly had to evaluate ships value & performance only based on their wood combination & colour-slot.

It was clean & simple for everybody.

Today these evaluations are lost into a magic combination of so many upgrades.

Peeps know that magic upgrades can really help for better efficiency, this affects PvP as being potentialy unbalanced.

Unless upgrades effects are substentialy decreased, PvP as well as general game might remain unbalanced.

Why spoiling challenges with magic effects ? 

Today, when loosing a ship in a fight, one gets more frustrated cause he can justify his opponant had better upgrades.

Long ago defeats were less bitter, one could not hide behind upgrade excuses, NA was more balanced by that time and PvP was kind of natural. 

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Already available as reals, so yes also dubloons. For example to make a nice pvp ship, you can spend a half million. So when everybody earns half million and has good ship with good upgrades, they are afraid to sail with it. That is the problem.

So you Pro-PVP guys, what do you say, for example 2 PG Monkey fights, one of them with carta / superior gunpowder / elite rig, other has ordinary upgrades and skill books, who is gonna win ? One has these upgrades plus 2 in a golden ship, other with a blueship ? What is the difference...

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2 hours ago, AeRoTR said:

I did not ask the question to you @PG Monkey, asked to any pro pvp guy :) 

Well then I guess you get no answer. Don’t think anybody is doing there Living of this game, so no pro in this game, unless you count the devs.

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@staun there are many pros in this game, who has many pvp victories when 2nd Lt., who has commanded port battles when 300 hundreds hours of experience, the list is limitless. I have read all these kind of heroic stuff on this forum. But some of them are not playing anymore I guess... 

Time to time check PVP leaderboards when you see guys with 600-700 points, they are the real deal.

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9 hours ago, PG Monkey said:

A lot of people have the perception that pvp is unbalanced/unfair because they don't have the best books/upgrades. Why not make them all available in the admiralty store for doubloons?

"Just go to pve server"

 

Am i doing this right?

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8 hours ago, AeRoTR said:

@staun there are many pros in this game, who has many pvp victories when 2nd Lt., who has commanded port battles when 300 hundreds hours of experience, the list is limitless. I have read all these kind of heroic stuff on this forum. But some of them are not playing anymore I guess... 

Time to time check PVP leaderboards when you see guys with 600-700 points, they are the real deal.

Well I know what you ment with your remark about pros. Just thought it was funny you tried to be a smartass with your remark. But there are no pro in this game. Atleast besides Devs, I think not.

 I just put in a link.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional

Ore did I get the word pro wrong,  isent it the short version of proffesional? If I am right plz tell me who make there living of this game. I know Reverse get some donations, but not sure that is enough to finanse his life, but if it can, well then he would be a pro.

 

Edited by staun

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14 hours ago, PG Monkey said:

Why not make them all available in the admiralty store for doubloons?

That would further reduce the need for having ports, trading and crafting like DLC ships and doubloon notes allready did. Wich is BAD!! There was a time when every single log of wood used to craft player ships was bought in one port, transportet to another, sat there to dry until finally a skilled craftsman turned it into a ship. DLC-ships and doubloon-notes completly disrupt the economie and turn what once was a ship that had history even befor it first set sail, into a grey all the same mess of soul-less vessels.

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While upgrades may well be beneficial to specific classes or individual ships they are not a magical cure all,  It may be true that HMS Endymion became one of the fastest ships in the Royal Navy because one her Captains exercised his prerogative and altered her sail plan, she could, equally, of become one of the slowest under another Commander. 

All the upgrades in the world cannot help a Captain who is unskilled, if a captain is unable to sail and fight successfully in a 'vanilla' ship, how on earth can he sail and fight in an upgraded ship?

I am not saying that it is a failure of new players, but, more of a system that implies that upgrades are a replacement for even the most basic seamanship and tactical skills, it took decades for an officer to get a command of his own, to learn his craft at sea, yet here we are, commanding and fighting some of the finest ships that ever sailed in months! 

To become a Villeneuve, a John Paul Jones, a Hardy, or, even an  Horatio Nelson took a lifetime of hard work, Captains in game like Hachirouku with his Trincomalee, or, Luciano with his Le Requin,  Gregory Rainsborough  and his Snows, and, indeed, many others, they did not just jump into those ships and become masters of them overnight, they worked at it, so, the upgrades they use work for them and not against them due to their skill-sets and experience.

I am not suggesting that we lash ourselves to our computer chair, spending months at sea, living on weevil infested hard tack and semi-rotten  salt pork, just, that we spend a little more time with the basics, and, not thinking those upgrades that will not help us without the basic skills to use them well. 

 

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Scenario n° 1: (today upgrades)

- You leave port with a "prepared ship" 

- You come across an enemy player with same ship type

-  You logically engage him (you know him ! he's as exprecienced as you)

- what will make the difference in that fight ?

(He's got faster repair upgrades, higher accuracy shooting as well as higher penetration, you don't have same upgrades, you went for faster reload and faster turning with high hull level.)

Do you sincerly think that your skill or his skill will mostly prevail ? do you believe that each player different ship settings will not help to make the difference ?  

- You lose that fight, damned, it must have been due to not having relevant upgrades compared to his, it's real bad luck...

 

Scenario n° 2: (reduced upgrades effects)

- You leave ports, your ship is prepared with several upgrades with "small" effects.

- Same encounter with same type ship player.

- You engage him.

- The fight takes much longer to make the difference between both players.

- A single mistake can make the difference, it will depend on player concentration and skill, with only slight uncertainty due to upgrades settings

- You lose the fight, almost sweating ! damned ! that was a very hard fight, but you made a mistake and sunk before him, GG... 

 

Which scenario do you prefer ?!!

 

In gaming world, (I'm one of those who started playing strategy games with Commodore Amiga computer) all available tools will be thoroughly utilize by players to look for advantages, every details will be explored to find best fittings.

 

Conclusion:

==> THE LESS TOOL EFFECTS THE MORE BALANCED WILL BE A FIGHT ! 

==> THE MORE A FIGHT IS BALANCED THE GREATER IS THE FUN !! 

==> SKILL PLAY SHOULD NOT BE SO DEVIATED BY TOOLS.

 

Dev's please reconsider ALL stats of upgrades to lower, it is worth testing it imo.

 

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2 hours ago, Sir Lancelot Holland said:

While upgrades may well be beneficial to specific classes or individual ships they are not a magical cure all,  It may be true that HMS Endymion became one of the fastest ships in the Royal Navy because one her Captains exercised his prerogative and altered her sail plan, she could, equally, of become one of the slowest under another Commander. 

All the upgrades in the world cannot help a Captain who is unskilled, if a captain is unable to sail and fight successfully in a 'vanilla' ship, how on earth can he sail and fight in an upgraded ship?

I am not saying that it is a failure of new players, but, more of a system that implies that upgrades are a replacement for even the most basic seamanship and tactical skills, it took decades for an officer to get a command of his own, to learn his craft at sea, yet here we are, commanding and fighting some of the finest ships that ever sailed in months! 

To become a Villeneuve, a John Paul Jones, a Hardy, or, even an  Horatio Nelson took a lifetime of hard work, Captains in game like Hachirouku with his Trincomalee, or, Luciano with his Le Requin,  Gregory Rainsborough  and his Snows, and, indeed, many others, they did not just jump into those ships and become masters of them overnight, they worked at it, so, the upgrades they use work for them and not against them due to their skill-sets and experience.

I am not suggesting that we lash ourselves to our computer chair, spending months at sea, living on weevil infested hard tack and semi-rotten  salt pork, just, that we spend a little more time with the basics, and, not thinking those upgrades that will not help us without the basic skills to use them well. 

 

Really like the post :) but...then... if...

.. no Auto Skipper ;) and let the "pilot learn his bird".

But that's a no go.

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35 minutes ago, Celtiberofrog said:

Scenario n° 1: (today upgrades)

- You leave port with a "prepared ship" 

- You come across an enemy player with same ship type

-  You logically engage him (you know him ! he's as exprecienced as you)

- what will make the difference in that fight ?

(He's got faster repair upgrades, higher accuracy shooting as well as higher penetration, you don't have same upgrades, you went for faster reload and faster turning with high hull level.)

Do you sincerly think that your skill or his skill will mostly prevail ? do you believe that each player different ship settings will not help to make the difference ?  

- You lose that fight, damned, it must have been due to not having relevant upgrades compared to his, it's real bad luck...

 

Scenario n° 2: (reduced upgrades effects)

- You leave ports, your ship is prepared with several upgrades with "small" effects.

- Same encounter with same type ship player.

- You engage him.

- The fight takes much longer to make the difference between both players.

- A single mistake can make the difference, it will depend on player concentration and skill, with only slight uncertainty due to upgrades settings

- You lose the fight, almost sweating ! damned ! that was a very hard fight, but you made a mistake and sunk before him, GG... 

 

Which scenario do you prefer ?!!

 

In gaming world, (I'm one of those who started playing strategy games with Commodore Amiga computer) all available tools will be thoroughly utilize by players to look for advantages, every details will be explored to find best fittings.

 

Conclusion:

==> THE LESS TOOL EFFECTS THE MORE BALANCED WILL BE A FIGHT ! 

==> THE MORE A FIGHT IS BALANCED THE GREATER IS THE FUN !! 

==> SKILL PLAY SHOULD NOT BE SO DEVIATED BY TOOLS.

 

Dev's please reconsider ALL stats of upgrades to lower, it is worth testing it imo.

 

Not sure you are right, we all have acces to more ore less the same upgrades. Not sure it then make a big change. Your claim is with less upgrade, the gab between players will be less. I am not that sure. But it is easy to test. Find 10 avarage player and put the up against 10 good players. Let them have the same ships. Let 10 fight be without upgrades and knowledge. Then make 10 with same upgrades and knowledge.

My bet is the result will be the same. 10 wins both times for the good players. In regard to time it will take them to win, I also think it will be the same time. 

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11 minutes ago, Chevalier du Ethuville said:

Really like the post :) but...then... if...

.. no Auto Skipper ;) and let the "pilot learn his bird".

But that's a no go.

This is so very true, I do wonder though if  lesser skilled Captains were to use the autoskipper less in combat whether their skills would improve? Like autopilots are there to reduce a pilots workload they still need the ability to fly the aircraft, so, it is, that a Captain should have the skill to sail his ship irrespective of the assistance of the autoskipper. I think that while such devices are useful, they can, if over relied on take a lot of fun out of a game, anyone can land an A320 on autopilot, but it takes practice to land one manually.

Just out of curiosity, I wonder how many veteran Captains are capable of fighting an entire battle on manual sails and win against the autoskipper? Or, even an equal also sailing manually, I certainly could not, and, I mean no disrespect to my betters, but, it would certainly be interesting to see!

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