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Reinforcements update

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Just now, victor said:

And I guess that a lot of people here is tired of a minority of 50-100 players (on a population of some hundred of players) that think that they could dictate how the game shall be for everyone.

So ... see ... everyone has its own reasons to be tired.

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4 hours ago, Slim McSauce said:

It won't be easy nor will it be impossible. It will we fair. matched br AI+forts+open battles is as much padding as anyone needs. If you really can't deal on those terms then you're better off looking for another profession in NA or invest in escort if trade is so important to you.

How do you know it will be fair when it has not been implemented yet? I pointed out that it had a possibility to be no change if the AI is super buffed or swing too much in favor of the raider if the AI are too easy to outwit, the truth is we do not yet know how this will pan out but my point still stands that initially it will lead to more incursions into the so called safe zone and this is why the Devs have to clarify what this zone is now. Is it supposed to be an safe area so nations cannot be reduced to a point where they cannot rebuild and where new players can learn the ropes in relative safety or are these zones now the new PvP zones where all converge to find PvP, because it seems more like the latter to me at the moment.

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Trader missions were removed from the game weeks ago but almost everybody can get the materials in the ports around his capital. Also there are lots of IAs, to fight, incoming to ports. With these things nobody needs fighting. If you put fleets of enemies in front of any port, sailing will finish. Even if this server is PVP. It doesn't mean fighting at every place and at all times. For that there are other games faster than this one.

Due to the new reinforcement policy the ports will be blocked by players of enemy nations. (like they are today, but worse). The owners of these ports will not sail or just they will change to another outpost. Nobody will be satisfied. Gankers will became frustated and the others bored.

In my opinion, the game needs trading missions again. Without less resources around capitals and less IAs in the ports. This way players would be forced to sail out of his port. Sail looking for resources in no so close ports. Sailing in Open Seas to look for traders. This is the only way i see to make players leave their ports and not the new changes in the reinforcement  area.

And more ports with rare materials, like copper, but mainly in free port

P.D: i apologize if my english is not good enough

Edited by Thorka
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I'm a bit confused why some people don't think "Hardcore" PVPers fight each other. Yes players of similar playstyles tend to come together in clans. But its not like there is just one PVP focused clan out there. As far as I know there is no secret underground "Hardcore" PVP counsel that mandates all seals must be clubbed and no PVPer shall fight another. Maybe I'm just a care bear though and I wasn't invited. Anyway the PVP server has PVP. If your PVE is being interrupted by PVP and you don't like it there is a server for that. I Agree that PVE players are very important to an in game economy but so are RVR players to provide the towns for trade and resources. Also the PVP players that deny said resources and generate in game content are also important.

PS. Many if not most players do PVP and PVE

Edited by Aster
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59 minutes ago, Rickard said:

you disagree, that the game should move forward and not change existing mechanics the whole time?

Depends on what you mean by "moving forward".

I only know what I enjoy. PvP and nothing else. Leeway and sailing changes and patrols have been good, just to give a few examples.

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37 minutes ago, Aster said:

I'm a bit confused why some people don't think "Hardcore" PVPers fight each other. Yes players of similar playstyles tend to come together in clans. But its not like there is just one PVP focused clan out there. As far as I know there is no secret underground "Hardcore" PVP counsel that mandates all seals must be clubbed and no PVPer shall fight another. Maybe I'm just a care bear though and I wasn't invited. Anyway the PVP server has PVP. If your PVE is being interrupted by PVP and you don't like it there is a server for that. I Agree that PVE players are very important to an in game economy but so are RVR players to provide the towns for trade and resources. Also the PVP players that deny said resources and generate in game content are also important.

PS. Many if not most players do PVP and PVE

You miss the point, my comments are made because the so called hard core PvP'ers keep trying to get the game mechanics changed so they can get access to the players that are PvE'ing in the 5% of the map that was setup for that. You can see many nations players queuing up outside the KPR safe zone all looking to get some PvE player that happens to attack an AI within the green zone. These so called hard core PvP'ers seldom seem to attack each other even though they are operating in the same area and claim they are looking for PvP.

Since the green zones were introduced there has been a constant push from a group of players to get the rules of the green zones changed or to have them removed altogether and by the looks of it they have succeeded in changing the Devs minds regarding these zones and now these zones will become the hotspots for PvP. 

I agree that most players do both, but there are a small group that only want to PvP, which is not a problem, but they expect every other player to be the same as them

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I would just like to see players having to protect their own nation's capital instead of AI. Only let low ranks have AI reinforcements as they are new and need the crutch. Create defensive PVP patrol missions.  Keep the green zone battles open still for coast guards to enter the battles. Create more PVE content to get players numbers up.  Think about content for those who only have 20 minutes to play.  Bring in exploration missions as was proposed waaay long ago. 

 

Although personally I'd also like to revert repairs back to how they were long ago so maybe my ideas are bad :/

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On 4/5/2018 at 10:56 AM, Christendom said:

RIP our already diminished casual player base.  

Correct.

I see nothing that inspires me to log in and play.  I'll check back in the forums a couple times a week to see if there will be a positive change and advocate for things that might be positive, but I won't be playing the game.

See you here middle of next week.

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2 minutes ago, Anne Wildcat said:

I would just like to see players having to protect their own nation's capital instead of AI. Only let low ranks have AI reinforcements as they are new and need the crutch. Create defensive PVP patrol missions.  Keep the green zone battles open still for coast guards to enter the battles. Create more PVE content to get players numbers up.  Think about content for those who only have 20 minutes to play.  Bring in exploration missions as was proposed waaay long ago. 

This does not work. Defensive patrol missions are a waste of time unless you are guaranteed action, people do not want to take missions that entail them sailing round hoping for opposition to turn up.

You may say that there is always plenty of opposition around places like KPR, once you get an organised defence fleet the opposition runs, they only stay and fight if they have a good chance of winning.

Keeping green zone battles open for coast guards was what I thought they were implementing when they recently changed the RoE for green zones, but what they actually implemented was that battles stay open for all, so you get somebody getting jumped by 2 or 3 players so a small coast guard force joins, but then they suddenly find more attackers join and it was a trap. It again comes down to an organised attacking force facing a random pick up group of defenders. Just look at British nation chat every day recently and the arguments that go on about how to handle the attacks around KPR, some people are happy to just go out and have a laugh in throw away ships, which just feeds the attackers PvP marks, others try to get organised and get the defence force onto TS and into correct ships only to be told by others to stop ordering them round and that they do not have to be in TS and they will fight in any ships they want then they blame the more experienced PvP'ers for not defending home waters.

I agree they need more PvE content outside green zones and other ways to get people to leave the zones, but their current strategy of making the green zones unsafe will only serve to drive players out of the game.

In an ideal world you could have players defend their own capital waters, but for that you would need a proper naval command structure where people had to follow orders and you would have to allow people be able to drop what they were doing anywhere else on the map at a moments notice so they could mobilise to defend home waters. In practice this is just not possible.

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27 minutes ago, Anne Wildcat said:

I would just like to see players having to protect their own nation's capital instead of AI. Only let low ranks have AI reinforcements as they are new and need the crutch. Create defensive PVP patrol missions.  Keep the green zone battles open still for coast guards to enter the battles. Create more PVE content to get players numbers up.  Think about content for those who only have 20 minutes to play.  Bring in exploration missions as was proposed waaay long ago. 

 

Although personally I'd also like to revert repairs back to how they were long ago so maybe my ideas are bad :/

I have been on countless defense patrols.  From the Hardmode Era on, they are a complete waste of time, so I quit even trying.  If you want people to defend the coasts, you have to give them tools to do so.  But at this point, expecting rafts of former players to come back in is a fantasy.  The game will have to be built on new players from scratch and right now, nobody new plays for more than a month.  Again, as someone who enjoyed helping newbies... that became a waste of time too.

Edited by IndianaGeoff
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11 minutes ago, Archaos said:

In an ideal world you could have players defend their own capital waters, but for that you would need a proper naval command structure where people had to follow orders and you would have to allow people be able to drop what they were doing anywhere else on the map at a moments notice so they could mobilise to defend home waters. In practice this is just not possible.

The loss of Tow to Capital was part of this. At least once a day, you could quickly rally a crew that would be home to defend.  As it is now, if you are on a far flung patrol or trade mission it's 20 minutes or longer before you can be back home to defend.

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On 4/6/2018 at 7:35 AM, Hethwill said:

Excellent of you to point this out because, for too many players, it seems like this "small" detail was missed due to selective memory or fixation only on negativity.

And that makes a WORLD difference for the "safe zones" alone. And it was requested a LOT by a LOT of players, for the battles to be always open so they can be helped and helped their buddies. Rests to see if it is used.

+1

Because most of the players that would have used this months ago have left, given up on the game and moved on.  They don't log in.  They don't read the forums.  Heck, look how dead the forums are now.

I am sorry, small incremental fixes to a couple areas won't fix this game.  You will not get a critical mass of old players to fill and balance out the game play on the server at this point.  You need to build a game that can attract and keep new players and start from scratch.  If that works, you might get some old players back.  Right now this game is down to the 1% who can't live without it.  I consider myself the 5% who would love the game if it was playable.  But it is not. So I join the 99% and play something else that has balance and >shock<  FUN.

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Indiana, every early access I purchase, every project I kickstart I know it is not a finished game until it is.

I have no idea what other customers think and I am sure developers can't be wizards that guess that players do not understand that development can make U turns everytime.

NA is not unique in that regard I can tell you and if you are a avid supporter of new studios with great game ideas then you know this very well.

Do not buy into development if you expect a release. End of the stick.

Plenty of them, the ones I invested in, I left until they are finished :) and some of them are still in development, 3 years in excess of NA... and making U turns now and then.

 

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On 4/5/2018 at 10:32 AM, admin said:

 3 buffed reinforcement 5th rates will be sent as protection. 


 

Does this mean Epic Event buffed or less? more?

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1 buffed ship per enemy? It better be as buffed as the EPIC ships then.

The reinforcement zone is already a bigger problem than benefit for the defender since the defender will usually be fighting AI as well. Not to mention the time and player count before the defender nation can even react. It´s not like people sit standby in port waiting to defend some random person somewhere against a gank fleet.

New players get a horrible first time experience, so why not just remove it? This is just another episode of letting the fox into the hen house and pretend it´s all good.

Edited by Jesper Dahl
Wording
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On ‎06‎-‎04‎-‎2018 at 8:13 PM, Cornelius Trash said:

But you force the casual player to invest more time.

Every time admin caters to the hardcore pvp crowd, usernumbers drop.

And the hardcore pvp crowd complains about a lack of targets and wants even less pve content. Corellation?

This is the negative feedback cyclus the game is in. I do agree with Lars that we need means of doing economic warfare.

All nations should only have a safe zone around one or 2 cities. There is a huge difference for nations that either sit safe up at Bermuda because people cant be bothered to sail  up there, sit up high in the east coast, low in the Mexican Gulf or something equally. Or nations having massive safe zones spawning massive areas or nations with just 2 cities.

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The thing is that when I log on I like find battles and try to get PvP. 

Like I do in any other game. 

But here I need to use days to craft a new ship. He'll, I can't craft a Bellona right now as I lack lignum vitae logs and can't find any.

If I one day get the stuff for this ships and loose it in a battle then I have to start all over and spend precious time trying to build a new ship. It's not worth playing like this. I'm not getting fun out of this game anymore.

I liked it when we had multi duras. The 5th rates where spendable and the 1st rates less so with only one life.

Now I can't take any risk and when I loose a ship I'm out for a long time. 

In any other game I can take revenge. But not here...

This game is for elite players only.

 

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23 minutes ago, fox2run said:

The thing is that when I log on I like find battles and try to get PvP. 

How do you find the patrol missions in this regard?

24 minutes ago, fox2run said:

I can't craft a Bellona right now as I lack lignum vitae logs and can't find any

 

24 minutes ago, fox2run said:

Now I can't take any risk and when I loose a ship I'm out for a long time. 

Does it absolutely have to be a Bellona?

They have announced a premium ship pack. I'm going to get everything and steer those ships into the patrol zones. Pretty close to PvP on demand with no boring eco downtime. If we get fun fixes to patrol missions it will be close to perfect for me. 

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I would prefer to sail a 1st rate now that I made it to rank 50. But obviously a few players want this party for themselves. 

So 2nd and 3rd rates are the only options. But I can't risk them on PvP as they are too expensive for casual play.

That leaves me with PvE or 5th rates. 

Or other games as I did my part as a PvP fighting frigate cpt. 

The way this game has been developed over time has changed my gameplay from risk-seeking PvP player to carebear against my will. 

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I rather take command of a flagship AF carrier all the time, but alas this is not the game ! :o 

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The main issue is that our end game players want to make war. They have nothing to do outside the green zone and seal clubbing pays the best.

There should be content outside green zones that pays better than seal clubbing.

There should be content that makes PvP players to fight other PvP players.

This way PvP players would not even want to waste their time hunting green zoners as that would not really pay nor fame.

When PvP players are fighting each other, equally skilled players will be losing and winning, we create a money sink.

What there could be outside green zones that is better/different than anything you can get inside green zones?

Content should be something that seamlessly works in OW, not some arena circle.

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37 minutes ago, fox2run said:

as I did my part as a PvP fighting frigate cpt.

Most of the best NA players I know prefer frigates. You seem to want pvp-on-demand in 1st rates? Now, that's a tall order! (And I thought I was being difficult)

You often talk about "when NA was great"... Did you run around pvp'ing in 1st rates at that time? 

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6 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said:

There should be content that makes PvP players to fight other PvP players.

 

6 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said:

Content should be something that seamlessly works in OW, not some arena circle.

Another hard to please customer.

Patrol missions work great as far as pvp'ers finding eachother. I've seen and fought, Rediii, Ram Dinark, Otto, Potemkin...

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4 minutes ago, jodgi said:

Patrol missions work great as far as pvp'ers finding eachother. I've seen and fought, Rediii, Ram Dinark, Otto, Potemkin...

And I have seen overkill-ganks more than once... actually everytime I was there. 

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Yesterday I got about 10 decent fights in the event zone. They COULD be awesome for any group (solos / small or big groups) if they had a proper RoE. A 10 man fleet spawning in a 2v2 20 min into the battle is just nonsense.

Generally I found that the pvp opportunities are much more numerous in the events than camping capitals hoping to get tagged (with a forever open battle.. *choke*

Id say 90+ % of my last week or two battles were located in / near the pvp zones. Isnt that what pve lords always wanted? Players wanting to pvp can pvp each other. Good. Now it just needs a decent RoE to make it perfect.

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