Retag griefing

[staun]

2 hours ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

One of them admitted they kept at it after I chatted with them. Apparently having a friendly conversation was an excuse to keep harassing me. whether they were ultimately successful or not, they still wasted hours of my time in boredom and I had zero ability to prevent being retagged over and over. Everyone admits that it's a problem, what we are here to do is find a solution. Other games have instances too and have found a way to prevent time griefing.

 

I disagree and so do many others. It's fine if you are the one griefing folks, it's not so fine when you are on the receiving end. Surrender is not an acceptable option to stop griefing. That merely encourages the bad behavior.

I gave an solution to teleport to harbor. It only would cost you the PvP marks you had earned since you left the habor.

[Licinio Chiavari]

Just now, staun said:

I gave an solution to teleport to harbor. It only would cost you the PvP marks you had earned since you left the habor.

Too easy zeroing the risk purposely zeroing the gain.

An hunter should know that his brand new 5-10+ mil ship could sink at her first battle.

If he cant afford... Remember the Golden rule "dont sail a ship you cant afford to lose".

[Guest]

When it comes to hunting grounds I stay away from Danes and Spanish now as they have ZERO problems when retagging and retagging with 4 to 1 numbers till your dead.

 

I dont hate them, I just wont go there anymore.

 

I do think its far too easy to retag someone which leads to some griefing situations where you cant be caught in battle but you cant get away in the OW eventually leading to surrender.

[Hammy]

4 hours ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

Not even close. I'm mad that they wasted 4 hours of my time to do it. Had they quickly resolved the gank, there wouldn't have been an issue. It took them 4 attempts and 4 hours to finally set it up. They deliberately decided to keep griefing after finding out I needed to log off. That is the glaring problem with game mechanics as they stand. This game claims to be hardcore, well make it hardcore. Make all communication occur line of sight with signals. Have it coded to crash when voip is used in conjunction. That would be hardcore. Since it's not going to happen, there needs to be a solution that prevents chain tagging.

There is nothing hardcore about being chased for 4 hours until a group of incompetent gankers can finally get their shit together. 

Another possibility to prevent this is to spread combatting teams 20 km apart in random directions on the OS at the conclusion of a battle. This would preserve realism and prevent battle camping. Which in turn prevents chain tagging

@admin

Griefing where you stay a distance tagging you to keep you in battle, we chased you the whole time, and OUR group tagged you 2 times, so quit with the 4 tag 4 hour BS. As you can see, admin see's nothing wrong with us chasing you and tagging you. You lost a ship, and the reason it took us look is because you was made of paper. I love the fact that you say you were going direct to KPR from Aves and havent highlighted the fact you were going past the Danish capital? Very simple question, what would you had done if you found a Danish trader???

[Hammy]

With Regards to getting retagged i do have a simple suggestion, when you leave a battle i believe your 15 seconds of invisibility should not start until you put your sails up, and maybe you have 30 seconds to put them up. This we then give you the chance to turn to a direction you'd like to run away at. Thoughts??

[Angus MacDuff]

Very good arguments to a lot of these suggestions.  So what about a random spawn.  You exit the battle instance somewhere entirely random, maybe 15kyds from entry point.  Yes you get away clean after pounding a baby seal, but so what, they would have got pounded anyway.  I just hate that we can use our chat/discord/cell phones(!!) to vector in the revenge squad.  If they don't see you going into a battle, they shouldn't be able to hover outside of it.

[Joe Plaice]

1 minute ago, Hammy said:

With Regards to getting retagged i do have a simple suggestion, when you leave a battle i believe your 15 seconds of invisibility should not start until you put your sails up, and maybe you have 30 seconds to put them up. This we then give you the chance to turn to a direction you'd like to run away at. Thoughts??

This. Having a half mile turning radius, and a little bit of lag really limits the usefulness of the invisibility. 30 seconds and a chance to pivot first shouldn't unbalance things too much.

[Hammy]

2 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Very good arguments to a lot of these suggestions.  So what about a random spawn.  You exit the battle instance somewhere entirely random, maybe 15kyds from entry point.  Yes you get away clean after pounding a baby seal, but so what, they would have got pounded anyway.  I just hate that we can use our chat/discord/cell phones(!!) to vector in the revenge squad.  If they don't see you going into a battle, they shouldn't be able to hover outside of it.

Very true and we lost him, it was his fault for tagging an AI outside of Cabo Rojo. Ive been counter ganked so many times. Seems part of the game atm.

[Cecil Selous]

1 minute ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Very good arguments to a lot of these suggestions.  So what about a random spawn.  You exit the battle instance somewhere entirely random, maybe 15kyds from entry point.  Yes you get away clean after pounding a baby seal, but so what, they would have got pounded anyway.  I just hate that we can use our chat/discord/cell phones(!!) to vector in the revenge squad.  If they don't see you going into a battle, they shouldn't be able to hover outside of it.

Would be the easiest solution imho. But I vaguely remember admin said something about difficulties with the differentiation between land and sea and the problem with putting ships right onto Cuba instead of next to it for example

[Angus MacDuff]

1 minute ago, Joe Plaice said:

This. Having a half mile turning radius, and a little bit of lag really limits the usefulness of the invisibility. 30 seconds and a chance to pivot first shouldn't unbalance things too much.

It doesn't suck and its equivalent to extending the timer. 

[Cecil Selous]

Or simply taking over the last heading from the instance into the OW

EDIT: well nvm, wouldn't work for someone, who wants to escape

Edited September 18, 2018 by Cecil Selous

[Joe Plaice]

Either an extended timer or the random spawn would be interesting to try out, but I don't know if the current set up is super broken, or the main thing for the devs to focus on right now.

[Capn Rocko]

I agree. Just increase invisibility and remove F11 coordinates and most problems with be solved. This will still happen at nation capitals tho, just don't go there if you don't want to be ganked 

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Just extend the invisibility timer to 60 seconds and be done with it. This is the easiest to code, a tweak to the current RoE not a complete rework, we can test it and provide feedback and then adjust if needed. Let @admin and @Ink move on to more important things.

We had extended invisibility and in rare cases you could leave a battle and tag someone else while invis..obviously increasing the tag timer would be a solution to that.

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

2 hours ago, Joe Plaice said:

Honestly, the event that spawned this discussion was a 1 hour 48 minute chase, with 2 tags. This guy was caught at our Capitol by a different group, got away clean, was caught by ORCA and DNP about 2 hours later, still hunting our Capitol, and was killed.

Do 4 hour chases happen? Yes

Do they happen often? No

I think longer invisibility might be good, but not too much longer. 45 seconds or a minute at most.

You are completely wrong. I also did not tag a single Dane the entire day, nor had any intention of doing so. If I had been hunting your capitol, I'd have been there with a full battle group and not a single one of you would have been griefing anyone. 

[Hammy]

2 minutes ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

You are completely wrong. I also did not tag a single Dane the entire day, nor had any intention of doing so. If I had been hunting your capitol, I'd have been there with a full battle group and not a single one of you would have been griefing anyone. 

so if you had no intentions to tag a player why sail past it from aves lol

[Joe Plaice]

Why would you lie?

[Capn Rocko]

1 minute ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

You are completely wrong. I also did not tag a single Dane the entire day, nor had any intention of doing so. If I had been hunting your capitol, I'd have been there with a full battle group and not a single one of you would have been griefing anyone. 

Christenstad is not on the way to KPR from Aves. Why else would you be there? Probably to gank someone. 

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

58 minutes ago, Hammy said:

Griefing where you stay a distance tagging you to keep you in battle, we chased you the whole time, and OUR group tagged you 2 times, so quit with the 4 tag 4 hour BS. As you can see, admin see's nothing wrong with us chasing you and tagging you. You lost a ship, and the reason it took us look is because you was made of paper. I love the fact that you say you were going direct to KPR from Aves and havent highlighted the fact you were going past the Danish capital? Very simple question, what would you had done if you found a Danish trader???

I admit that I was scouting to see who was online that time of night. I did not have the time for extended action. I have full intention of returning with a full battle group as I was completely unimpressed with your combat abilities. You made so many mistakes in the first three tags it was laughable. Especially the bellona who spawned next to me and didn't even hit me once lol. He could have ended the whole thing for you in 30 seconds. You also have no clue about sailing profiles. I am the one who explained to you why you weren't catching me. If I hadn't you probably wouldn't have even thought to call in pay to win suppport. Need I continue?

[Sir Lancelot Holland]

It may well be the case that F11 will be removed on launch anyway, if so, then, that part of the issue would resolve itself. Whatever mechanics are proposed are going to have their pro's and con's, and will create 'round robin' debates such as this, so, perhaps we could take an idea from the very men who lived in this era, and, who actually fought these battles.

Most of us, I think, are aware of the code of honour between nations that paralleled  the articles of war, the ones that governed the treatment of captured Officers and Ratings, or, that prohibited the Captains of ships of the line from engaging Frigates and below unless attacked first. Perhaps the adoption of such 'Gentlemen's agreements' could have a place in the game, it would be very much in keeping with the era, and, some of this code still exists today, the picking up of combatant survivors  (subject to potential risk to the ship) is still in force.

It is something that to my knowledge has not been attempted in game, but, if a code of honour' could be established, then, the need for mechanics in this instance could be partially negated. Granted, there will still be incidents like this but hopefully most will see the advantages and such incidents will become rarer.

Perhaps then, it is something to be considered as another option in game. 

 

[Hammy]

22 minutes ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

I admit that I was scouting to see who was online that time of night. I did not have the time for extended action. I have full intention of returning with a full battle group as I was completely unimpressed with your combat abilities. You made so many mistakes in the first three tags it was laughable. Especially the bellona who spawned next to me and didn't even hit me once lol. He could have ended the whole thing for you in 30 seconds. You also have no clue about sailing profiles. I am the one who explained to you why you weren't catching me. If I hadn't you probably wouldn't have even thought to call in pay to win suppport. Need I continue?

So let me get this correct, you didnt have time to tag a danish trader "if" you had found one, but you did have time to sail 100k north instead of going DIRECT to KPR. My bad buddy completely makes sense now.

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

32 minutes ago, Hammy said:

So let me get this correct, you didnt have time to tag a danish trader "if" you had found one, but you did have time to sail 100k north instead of going DIRECT to KPR. My bad buddy completely makes sense now.

It wasn't even close to 100k north, more like 30. Took maybe 10 minutes to sail that way. After discovering the caliber of players at that time of day, you can bet your ass I'll be back and with plenty of other folks. It's gonna be like shooting fish in a barrel, especially with how strung out you all get when you chase someone lol. 

Oh, I'm not your buddy, you aren't the sort of person I like to be around. 

[Hammy]

18 minutes ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

It wasn't even close to 100k north, more like 30. Took maybe 10 minutes to sail that way. After discovering the caliber of players at that time of day, you can bet your ass I'll be back and with plenty of other folks. It's gonna be like shooting fish in a barrel, especially with how strung out you all get when you chase someone lol. 

Oh, I'm not your buddy, you aren't the sort of person I like to be around. 

Again look at a map and count the squares from Aves to Christiansted... 4 which is around 100k. See you soon "BUDDY"

 

[Kawazz]

40 minutes ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

After discovering the caliber of players at that time of day, you can bet your ass I'll be back and with plenty of other folks.

We've got that 1v1 waiting for ya. 

[Rabman]

This whole thread is gold. I look forward to the "full battle group" of brits screenshots at Christiansted.