Jack Jones Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Just now, admin said: it was not clan based and we did not have reinforcement zones before. players who are not interested in rvr can just stay in protected zones and buy ships for money. players who are interested in RVR must get out and rvr, and show skill or cunning. This will kill the game faster than anything you have ever done and is completely unnecessary. Please change it and let the merge settle in. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stepp636 Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 1 minute ago, Flash Jack said: This will kill the game faster than anything you have ever done and is completely unnecessary. Please change it and let the merge settle in. Looks like he needs more testers for Legends. Some might go there after NA is gone. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christoph Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Just now, Stepp636 said: Looks like he needs more testers for Legends. Some might go there after NA is gone. legends is boring 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Beamreach Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Okay next thing pvp marks for 4th rates. Are you serious? I can not belive what i read here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 4 minutes ago, Flash Jack said: This will kill the game faster than anything you have ever done and is completely unnecessary. Please change it and let the merge settle in. We are not sure about it. But we need to force players to rvr. Old players might not like it (and its fine) new players will come on release and will consider this a given. 4 minutes ago, vazco said: On top of this we will get elitism in clans, as leaders will have to decide who can have a privilege to fight in PB to get marks. You need 5 people to capture 35-40% of ports on the map. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z4ys Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 27 minutes ago, admin said: rattlesnake heavy and niagara permits will be removed from admiralty of course. 4th rates will be available for pvp marks what about prince? And what does 4th rates for pvp marks mean? Permits for pvp marks? or notes will be for pvp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 I have over 2400 hours in this game. I can tell you now, if these changes stay...Im gone. Im fed up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Tellez Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 At least make it possible to buy Labor Contracts with Combat MArks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 Just now, z4ys said: what about prince? And what does 4th rates for pvp marks mean? Permits for pvp marks? or notes will be for pvp? notes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaos Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, Iroquois Confederacy said: Conquest didn't matter because econ didn't matter. Econ doesn't matter because it is protected by those green zones. Merchants should never be protected by reinforcements. Make econ matter, and you make everything else matter. How is Economy protected by the green zones? I asked you this in the other thread that you posted this in but you chose to ignore it. I asked you to show me from the list of trade goods you posted which ones could make you profit by just trading within the green zone, because as far as I can see there are none that can make profit without the trader leaving the green zone at some stage. If I do a trade run from Cartegena to KPR, a run that takes best part of an hour, I am only in the green zone of KPR for the last 5 minutes. I do not see how less than 10% of my trip being inside the safe zone is causing a problem unless you want to sit right outside the port waiting for me to arrive. Unless by Econ you mean just money generation that can be done by just doing missions in the green zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Beamreach Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) 3 minutes ago, admin said: We are not sure about it. But we need to force players to rvr. Old players might not like it (and its fine) new players will come on release and will consider this a given You need 5 people to capture 40% of ports on the map. Yeah spendet 2000 houres of playing and now you say somthing like thi its a shame New players will come not with bad steam reviews. Edited December 21, 2017 by Lucius Esox 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn Rocko Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 If the goal is to get players outside the safe zone, then take AI ships out of the safe zone. There are already multiple port battles every day... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn Rocko Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, admin said: We are not sure about it. But we need to force players to rvr. Old players might not like it (and its fine) new players will come on release and will consider this a given. Why do you need to force players to RvR? OW PvP is much more fun 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 Just now, Lucius Esox said: Yeah spendet 2000 houres of playing and now you say somthing like thi its a shame Limits inspire creativity and create better experiences. We know you won't like it first but you will like it in the long run. It just will take time to adjust.. Competition is good competing with other players for port control is better than getting VMs for pve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stepp636 Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Just now, admin said: Limits inspire creativity and create better experiences. We know you won't like it first but you will like it in the long run. It just will take time to adjust.. Competition is good competing with other players for port control is better than getting VMs for pve. 2 We already did this so why the change? Get rid of us? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share Posted December 21, 2017 4 minutes ago, Capn Rocko said: Why do you need to force players to RvR? OW PvP is much more fun Sailing a first rate is a goal for many new players. (not for old players who have seen anything) New players come to the game daily and a lot will come on release When they know rvr is the only way to receive them they WILL participate in RVR because they never knew other options If they participate there will be more RVR and PVP. We must break the existing (bad) paradigm before release. You want it too. If you want rvr and pvp. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iroquois Confederacy Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 9 minutes ago, admin said: it was not clan based and we did not have reinforcement zones before. Reinforcement zones are toxic to the game. The only players that use them shouldn't be able to (traders) or shouldn't need to (experienced players). The ones who need them (new, inexperienced players) don't know how to use them, or are foolish enough to sail outside of their own safety zones Re: How Econ is entirely safe in protected zones: If a merchant is attacked, they can call reinforcements. The list of profit-making goods is irrelevant, as you don't make gold in trade, you make it farming missions. You can 100% build ships safely, and SPECIALTY ships safely, within protected zones. That is a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) 12 minutes ago, admin said: But we need to force players to rvr. Forcing players to play the game a way they don't want to is a good way to keep these players in the game. Edited December 21, 2017 by Batman 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stepp636 Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 1 minute ago, Graf Bernadotte said: It turned out that in every deep water PB 1. Rates bring the victory. Without VM a nation is limited on shallow water PBs. How many of those 300 ports are shallow water? And how shall it be able to qonquer them all, if 8 nations are competing about them, while the 3 leading nations can protect their deep water ports with 1. Rates? Of course they will do shallow water PBs as well. Since they have to shepherd a maximum number of players into PBs to get as much VM as possible. They don't have to win one of them though. Jumping in and jumping out is enough to not risk the ship. Does epic events still drop 1. Rate notes and permits in their loot? Then we could go for them instead. Don't forget the screeners of a big nation. Small nations won't get in the pbs. About epic events: Why is PvE a solution? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HachiRoku Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 5 minutes ago, admin said: We are not sure about it. But we need to force players to rvr. Old players might not like it (and its fine) new players will come on release and will consider this a given. You need 5 people to capture 35-40% of ports on the map. how can you force people to do anything???? You force a british fleet of trash players to loose all their ships and quit game. Give players cosmetic rewards and not something that clearly gives the better nations an even higher advantage. Maybe and just maybe if you reduce the thickness that 3rd rates and 2nd rates have a chance against first rates it would work once BR is fixed to be fair. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiedemann Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) On 7.12.2017 at 11:29 AM, admin said: Update 21st December: Experimental Gameplay changesVictory marks (marks received for winning the map) conversion is now only available for the PVE server This is another extreme. You should keep the conversion option, just make it more expensive like 500 : 1 or 1000 : 1. This ensures that PvE marks has some value and PvE players can assist RvR without actually joining the scary PvP part. This also works as a grindy alternative for small nations/ clans to build or rebuild a RvR fleet. I also like the idea of only giving victory marks to the RvR clans, but some of us love to stockpile stuff. And sharing this stuff with random players is kinda unthinkable for som of the gready bastards (I'm one of these guys). So that makes the conversion even more needed imo. Edited December 21, 2017 by Tiedemann 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Cant you tell by the LARGE number of negative comments that you guys have gone the wrong way here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphic Radiance Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) 12 minutes ago, admin said: Sailing a first rate is a goal for many new players. (not for old players who have seen anything) New players come to the game daily and a lot will come on release When they know rvr is the only way to receive them they WILL participate in RVR because they never knew other options If they participate there will be more RVR and PVP. We must break the existing (bad) paradigm before release. You want it too. If you want rvr and pvp. Be careful here, throwing new guys into pvp is bad. New guys need slow and steady content. They need protection (insurance) before they will start to go out and explore. It doesn't work like that. New guys will never go pvp if they die and loose everything in their first week. You are talking 1st rates will be the main reward. Ok, make them very difficult to craft and easily acquired only by special marks. Don't let alts sink each other and get marks type thing. 100s farm them on daily basis. Ok we have main reward, but we don't have the slow and steady path for new guys to blend into RvR and PvP. I suggest you to let new guys sail up to 3rd rates, everything after that must be unlocked using Special Marks. I mean skills that will let them sail 2nd-1st rates. This will slowly push them to do RvR and try to get Special Marks, unlock skills and start saving for a 1st rate. This will surely work. Edited December 21, 2017 by Seraphic Radiance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anolytic Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 This topic is moving too fast and with too much repetition and empty arguments for me to get an overview and give a concise representation of my opinion on the most recent changes. I will try nevertheless: 6 hours ago, admin said: Important experimental update. Gameplay changes Victory marks (marks received for winning the map) conversion is now only available for the PVE server Improvements Crash reports sent only take into account logs of the recent crash (speeding up returning to the game significantly after the crash) Conversion was removed to increase importance of port capture and victories in conquest. Expected effect = more port battles and more pvp; higher importance of port control and port victories. I realise that you call this an "experimental update", but a lot of people didn't read that part. And regardless, this experiment will change the RvR-game immensely for however long it lasts, and will negatively affect many nations. You are trying to introduce to RvR a ladder system like the one we have for PvP. This is already not a good idea in PvP (don't take my word for it, I am not a good PvP-player, take it from some of the best and most active PvP-players that have written about it on the forum). You are making a ladder system, where once someone has climbed to the top, the ladder is retracted behind them, preventing others from climbing up alongside them. It encourages PvP for the people who already win and already did PvP without encouragement, while it discourages PvP for the rest. The same goes for RvR. The effect that this change will have is not what you expect. The consequences will be: -higher risk, no additional reward. -numbers importance greatly increased -restricting nations strategical options -no gameplay diversity. You either have to do everything in this game (rvr, pvp, trade) or you can do nothing. You say in some posts that not all ports requires 1st rates to fight the PB. But there are not enough shallow ports on the map for everyone to only focus on them, nor is everyone equally interested in shallow PBs. And for all deep water ports 1st rates are a necessary tactical tool. Even if you can do PBs with 2nd rates, even 2400BR ports require access to 1st rates to be able to contest them against all tactical setups that the enemy could bring. The thickness and repair meta has made 1st rates even more superior over 2nd rates than they were before the structure patch. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HachiRoku Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Just now, Intrepido said: A vry good point. The difference of 8 cm thickness (and HP) between the St Pavel and any first rate makes thme impossible to beat in a fleet engagement. anything about 90 is op I think. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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