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FREDERICKSBURG VICTORY CONDITIONS ? HELP !

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Hi all,

Having just finished this battle. I obtained ALL victory conditions.

I’m confused re the causality condition.

It states loose Less than 50% of your army. This is were I’m confused. If you check the insert below. It states CSA 11528/17760. This is less than 50%.

But it comes up as a draw as says not meant the loose  less than 50%. I assume it is based on the figure as detailed. Or is it on the Army I start the battle with from the start. If so I don’t understand what 11528/17760 refers to 🤔.

Would appricate your help please.

Many thanks

 

7CAB5D9D-A26E-40FC-AA90-38D32C40B1B9.thumb.jpeg.66a4e5a54a9e973ec7cbdcdd9837d49a.jpeg

Edited by contact

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Honestly? No idea. I've never drawn a battle based upon casualties.

Fredericksburg is pretty straightforward.

Union:

  • Put your best corps south to take Prospect Hill.
  • Place your second-best corps in the second wave.
  • Place your least-experienced corps facing Marye's Heights.
  1. Use the southern pontoons to take the town.
  2. Use your best corps to take Prospect Hill. I usually flank east with the entire corps through the woods.
  3. Move your second-best corps to the western edge into the open just prior to engaging the fortifications on the southwestern woods. Have them sit there and wait undetected.
  4. Withdraw your third corps across the river from in front of Marye's Heights and wait.

Now the map will open up.

  1. Use your second corps to take Telegraph Hill.
  2. At the same time, march all but one division of your third corps south to face the reinforcements.
  3. Adjust as necessary, minimize casualties.

CSA:

  • Move all your best artillery to your first and second corps. When in doubt, give the better or more experienced guns to your first corps. 
  • Place your best corps on Prospect Hill.
  • Place your second-best corps on Marye's Heights.
  • Place your third corps on Telegraph Hill.
  1. Use the skirmishers to defend the southern pontoons. Defend stubbornly. Any casualties inflicted here help later.
  2. The AI will generally hit just south of Prospect Hill and shift east. Place your units accordingly.
  3. Keep your guns within canister range on Marye's Heights, but out of view if possible. Shift batteries and brigades to distribute damage where possible.
  4. Telegraph Hill is a purely static holding action.

Try that at least once, then play it again in whichever way makes sense to you. You should gain some insight from it. :)

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Hi,

Thanks for reply.

The way the AL worked is as you have said.

I was able to carry out the battle more or less as you have said.

I held ALL objectives even ‘Inflicting at least 50% more casualties than enemy’.

Just doesn’t make sense to me !

Thanks for your reply.

Regards

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Odd... I was kind of hoping you'd used a somewhat different strategy and the difference might pinpoint what happened. I've actually never lost Fredericksburg from either side on any difficulty, so I'm out of ideas. :(

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2 hours ago, killjoy1941 said:

Odd... I was kind of hoping you'd used a somewhat different strategy and the difference might pinpoint what happened. I've actually never lost Fredericksburg from either side on any difficulty, so I'm out of ideas. :(

Thanks anyway.

I see on the victory conditions there are options on which locations need to be held.

But ALL state lose less than 50% of your army.

I am newish to UG. Started end of March. This is my first campaign. Though an experienced war gamer.

Hopefully, someone seeing this will provide the answer 🤞.

Cheers

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Based on the latest screenshot the losses are higher than 50%

34183+250+1200 = 35633

22627+494+150+116 = 23387

23387 / 35633 = .66

Your earlier screenshot is from mid battle. Those numbers will update to only show the total forces on the field in each phase. So while you had <50% losses in the end phase, your earlier casualties would still cause the victory condition to fail.

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3 minutes ago, pandakraut said:

Based on the latest screenshot the losses are higher than 50%

34183+250+1200 = 35633

22627+494+150+116 = 23387

23387 / 35633 = .66

Your earlier screenshot is from mid battle. Those numbers will update to only show the total forces on the field in each phase. So while you had <50% losses in the end phase, your earlier casualties would still cause the victory condition to fail.

Hi,

Thanks for that. So the tooltip doesn’t seem to help in multiple phase games 🤔.

So would seem difficult to know how total casualties are going. A total casualty/troops left  tooltip would seem better when it plays a part in so many battles.

I understand what your saying though. 

Thanks for your time.

 

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Back to refight Fredericksburg !

Now I understand the tooltip. I will make a note with a minute to go of every phase. So I can keep an account of my total casualties.

I know anyone who has read this thread will think what a small Army considering how far into the campaign.

There is a good reason for this.

I am new to UG but not war gaming. I decided to see how far I could progress ‘on my own’. Learning as I go !

I like to think I’m ok on the battlefield.

However, only when playing 2nd Bull Run did I start to understand and realise the importance when in the Barrack’s.

Basically I learned the hard way. In the end scraping a draw !

Perhaps it would be easier to start afresh now.

But. Although it will be tight. I still believe I can edge a Victory at Fredericksburg even with my small force. Only outnumbered by just over 2-1 after all. I do know I’m able to meet the terrain victory conditions. Just need to minimise the number of casualties I take. But still inflicting heavy casualties. Simples 😕.

That will hopefully enable me to progress.

So onwards and upwards 🤞

 

Edited by contact
Error

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4 minutes ago, contact said:

However, only when playing 2nd Bull Run did I start to understand and realise the importance when in the Barrack’s.

Consider the Camp as your Strategic overlay. What you do there is directly linked to how your army will perform on the battlefield.

So the game presents 2 basic challenges. The first is understanding how everything, and I mean everything, works and effects your army in the Camp. The second is learning how to properly use your army on the battlefield.

It's a steep learning curve... even for wargaming veterans.

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Hi,

 Thanks for that.

Since 2nd Bull Run. I find I can easily spend 1 and a 1/2 hours in Barrack’s.

Trying to get it just right. Even down to making a few minor adjustments. Still learning though.

But I’m learning the hard way. It is a very important part of UG.

Cheers

PS. Good luck in your latest attempt 👍

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30 minutes ago, LAVA said:

Consider the Camp as your Strategic overlay. What you do there is directly linked to how your army will perform on the battlefield.

So the game presents 2 basic challenges. The first is understanding how everything, and I mean everything, works and effects your army in the Camp. The second is learning how to properly use your army on the battlefield.

It's a steep learning curve... even for wargaming veterans.

Hi,

Just to add.

I’m a great believer in ‘learning from mistakes’  !

 

 

 

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Oh, definitely. Experience is the better teacher even with all the advice and information to be had here and on certain YouTube pages. It's one thing to know intellectually how something works, and another entirely to figure out how it feels in-game.

Glad to see you got it worked out. :)

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20 minutes ago, killjoy1941 said:

Oh, definitely. Experience is the better teacher even with all the advice and information to be had here and on certain YouTube pages. It's one thing to know intellectually how something works, and another entirely to figure out how it feels in-game.

Glad to see you got it worked out. :)

Hi,

”Got it worked out” 🤔

Not sure would go that far 😕

Will get back to you on that.

Lets just say I know now more than I did 🤞 I think ! 😐

Cheers

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:lol:

 

You'll figure it out. :)

90% of battles are lost in camp, not on the field. 33k is quite small for a CSA army at Fredericksburg, but that's almost precisely what I had the first time I played it. If you're playing vanilla on anything but COL, I'd suggest prioritizing Politics/Medicine/Training first, then Economy/Logistics. You can safely skip Reconnaissance, or just put two points into it later when your real priorities are settled.

My personal "rules" for camp in the base game:

  1. Use every Political point you can to about 24-25; the morale boost isn't that big a deal when compared to the gains in spending them. Buy money if you can, weapons if you can't, and generals if you must.
  2. Never sell anything until you have all ten points in Econ. It also goes without saying that you generally don't want to buy weapons before that point.
  3. Use captured weapons wherever possible, excepting 12lb Howitzers. Those are awful and for emergency use only. (Read: I need three more batteries right now and have no money.)
  4. Don't spend more than $5,000 on veterans for brigades, $10,000 if it's a really, really good brigade. Always buy veterans before you buy rookies.
  5. Always spend your remaining money on supply if you can.

As for the army itself, I generally have 4 INF, 2 ART divisions, with the 4th division in a corps being 2 INF, 2 ART, 1 SKR, 1 CAV. The dedicated skirmisher is almost always equipped with sniper rifles, and I'm constantly using detached skirmishers for screening and recon. YMMV, of course, but it's at least minimally useful to know how other people play. :D

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12 hours ago, killjoy1941 said:

:lol:

 

You'll figure it out. :)

90% of battles are lost in camp, not on the field. 33k is quite small for a CSA army at Fredericksburg, but that's almost precisely what I had the first time I played it. If you're playing vanilla on anything but COL, I'd suggest prioritizing Politics/Medicine/Training first, then Economy/Logistics. You can safely skip Reconnaissance, or just put two points into it later when your real priorities are settled.

My personal "rules" for camp in the base game:

  1. Use every Political point you can to about 24-25; the morale boost isn't that big a deal when compared to the gains in spending them. Buy money if you can, weapons if you can't, and generals if you must.
  2. Never sell anything until you have all ten points in Econ. It also goes without saying that you generally don't want to buy weapons before that point.
  3. Use captured weapons wherever possible, excepting 12lb Howitzers. Those are awful and for emergency use only. (Read: I need three more batteries right now and have no money.)
  4. Don't spend more than $5,000 on veterans for brigades, $10,000 if it's a really, really good brigade. Always buy veterans before you buy rookies.
  5. Always spend your remaining money on supply if you can.

As for the army itself, I generally have 4 INF, 2 ART divisions, with the 4th division in a corps being 2 INF, 2 ART, 1 SKR, 1 CAV. The dedicated skirmisher is almost always equipped with sniper rifles, and I'm constantly using detached skirmishers for screening and recon. YMMV, of course, but it's at least minimally useful to know how other people play. :D

Hi,

Many thanks for the advice. 

Appreciated.

I’m using the middle level. 

I’m learning very quickly now just how important the time in Barracks is. Only wish I had picked that up sooner 🙃.

I am not necessarily expecting to win the campaign on my first attempt. I started it to see how far (or not) I could get.

 I’m loving it though.

UG has to be the best computer 🖥 game I’ve played.

Cheers 👍

 

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VICTORY !

Despite my lack of troops. I have managed the Victory despite such a small force. The hardest victory condition to meet was not to lose more than 50%.

The battle may have been won on the field. But the victory was due to my better understanding of the Barrack’s. I spent a long time there and thinking through my tactics.

Feels real good !

A few cans tonight. Ok it’s Friday would do that anyway !

Thanks for all the help and support.

Onwards !

Edited by contact
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