My port, my monopoly.

[Sento de Benimaclet]

I have always wondered: if a clan wins a port, why does not enjoy the monopoly of its resources? I think he has earned the right to buy and sell exclusively the various resources of that port. Is it fair that other clans of their own nation or traders from other nations can buy resources as if the port were also outside them? What do you think? Greetings !! 

[Corona Lisa]

Carebears would cry too hard if they had to actually fight for resources

 

Also less sales for 2nd accounts for gamelabs

Edited October 13, 2018 by Jon Snow lets go

[Jean Ribault]

Before reacting too quickly......are you actually suggesting that a given nation's citizens are not allowed any commerce outside of their capital region unless they have captured a port?  Really?

Players today : 600       Players after such a suggestion is enacted :  200

But maybe I misinterpreted.  Trying not to say inconceivable.

Besides, there are plenty of threads on this forum discussing clans rights after port capture, why do we need another one?  Add to theirs.

 

[Sento de Benimaclet]

13 minutes ago, Jean Ribault said:

Before reacting too quickly......are you actually suggesting that a given nation's citizens are not allowed any commerce outside of their capital region unless they have captured a port?  Really?

Players today : 600       Players after such a suggestion is enacted :  200

There are captains of clans who have won a port, say teka, cartagena, copper for example and then can not benefit from those resources because others have put abusive contracts. What is the point of owning a port and not its resources?

[Jean Ribault]

Agreed that they should have [more] control.  That's discussed in other threads.  To suggest no one else can perform commerce is counterproductive.

[John Jacob Astor]

1 hour ago, Sento de Benimaclet said:

I have always wondered: if a clan wins a port, why does not enjoy the monopoly of its resources? I think he has earned the right to buy and sell exclusively the various resources of that port. Is it fair that other clans of their own nation or traders from other nations can buy resources as if the port were also outside them? What do you think? Greetings !! 

Depends on what sort of game you want.  Monopolies are never a good idea if you want a self-sustaining player-to-player economy.

24 minutes ago, Jean Ribault said:

Players today : 600       Players after such a suggestion is enacted :  200

Yup.  And it would be unlikely to every break into four digits after release.

Essentially what this does is kick the ladder down from the tree house for new players.  Would be pretty much at the mercy of whatever clan recruited them.  If an incompetent one that can't hold a port, or get along with others, they would be pretty much hosed.

Not a good plan for new player retention.

 

5 minutes ago, Jean Ribault said:

Agreed that they should have [more] control.  That's discussed in other threads.  To suggest no one else can perform commerce is counterproductive.

More control yes.  Probably some granularity in allowing bonuses for allied clans, at least.

[Sento de Benimaclet]

10 minutes ago, Jean Ribault said:

Agreed that they should have [more] control.

But it is not controlled.

12 minutes ago, Jean Ribault said:

To suggest

Precisely because I suggest what I have put in this section of suggestions.

13 minutes ago, Jean Ribault said:

To suggest no one else can perform commerce is counterproductive.

Counterproductive? no way. If you want to buy copper, you get in touch with the clan that owns the port of copper and if they want, they sell it to you. The one who controls the port must control its resources. The East India Company for example. You said before that if it were carried out of 600 players would be 200. At this time the resources are available to all and 2000 players are 400. If they leave the game is for other causes of all known. Greetings!!.

[Sento de Benimaclet]

9 minutes ago, John Jacob Astor said:

Depends on what sort of game you want.  Monopolies are never a good idea if you want a self-sustaining player-to-player economy.

The idea is not to end trade between players, but the port owner has more or total control over the resources of its port. 

[John Jacob Astor]

28 minutes ago, Sento de Benimaclet said:

The idea is not to end trade between players, but the port owner has more or total control over the resources of its port. 

More yes.  Total no.  Air-locked monopolies suffocate economies by denying entry to new participants.

Econ 101.

[John Jacob Astor]

1 hour ago, Jon Snow lets go said:

Also less sales for 2nd accounts for gamelabs

I doubt that's intentional for a game that's dependent on new sales to pay the bills for the server.  Encouraging alt accounts is self-defeating in a stagnant PC market.  They make the game much more difficult for single-account players.

The PC game market isn't going to get much bigger than it already is.  The universe of potential buyers within that space who have time to run 2nd and 3rd game accounts is likely a good deal smaller.

Some of us actually do have lives elsewhere.

[Tomasso il Fortunato]

It will be so funny hunting for good port with resurces.

[Niagara]

2 hours ago, Sento de Benimaclet said:

The idea is not to end trade between players, but the port owner has more or total control over the resources of its port. 

What about clans/players that helped grind hostility or did the PB ?

They might not be in your clan but helped take it or defend ut.

 

[Christendom]

If you own and pay for the port you should be able to control who has access to it.  

[RedNeckMilkMan]

11 hours ago, Christendom said:

If you own and pay for the port you should be able to control who has access to it.  

I would love to have a clan only port that would be hype

Dear admin God could you allow clans to designate one port as their clan capital and restrict entry to those they like. thx babe.

Edited October 14, 2018 by RedNeckMilkMan

[Guest]

Basically turning off all the casuals.. if there are anyone left that is.. I believe the ports should drop a percentage of goods into the governors warehouse and these goods could then be redistributed at the governors leiesure. This would enable clanless players and casuals to actually play the game as well.. If there are anyone left that is.

[Stars and Stripes]

You get the taxes and port timer and control if it's open or not.

Anything else is dumb.

[vazco]

Clans could get some percentage of goods as exclusive to them. They shouldn't get 100% of the goods though. Alts appeared exactly to overcome such monopolies, out of a deep need. Without those alts, people without access to certain resources would start quitting.

This thread repeats other threads.

[Georg Fromm]

21 hours ago, Sento de Benimaclet said:

There are captains of clans who have won a port, say teka, cartagena, copper for example and then can not benefit from those resources because others have put abusive contracts. What is the point of owning a port and not its resources?

This clearly shows that you do not really understand the system of contracts. And besides, the clan conquers the harbor only for the nation to which it belongs. What you want is a clan-based game.

Edited October 14, 2018 by Hellmuth von Mücke

[Georg Fromm]

18 hours ago, Christendom said:

If you own and pay for the port you should be able to control who has access to it.  

This clearly shows that you do not really understand the system of contracts.
And besides, the clan conquers the harbor only for the nation to which it belongs. What you want is a clan-based game.

[SnovaZdorowa]

Agree.

Allow/deny lists for each port, objects are nation/clan/player.

Kick from market all those stupids and alts.

But... You know. This is never will be done, because... because sales.

fall apart

[Corona Lisa]

2 minutes ago, Graf Bernadotte said:

Finally. How often are those money ports attacked? The whole idea to turn some ports in to desired hotspots failed completely, since it never brought us those fights everybody against everybody. Fact is as soon as a superior power takes the port it is out of competition and almost no RvR happens there anymore. And if a night crew manages to take one of those ports the night timer

The whole idea with money ports failed completely. We became less competition not more. To reward those happy members of the right clan, which had one guy more in the grinding than their fellow citizens for doing nothing worsens this situation.

The only solution is: REMOVE MONEY PORTS.

Why are they not attacked? Well why would you when you can get the resources with alts. Everyone has Caratgena refits because of that. If access is limited it gets much harder / impossible so you can choose to use different upgrades or pay a much higher price.

Access should be to the owning clan and its allies, so everyone who actively helps can reap the benefits.

Its true tho, if strong nations hold important ports they get even stronger. Good balance would solve that but I dont believe in the devs in that regard.

[Christendom]

1 hour ago, Hellmuth von Mücke said:

This clearly shows that you do not really understand the system of contracts.
And besides, the clan conquers the harbor only for the nation to which it belongs. What you want is a clan-based game.

Obviously a nation based game is not working, so yes.  

Not sure about your contracts comment,  the concept is simple enough.  I want a clan to control who can place contracts in their ports and to be able to monopolize that resource should they choose.  

Clan X owns Carta.  Everyone from that nation can place contracts including alts.  There is almost no point to owning ports when you can leech off others.  

Edited October 14, 2018 by Christendom

[Christendom]

15 minutes ago, Graf Bernadotte said:

Which clan is able to conquer a port like Cartagena without help of it's nation? It already starts with hostility missions which needs ways more players to be successful at a heavily defended port than any clan in the game can activate.. On the other side, which clan is able to defend a port like Cartagena successfully without help of it's nation? I don't know any clan which could do so.

If attacking or defending important ports is only possible with the help of the nation, why should all those guys who helped out be excluded when it comes to harvesting the fruits the whole nation has gained?

Finally. How often are those money ports attacked? Did we get those permanent attacks no those ports everybody wants to own? Fact is as soon as a superior power takes the port it is out of competition and almost no RvR happens there anymore. And if a night crew manages to take one of those ports the night timer does the job.

The whole idea with money ports failed completely. We became less competition not more. To reward those happy members of the right clan, which had one guy more in the grinding than their fellow citizens for doing nothing worsens this situation.

The only solution is: REMOVE MONEY PORTS.

I actually agree with Grafy here.  In a nation based game money ports don’t work.  If it was clan based it would.  

[Potemkin]

Imho alts should never have been a viable option during the testing phase of this game. Its impossible to really test any of the mechanics that intersect econ and rvr accurately. The results are mechanics that might work in theory, but in practice are mostly rendered redundant by alt accounts with regard to high demand resources being controlled by another nation. Not to mention all of the possible options that cant ever work now due to possible exploits. Food for thought with NA2 :).The cats out of the bag now though, and i understand the need for funding. I also agree for the most part with OP, though how you could implement it without alienating solo players idk. Trollish alt contracts are cancer.

Edited October 14, 2018 by Potemkin

[Georg Fromm]

Sorry but I use the Google Translator, but I hope you can understand it anyway.

Anyone who claims here that as a port owner, I can not control who can buy which goods, either does not understand the contract system or deliberately states the untruth in the hope of getting a game that is not by nations, but by clans is determined.

The reason why many people have Cartagena Tar are not the many Swedes ALTS, but because HRE is unwilling or unable to properly control the port. The advantage of a port owner is that he can hire contracts, and the resulting taxes re-flow to his own clan.
So if an ALT enters a contract in Cartagena, it would be easy for any HRE player to beat that contact. The resulting costs for the hiring would flow immediately to the own clan, while the costs for the ALT player would be lost. He would now have to decide whether he would like to outbid the higher contract of the HRE player or not. In doing so, he runs the risk that the HRE player again outbid him and he has to accept again the loss of his tax. And this process could be repeated endlessly. 

Certainly such a control requires some work, to be attentive 24/7/365 will certainly not be easy. But to assert that it is not possible to control or decisively influence the outgoing goods in one's own port is simply wrong.

But I also see it as content to properly manage a port. I can understand that this is a job that is not fun for a PvPler, but I still have not read anywhere that other players in NA should not have fun either.

Edited October 14, 2018 by Hellmuth von Mücke