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koltes

Remove sextant perk - replace with navigation tools

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Sextant perk is an easy feature to implement I get it. But the map tools offered are also VERY easy to implement and give much better immersion with the game. Way more
Its just as easy as it was with the Protractor tool.


So there it goes:

1. Ability to draw on the map and make notes that stay on the map (including navigation drawings), thus allowing us to mark locations, distances, time, angles etc;


2. Protractor Tool needs to be adjusted how it should properly work, e.g. show degree angle. For this the first click needs to be the starting point and the target to have the protractor on. This way it will tell you the bearing to the target allowing you to triangulate your location using bearing system. Right now its the other way around. See pic below
xL4ttRX.jpg


3. Dividers needed to measure distances on the map and to assist in triangulation
h7r14b4.jpg


4. Ruler to draw a straight line between waypoints allowing to plot the course.
lJxxmGI.jpg


5. 
Having this tools in place would allow to plot the course and then simply change to the right bearing once a waypoint was reached. See example below:
QA6IBB2.jpg


6. Longitude and Latitude added to the grid. Without pinpoint GPS dot on the map everyone still have to figure out their own location and it will never be OP. But coordinate system did exist in this era and not having it is just poor mechanic. We need the grid to communicate and make notes.


7. Spyglass bearing - need to be able to tell an angle degree while in OW. It could be while aiming with your spyglass at POI or a landmark. Or it could be a button that switches your OW compass from Ship oriented to Camera oriented. When in camera mode the compass marking should change to degrees.

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Lol

You know .. Support the game, buy some DLC's and it's not impossible your wildest dreams may come true 

For the rest of you: Check your expectations.

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14 minutes ago, jodgi said:

Lol

You know .. Support the game, buy some DLC's and it's not impossible your wildest dreams may come true 

For the rest of you: Check your expectations.

I'll buy every cosmetic DLC this game puts out...

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1 minute ago, Slim McSauce said:

I'll buy every cosmetic DLC this game puts out...

Same! I wish they would put all these fudging paints in already... I'd buy that even as DLC. Tired of everyone's ships looking the exact same. 

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Just now, Draymoor said:

Same! I wish they would put all these fudging paints in already... I'd buy that even as DLC. Tired of everyone's ships looking the exact same. 

Probably waiting some time closer to release, which is fine, I don't think we'll get anything bigger the paints for DLC.

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1 hour ago, koltes said:

Sextant perk is an easy feature to implement I get it. But the map tools offered are also VERY easy to implement and give much better immersion with the game. Way more
Its just as easy as it was with the Protractor tool.

Great ideas, Koltes.

I just posted a suggestion earlier today that I thought would be a compromise for the Protractor/Sextant. The idea was to implement a floating movable compass on the map, similar to that on some 3rd party maps. You would not be able to draw a line from point A to point B. You would have to take a visual note of your destination heading. There would be no red arrow indicating your heading on the OW compass. The sextant would then be used to check your position from time to time and then you would use the movable map compass to again check your heading and make adjustments as needed.

My idea is certainly not as interesting as yours, but I believe it would be an improvement.

Thanks

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Very good and well researched argument.

 

I have been pointing out for months (years?) that early 19th century ship captains had a very thorough understanding of practical and celestial navigation. To suggest that anyone sailed "blind" in the time period is absolutely ludicrous.

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59 minutes ago, Slim McSauce said:

I'll buy every cosmetic DLC this game puts out...

Not me. I have the one and only pirates flag in the game that I need:

2f2f5eccf12d330c283a08aa3e5cf248.gif

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I'm okay to continue drawing on other maps and using extra applications.  Everything doesn't have to be inside the game.  Other MMOs use alternate apps and those Devs encourage 3rd party App use and development.

I would like to see some navigation aids to make sailing more fun.  These aids would be additions to the current features,  so  players can keep all  the simple current navigation tools that we now have.  (sextant, protractor, direction marker).  Adding a few optional navigation tools would improve the game.

  1. Compass that allows us to take a bearing.  I would prefer not to have a digital read out (on the spyglass, or where ever).
  2. Grid reference numbers instead of a GPS position dot.  Rather than precision numbers they could be general, to reduce gank co-ordinating. Alternatively; provide the option to turn off the GPS dot while sailing, if reference numbers are prohibited.

If sighting with a compass is implemented there are other tools that would make sailing very interesting.  All of these could be used with the UI turned off, and accessed by keybinds;

  •  chip log (for ship's speed)
  •  timepiece
  •  pendent or flag for wind direction (can be static) 
Edited by Macjimm

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Navigation needs to be in game on the map we have. Some tools can be under community control but there should be some reasonable expectation that you have the basic tools on hand, like a sextant, and not as a perk even though it works.

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Great topic, great idea, this game needs this naturaly, like it should be already in the game!!! A map with lats/longs with navigation tools. 

Hey guys get over with gank coordinating. Join timer has changed, so gankers will already be hunting closer. 

 

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The one thing that might stick a stake into your idea is that if the trading tool is removed (specifically the component that tells you distance to port) then very little of this is going to work. First of all your maximum viewing distance is about 23 km so unless you are hugging the coast line then this will limit you on gaining any idea of where you are at simply because there is nothing to gain information from. You cant triangulate without 3 points of reference, even having only 2 will only give you a rough idea with an increase chance on inaccuracy the farther the distance between the 2 closest points. The sextant that was implemented may be nothing more than there being someone on board who actually knows how to navigate. Currently determining your location (without using F11) is only possible because you know the distance to fixed points and can do the calculations (though some inaccuracy is inherent due to lack of scale and not being able to actually draw the distance circles to determine points of intersection. While the idea you present would be interesting it would last only up to the first time someone changed course due to being chased or starting to chase someone. Afterward there is nothing to use as a point of reference (if the trader tool is removed and the knowledge of distance with it).

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You do not need distances to plot some routes, you need the distance scale on map, your speed, timer, some landscape can be added to increase accuracy. 

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they were used for different reasons though, sextant found your position at sea while the protractor and all the tools above were used to navigate a route.

I would instead suggest the protractor updates once every ingame hour, where you have dots on the map for each position and the ship sign (as its marked today) as the most recent position. And you could choose to reset the last route or keep it.

Could also then have red battle markers where there was a battle with a small box of battle results and BR difference.

Edited by Wyy

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Without any connection to the suggestion, just a addon that might help develop your ideas and in regard to the Bonhomme Richard's navigation and position at sea in its logs, be it with coastal reference points, deep sea, etc ( late 18th century mind you )

https://www.usna.edu/Users/oceano/pguth/website/shipwrecks/logbooks_lesson/logbooks_lesson.htm

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3 minutes ago, admin said:

Sextant is a very widely used perk now. players love sextant. 

a "Real" sextant is much better.

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  1. No coords = game is to hard think of the new guys
  2. Add sextant = Game is to easy
  3. Cry for making it more difficult for the new guy by real nav tools
Edited by z4ys

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3 minutes ago, Rickard said:

a "Real" sextant is much better.

Yes. but… pve content and finishing the localization is more important now.

1 minute ago, z4ys said:
  1. No coords = game is to hard think of the new guys
  2. Add sextant = Game is to easy
  3. Cry for making it more difficult for the new guy by real nav tools

Its a choice now. I do not need sextant. but many do. It helps them save time. 
 

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A stupid idea, it will not have any new player, too difficult

Edited by Hethwill the Red Duke
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9 minutes ago, admin said:

Sextant is a very widely used perk now. players love sextant. 

I expect many players do love it, but for me, it's now too much.  I've navigated in the modern day and what we have now is like that.  All I ever asked for is an approx. position (+/- 10NM) every noon (game day).  That, on a map with a grid and scale is all that you could hope for in the late 18th century.

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1 minute ago, admin said:

Its a choice now. I do not need sextant. but many do. It helps them save time. 
 

Still wish it would be handled like area control with 3 points instead of 2, because its really cheap for a tool to avoid fights by enabling easy sailing away from all shipping lanes. But yeah how it is now its really a feature for the guy that has no skill in navigation.

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9 minutes ago, z4ys said:

Still wish it would be handled like area control with 3 points instead of 2, because its really cheap for a tool to avoid fights by enabling easy sailing away from all shipping lanes. But yeah how it is now its really a feature for the guy that has no skill in navigation.

That's a fair point.  There are plenty of players who are hopeless at nav and I guess its a good perk in that regard.  Still too much for anybody who wants some form of immersion.  I wont be wasting a perk slot on it.  I'd really like to see a generic "Noon position" mechanic that is available to all and then the all encompassing (see what I did there?) perk for those that need more.  At the end of the day, Devs have responded positively to a demand, so its all good.

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No dots showing location, no coords please, anything else, fine. It is a large map, but it is still a game and not real world.  If you are lost, sail in a direction you know there is land, eventually you will find something. New players, take time to sail out, in a basic cutter, and get to know the larger area around where you start, then explore other areas. If you see a port, you can sail close to it and see the name (still, I believe). Yes storms can be a pain in the arse to see ports.  If you are too aggravated, lost in a storm, log off for a bit, go read a book, then log on later. I’ve made multi game day trips without the use of f11 coords or the trader tool and usually end up close to where I’m going.

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