Cmdr RideZ Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, Landsman said: If he ragequits because he lost his hard earned ship that he worked for a week for then he isn't meant to be playing this game on the PvP server No, it simply meant that the game at that point was utter crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quineloe Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 I had this guy on ignore when his post counter was 10. Good to see I was 100% correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 1 minute ago, Cmdr RideZ said: I think it is more like that some people feel like they waste their time if they play before wipe. Playing video games is pretty much always a waste of time. It's only about having fun. 2 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: There is also a group that does not really want to test all bad features, they want to wait till it is ready. Sorry to tell you but it won't be much more ready than it is now... not sure what you are expecting. They will add tutorial, UI and some more ships, then it's pretty much done... 54 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: There are probably other options to support smaller frigates. OK, feel free to share your suggestion / idea? 55 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: Everyone wants to sail a square rigged tall ship Not really... most of my mates prefer 5-6 rates but the game is kind of shitting into their faces with mechanics like Wasa costing only 200 combat marks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 56 minutes ago, Eleven said: Wow, so much unreflected content in one post... I just tell you how it really is... 57 minutes ago, Eleven said: Enjoy your hardcore game with in total 10 players with a map huge as 6 hours to one edge to another. you will totally like it that way. How would the game be hardcore only because bigger ships are more expensive? Right now i could use 1st rates as fireships and it wouldn't hurt me at all... but even with ships being so dirt cheap, many people still don't want to risk even a frigate in PvP. It's not the ship that they fear to lose, it's the fight itself. Even if you gave those PvE sissies free ships, they still would only run and gank. You don't need big ships to PvP and a skilled player can take bigger ships with a small one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 59 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: No, it simply meant that the game at that point was utter crap. For idiots that grinded 1 week to get a L'Ocean only to roll it out solo on OW and lose it, yeah it sure was... For people that played small frigates and 6th rates, it was awesome... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 49 minutes ago, Landsman said: 1. Playing video games is pretty much always a waste of time. It's only about having fun. 2. Sorry to tell you but it won't be much more ready than it is now... not sure what you are expecting. They will add tutorial, UI and some more ships, then it's pretty much done... 3. OK, feel free to share your suggestion / idea? 4. Not really... most of my mates prefer 5-6 rates but the game is kind of shitting into their faces with mechanics like Wasa costing only 200 combat marks... 1. You dont even care if there is going to be a wipe or not. Why are you still so interested from it? Are you actually one of those guys who are crying after his pixel ships? 2. You can follow the forum conversation and read about it yourself. They sure need to make sure economy works pretty well. There are some things I would like to be changed, lets see how it goes. 3. For example: They can add signaling perk for all, could remove speed meta, limit repair kits, ... 4. The question is what can you trade/craft in the same time you earn 200CM? 38 minutes ago, Landsman said: For idiots that grinded 1 week to get a L'Ocean only to roll it out solo on OW and lose it, yeah it sure was... For people that played small frigates and 6th rates, it was awesome... EVE is mostly PvE game. Admin posted statistics from that. He wanted similar pretty massive amount of PvE in NA. To me this game was meant to be a PvP game, thats what I understood. I would not like that PvP server turns to PvE grind server where you can sometimes have PvP. It is better to have plenty of people who can afford to sail in OW than just very few hc players who have time to do it. Plenty of people in OW means that we actually might have PvP. Are you playing this to grind PvE or to play PvP? We want people out from safe zones, and if not before that happens when people have max rank and ships they like to sail. You cannot force them to leave safe zone in a Navy Brig if they dont want to sail it. I assume most people want to sail square rigged tall ships, that would be min 5th rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 6 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 1. You dont even care if there is going to be a wipe or not. Why are you still so interested from it? Are you actually one of those guys who are crying after his pixel ships? No, i just find it ridiculous that you say it wouldn't be fair if there was no wipe... it would be perfectly fair. Either way it is fair and fine, wipe or no wipe. 7 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 2. You can follow the forum conversation and read about it yourself. They sure need to make sure economy works pretty well. There are some things I would like to be changed, lets see how it goes. Wishful thinking. How long have they been tweaking the game and economy now? 2 years? I doubt there is much more to come, especially since they said UI and tutorial would be last and this is what they will add next... wouldn't make sense to have a UI and tutorial made when there are going to be big changes after... 10 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 3. For example: They can add signaling perk for all, could remove speed meta, limit repair kits, ... You don't simply remove the speed meta... also speed and agility is all the smaller ships have over the bigger ( at least in theory without the speed limit )... 13 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 4. The question is what can you trade/craft in the same time you earn 200CM? Not sure what you're trying to say but 200 CM is nothing compared to what Wasa brings to the table and it's more of a hassle to collect all shit to build some frigate than simply farm 200 marks, especially if you farm them in PvP. 16 minutes ago, Cmdr RideZ said: We want people out from safe zones, and if not before that happens when people have max rank and ships they like to sail. You cannot force them to leave safe zone in a Navy Brig if they dont want to sail it. I assume most people want to sail square rigged tall ships, that would be min 5th rate. So? Not like something like a Surprise or Pirate Frigate are hard to get? Also you'd be surprised what can be done in a prince, niagara or privateer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 18 minutes ago, Landsman said: 1. No, i just find it ridiculous that you say it wouldn't be fair if there was no wipe... it would be perfectly fair. Either way it is fair and fine, wipe or no wipe. 2. Wishful thinking. How long have they been tweaking the game and economy now? 2 years? I doubt there is much more to come, especially since they said UI and tutorial would be last and this is what they will add next... wouldn't make sense to have a UI and tutorial made when there are going to be big changes after... 3. You don't simply remove the speed meta... also speed and agility is all the smaller ships have over the bigger ( at least in theory without the speed limit )... 4.. Not sure what you're trying to say but 200 CM is nothing compared to what Wasa brings to the table and it's more of a hassle to collect all shit to build some frigate than simply farm 200 marks, especially if you farm them in PvP. 5. So? Not like something like a Surprise or Pirate Frigate are hard to get? Also you'd be surprised what can be done in a prince, niagara or privateer... 1. I really do not see your reasoning here. There has to be one more wipe that is announced to be the final wipe. That is how it is. We can agree to disagree here, I am ok with that. 2. If everyone had now the same stuff as before the wipe, everyone would have everything and plenty more. Everyone had more ships than enough and tens, hundreds millions of gold, some probably billions. So you say after economic failure there is no need for wipe? I am sorry but you are not right in this. We can simply agree to disagree here as well. 3. Yes you do simply remove speed meta. Different builds and ships have to make sense. This was better before. 4. If that is nothing compared to what you get trading/crafting, then I would like to see this kind of balance issues to be fixed before release, before final wipe. 5. What if someone does not like those specific ships? Try to see it as a game development for different kind of players. Not only from personal perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 1 hour ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 1. I really do not see your reasoning here. There has to be one more wipe that is announced to be the final wipe. That is how it is. We can agree to disagree here, I am ok with that. The last wipe didn't change anything and the next won't either... 1 hour ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 2. If everyone had now the same stuff as before the wipe, everyone would have everything and plenty more. Everyone had more ships than enough and tens, hundreds millions of gold, some probably billions. So you say after economic failure there is no need for wipe? I am sorry but you are not right in this. We can simply agree to disagree here as well. Same as in 1. ... What did the last wipe change to improve the eco? It added hardmode that people cried about ( like you ) and then they flooded everyone with gold and marks and we are back to square one. On one hand you want a "working" eco, which would mean you don't get everything easy but it will be more on the hardmode side like after the wipe but on the other you don't like hardmode and don't want people to "sail around in navy brigs"? So which will it be? Big ships for everyone or a realistic and proper eco? You can't have both at the same time... 1 hour ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 3. Yes you do simply remove speed meta. Different builds and ships have to make sense. This was better before. Speed meta was always there but it was better before, i agree completely... 1 hour ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 4. If that is nothing compared to what you get trading/crafting, then I would like to see this kind of balance issues to be fixed before release, before final wipe. I don't think they want to change it, otherwise they could have done it in the first place... 1 hour ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 5. What if someone does not like those specific ships? Try to see it as a game development for different kind of players. Not only from personal perspective. Those are some of the best frigates, it's not personal perspective but a hard fact. You want everyone to sail around in 1st rates? What's the point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 1 hour ago, Landsman said: 1. The last wipe didn't change anything and the next won't either... 2. Same as in 1. ... What did the last wipe change to improve the eco? It added hardmode that people cried about ( like you ) and then they flooded everyone with gold and marks and we are back to square one. On one hand you want a "working" eco, which would mean you don't get everything easy but it will be more on the hardmode side like after the wipe but on the other you don't like hardmode and don't want people to "sail around in navy brigs"? So which will it be? Big ships for everyone or a realistic and proper eco? You can't have both at the same time... 3. Speed meta was always there but it was better before, i agree completely... 4. I don't think they want to change it, otherwise they could have done it in the first place... 5. Those are some of the best frigates, it's not personal perspective but a hard fact. You want everyone to sail around in 1st rates? What's the point? 1. I think that fine woods broke it pretty bad. Devs gave tons of ships for everyone for free. Before this kind of additional source of ships and income I always could have use for some extra something. Don't take me wrong, I was not a poor captain before those changes either. So I would say that it was ok to reset it. Clear all that crap and hope devs never repeat it that bad. 2. This is a common misunderstanding in my opinion, heavy PvE grind is not a hardmode. You repeat the same for hours, you sink same bots for hours. Seriously, it is pure grind and nothing there is "hardmode" really. Who is the biggest grinder will get the best ship? Seriously? 3. Before it was way better. It should be even better than what it was before. Devs have a long way to go here. They could start by limiting repair kits. 4. Lets not be that negative. I am sure they will fix it 5. If you like ship A and B, the game should not be still balanced around those. "I think everyone should sail small frigates!" - Captain 'small frigates' Landsman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianaGeoff Posted November 12, 2017 Share Posted November 12, 2017 (edited) 12 hours ago, Eleven said: Results of the last wipe so far: One day of basic cutter madness, one week later everyone is already in the big ships again who plays this game. While that you have the casuals that still vote down Naval Action because of the wipe that happened over half a year ago and ragequit. The effects of a wipe are quite small for the dedicated players. they know how to play to progress and make money. You just harm the casuals. Casuals did not quite because of the wipe. They quit when it became obvious that post wipe, it would be an insane grind to get back into good first rate ships that were too expensive to lose in a fight. It is much better now, but they are gone. But a few trickle back every now and then and they seem to be having more fun. Edited November 12, 2017 by IndianaGeoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 9 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: Devs gave tons of ships for everyone for free. So basically what they did again just recently? Funny you can't see it... 9 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: heavy PvE grind is not a hardmode It's pretty much hardmode... because if you get unlucky you lose your heavy grind gold / ships / progress to other players and can start over... the fact that ships and gold were harder to come by alone makes it hardmode... 9 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: If you like ship A and B, the game should not be still balanced around those. "I think everyone should sail small frigates!" - Captain 'small frigates' Landsman I don't think you get it and i could say the same about you... "I think everyone should be able to sail every ship whenever he feels like it without much effort!" - Captain "welfare free ships for everyone" RideZ. Also i didn't say everyone should sail small frigates. I said if people want it to be the meta to sail smaller ships, then the bigger have to be more expensive and naturally this would favour ships like surprise and pirate frigate because those are some of the best small frigates. It's not only me who likes them - everyone does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 2 hours ago, Landsman said: 1.So basically what they did again just recently? Funny you can't see it... 2.It's pretty much hardmode... because if you get unlucky you lose your heavy grind gold / ships / progress to other players and can start over... the fact that ships and gold were harder to come by alone makes it hardmode... 3.I don't think you get it and i could say the same about you... "I think everyone should be able to sail every ship whenever he feels like it without much effort!" - Captain "welfare free ships for everyone" RideZ. Also i didn't say everyone should sail small frigates. I said if people want it to be the meta to sail smaller ships, then the bigger have to be more expensive and naturally this would favour ships like surprise and pirate frigate because those are some of the best small frigates. It's not only me who likes them - everyone does. 1. Oh boy! Are we not glad that there is going to be another wipe? After the final wipe they cannot do it any more. 2. That is Korean grind mode. The only hard part of your hardmode is to find time to play it, time to grind PvE. Maybe PvE server could have this so called "hardmode". They normally tend to quit after they have everything. 3. I don't want it to be meta to sail small ships, but those should have a purpose in the end game. True, I would like people to have ships so that I can find PvP battles from OW, every day and multiple times per day. Your so called hardmode is the opposite. Most of us like to sail square rigged ships, 5th rates and above. There are some of us who still like to sail something relatively small but I don't know many. Pagan Pete is one guy who loves his Privateer. I would like that these small vessels would have a purpose in NA. I would recommend devs to listen Pagan Pete here, he is maybe the best source of information to keep these ships in the end game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowlplaychiken Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Most people I know will never play again if there is a wipe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 9 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 1. Oh boy! Are we not glad that there is going to be another wipe? After the final wipe they cannot do it any more. Why can't they? 9 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 2. That is Korean grind mode. The only hard part of your hardmode is to find time to play it, time to grind PvE. Maybe PvE server could have this so called "hardmode". They normally tend to quit after they have everything. Yeah, so what do you think would be hardmode then in NA? 9 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: 3. I don't want it to be meta to sail small ships, but those should have a purpose in the end game. True, I would like people to have ships so that I can find PvP battles from OW, every day and multiple times per day. Your so called hardmode is the opposite. Not really... as i said before, people don't fear losing a ship - they fear losing the fight. They only want to gank and win. You see it now in game... ships are so cheap that the next step would be making them free and yet most people hide in safe zones and there is rather little OW PvP. 9 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: I would like that these small vessels would have a purpose in NA. I would recommend devs to listen Pagan Pete here, he is maybe the best source of information to keep these ships in the end game. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowlplaychiken Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Most people I know will never play again if wipe again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 29 minutes ago, Fowlplaychiken said: Most people I know will never play again if wipe again. I know i wont be, if they wipe books. Ships and gold can be wiped but everything unlocked should stay. Thinking about books, ship knowledge xp and craft xp etc. ... maybe docks and OP slots too. This would allow people to at least keep something for the time they put in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Washington Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 More wipes = less people returning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 5 hours ago, Landsman said: Yeah, so what do you think would be hardmode then in NA? Honestly don't know and in my opinion that is not important here. 4 hours ago, Landsman said: I know i wont be, if they wipe books. Ships and gold can be wiped but everything unlocked should stay. Thinking about books, ship knowledge xp and craft xp etc. ... maybe docks and OP slots too. This would allow people to at least keep something for the time they put in. The books added tremendous amount of grind. Decreased my motivation to play as there is going to be a wipe. I can see that you have your reasons to ask no more wipe after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 27 minutes ago, George Washington said: More wipes = less people returning. When there are no more wipes I am sure more people will return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 5 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: The books added tremendous amount of grind. Decreased my motivation to play as there is going to be a wipe. I can see that you have your reasons to ask no more wipe after all. I actually wouldn't mind a wipe... but like the last wipes it should be total asset wipe if it has to be done, not xp or other progress. I bought many books from carebears with my hard earned gold from PvP, before they showered everyone in gold again. If books stay in game as a mechanic, they shouldn't be wiped. I can't see myself grind chasing after all books i need again, and you can bet I am not alone with this... also the more stuff they wipe the more people they will drive away. Every wipe makes some players quit and some forever... if you have a busy life and played your fair share of NA, why would you come back after a wipe? This is the mindset of many i believe. People play games not only for fun but also for achievements and some can't handle losing them / won't bother going after them again... That being said i would welcome a gold, ship and asset wipe before release but if i have to grind my books, ship xp and dock slots again, that would decrease my motivation to play / i simply couldn't be bothered anymore - especially since we get NA Legends soon... there is a good chance Legends will kill my favourite playstyle ( OW PvP ) for obvious reasons anyways and the vanilla game will mainly be played for PvE and RvR. Time will tell... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 3 hours ago, Landsman said: I can't see myself grind chasing after all books i need again, and you can bet I am not alone with this... also the more stuff they wipe the more people they will drive away. Every wipe makes some players quit and some forever... if you have a busy life and played your fair share of NA, why would you come back after a wipe? Everyone knew there is going to be a wipe. If you know that and play and then say you quit if there is going to be a wipe, I don't know what to say. Like I have hard time motivating myself to play as I know I lose my slots that are behind a heavy grind. They should give max slots for everyone already for testing purposes. Improve my motivation to test more Did I quit because of the last wipe? If they do not screw it completely I will be back after final wipe. I have just hard time seeing myself grinding the slots twice. I believe I am not the only one. I don't believe everyone quits permanently. The only reason I see for slots/books is that after final wipe old players don't have huge advantage vs new ones, as we can keep the Rank already. Guys who start to play after final wipe, they may think that they start from the same line with the rest. Probably for 90% of gamers it is very important to start from the same line. No, I don't know the real percentage but that must be really high, I am sure about it. If not because of this, the slot grind does not offer anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landsman Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 1 hour ago, Cmdr RideZ said: They didn't say ship knowledge gets wiped if they wipe assets and also said there may be no more wipe at all. I'm just saying i wouldn't bother with the vanilla game anymore, if they wiped ship knowledge and books because as you said if they were to wipe those on release, why have people grind them now and not give all unlocked until the wipe? Wouldn't make sense, now would it? Especially since people moaned about book and ship xp grind alot. Wiping those would put off a significant number of players of the game yet again. And no, i don't think many of those will come back, when people already cry about ships and gold being wiped... i don't see them wiping any xp ( especially since they said xp will never be wiped ) to be honest... it doesn't have much influence on the economy and thus doesn't need wiping. Also they would shoot themselves in their own foot yet again by doing this and making people quit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr RideZ Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 @admin Ship knowledge and learned books will be wiped in the next wipe or? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianaGeoff Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 11 hours ago, Cmdr RideZ said: @admin Ship knowledge and learned books will be wiped in the next wipe or? I doubt you will get an answer, but I am sure that they will be. They are testing and some books will survive, some disappear and many balanced. So I don't think they will be able or want to save them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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