Proposal for new SAFETY ZONES - Save NAVAL ACTION - bring back PvP !

[Wolfram Harms]

PvP is almost dead now - save NAVAL ACTION - let us have a PvP-Server again

After many complaints by players (me included) about MISSION jumping and attacks on our traders, the devs introduced SAFETY ZONES.
Within these zones, the players under attack can call for help, and a strong NPC-fleet will appear.

As good as this was meant - it unfortunately killed most of the PvP-action. And a PvP-server is all for PvP, isn't it?

So I have thought about a solution and made this graphic.
This idea could bring back a lot of PvP, as it allows not only any attacks again, but will also allow the attacked NATION to defend their people.

The new SAFETY ZONE would be smaller.
It would remain open either for a certain time, like 9 - 15 minutes,
or it would remain open all the time.
However - the open time should be long enough for the NATIONs players to quickly sail into port and grab a war ship, put REPAIRs on it and sail to the BATTLE sign.
I am certain, that now there would be players who would come for help - which would mean a lot of action, if we are lucky!

Only the yellow MISSION areas would be totally safe for those who want to grind ships, or for newbie training.

What do you guys think of it? Maybe the devs will read our opinions?

 

Edited October 4, 2017 by Wolfram Harms

[Barbancourt]

It would likely be pretty ineffective for those of us who don't play during peak times. 

 

[Slim McSauce]

I'm confused. Is the reinforcement zone really that big? I thought it was only for the nations capital

[Barbancourt]

It's surprisingly big

 

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

It would likely be pretty ineffective for those of us who don't play during peak times.

Doesn't that also mean that there's fewer hunters around as well?

As for the OP, I like it, the impossibility for players to defend other players is what prompted the terribly ham-fisted super-AI-hotdrop solution, and this brings it back again.

The difficulty comes in what type of reinforcement we'd have. If we have positional like now, people get extremely fed up with defending again (join to help out - enemy is 800m away and easily escapes - invisibility - rinse and repeat a few minutes later), but if it's fully positional it punishes the hunter too much (suddenly 6 guys join the battle blocking every direction).

[Archaos]

This is not the solution to bring back PvP. I agree that the safety zones could do with being a bit smaller especially in regions where nation safe zones almost overlap, but ganking around nation capitals is not PvP and has done more to drive people away from the game than anything else. If only one party in a PvP fight is a willing participant then it is not really PvP.

The only reason safe zones have affected real PvP is that it is possible to do everything apart from PvP in these zones and that is what people are doing, meaning less players in non-safe zones. There is absolutely no reason to do missions outside the safe zone if your only aim is to grind up slots or to make money and xp, why take the risk. Same with trading, if you can get all your crafting goods in the safe zone why go halfway across the map to get them? These are the reasons why the safe zones reduce PvP. Make it so craft goods are limited in the safe zones, good trade routes are out of safe zones and after a certain rank missions do not give xp or rewards in the safe zone, and you will start encouraging people to leave the safe zones and thus create the PvP opportunities.

[Barbancourt]

15 minutes ago, Aegir said:

Doesn't that also mean that there's fewer hunters around as well?

No.  The hunters move in when the numbers are lowest.

[Hawkwood]

Well,sometimes you can see Combat News exploding, i don`t know how can someone tell to "bring PvP back".

I guess you have a problem sailing to free ports, maybe you are just too lazy

 

[Archaos]

People are always talking about PvP hot zones and where to find PvP, but if you look at the map and see where the next port battle will take place, head there and you will likely find people who are looking for PvP. Dosent matter which side you attack.

[Sunleader]

Same Answer as your other Topic.

Your Suggestion would effectively remove Safezones.

People would start leaving in droves again and the Game would Die.

Thats just not useful...

[Rebel Witch]

Saying that PVP is dead on a PVP server because of safety zones that make up less than 10% of the server. Then suggesting a new safety zone thats smaller as if that will save pvp on a pvp server?

The safety zones are not the problem for true PVP, its a problem for those who want to gank easy targets.

Thats why the Devs put up those large safety areas to encourage MORE players to one server. So carebears and new players have their safe zones and options to go outside of them and the PVPrs have the rest of the map to do PVP.

Lets come up with ideas that make sense to help PVPrs find each other and fight each other. Leave the carebear areas alone, they are not your problem when you have over 90% of the map and ports to play your pvp games.

[George Washington]

The best way to make pvp alive is to make World travel Fast and Keep High Cash rewards. Your zones will not work. 

Right now cash rewards are good, I can get any ship for pvp and not afraid to loose it, but I do not want to spend 2 hours looking and sailing. So, I still do not pvp. 

See my point?

Edited October 4, 2017 by George Washington

[Rebel Witch]

Im starting to agree that the open world sailing speed needs to be increased , we are in testing so why not try it, yep it may help.

[z4ys]

57 minutes ago, Rebel Witch said:

Im starting to agree that the open world sailing speed needs to be increased , we are in testing so why not try it, yep it may help.

increasing speed just decreases time spend sailing = less chance to find people.

Edited October 4, 2017 by z4ys

[Sunleader]

Best way to get more PvP again would be to give all Secure Ports a Safezone again.

So PvP moves to Free Towns and Border Regions. That way People always know where to look for PvP and the area is small enough that you actually find each other.

 

The current Situation with the whole Map being PvP zone is actually hindering PvP. Cause the Area is just so bit that you will miss others.

 

And The few People you find randomly around Ports are usually not a real Fights anyways.... they are just ganking a surprised guy who was grinding.

 

If you really want PvP and not just Gank on PvPers you should ask them to bring back Reinforcements for all Ports

[victor]

Dear OP,

you seem to have forgotten what happened after the "hardcore PVP" summer mega patch: after the first days of testing of the new "super hardcore" version of the game, the player number fell so low so quickly that Devs introduced of a lot of "casual friendly" features, including safety zones. That seemed to have stabilized a bit the playerbase and seems also to attract some newbie in the game (in my faction I personally saw some new names).

So I ask to the OP: do you think that - to resurrect OS small scale PVP for 30 hardcore players - devs will bear the risk that 300 casual players/newbies freeze the account?

Just use the logic and answer yourself.

PS: do not try to use the argument "for carebears there is the PVE server" since it would be too easy answering that "for hardcore PVPers there will be NA legends". 

[Wolfram Harms]

3 hours ago, Rebel Witch said:

Saying that PVP is dead on a PVP server because of safety zones that make up less than 10% of the server.
Then suggesting a new safety zone thats smaller as if that will save pvp on a pvp server?

Why didn't you read the text below the graphic?
It isn't just the same, only smaller SAFETY-ZONE.

[Wolfram Harms]

44 minutes ago, victor said:

... I ask to the OP: do you think that - to resurrect OS small scale PVP for 30 hardcore players - devs will bear the risk that 300 casual players/newbies freeze the account?

No.
That's why I made the suggestion above.

Sorry, but - did ANYbody READ the text?

 

[Sunleader]

23 minutes ago, Wolfram Harms said:

No.
That's why I made the suggestion above.

Sorry, but - did ANYbody READ the text?

 

We did.

And Sorry. But your Suggestion is to Remove the Safezone and just increase the Battletimer.

Thats just Hardcore PvP and will end with PvP Ganking Squads Raping the Shit out of New Players and PvE Oriented Players.

 

So his comment us Pretty Right. 30 Hardcore PvPers will be Happy about the feast. 300 Casual Players will be Frustrated as Hell and drop the Game and writing a Terrible Review.

[Farrago]

Devs bumped trade profitability. Do you think that will bring more people out or are the trade goods still within the safe zones? (I don't know as I don't do a lot of trade runs.)

[Sunleader]

45 minutes ago, Farrago said:

Devs bumped trade profitability. Do you think that will bring more people out or are the trade goods still within the safe zones? (I don't know as I don't do a lot of trade runs.)

I saw the Prices Today.

From what I can tell its an Distance and Nation related thing.

So the Biggest Profits are gained by Trading Goods from or into Enemy Ports.

I have yet to see Good Offers from Free/Neutral Ports.

 

Trading inside the safezone does not seem useful from what I saw so far. As the Safezone Ports only Buy stuff exclusively produced in other Nations.

 

Bigger Problem might be that the best Trades need a Trader Ship and a Smuggler Flag to Dock on Enemy Ports.

 

This makes it high risk and high reward action. But not an PvP opportunity unless your a Ganker who likes blowing up Ships that cant Fight back.

 

 

Would have bern better if they had made the Big Profits available by Trading with Free Ports.

So you can use a Warship for it.

 

Small example.

San Augustin (US Port where I am) Offers Stuff for 1200~ Gold

Highest Price is offered by La Habana (Spain) with 200k Gold. So easily 1-2 Million Profit with a Tradeship

Other US Ports only offer 2-6k Gold not really worth it cuz Shop only has like 20 pieces

 

Edited October 4, 2017 by Sunleader

[Slim McSauce]

3 hours ago, victor said:

Dear OP,

you seem to have forgotten what happened after the "hardcore PVP" summer mega patch: after the first days of testing of the new "super hardcore" version of the game, the player number fell so low so quickly that Devs introduced of a lot of "casual friendly" features, including safety zones. That seemed to have stabilized a bit the playerbase and seems also to attract some newbie in the game (in my faction I personally saw some new names).

So I ask to the OP: do you think that - to resurrect OS small scale PVP for 30 hardcore players - devs will bear the risk that 300 casual players/newbies freeze the account?

Just use the logic and answer yourself.

PS: do not try to use the argument "for carebears there is the PVE server" since it would be too easy answering that "for hardcore PVPers there will be NA legends". 

Stop spreading this lie. It was around that time we had the largest player boom in nearly a year and it held on for months. The population steadily dropped of regardless of the noob friendly updates.

See for yourself http://steamcharts.com/app/311310#All

Edited October 4, 2017 by Slim Jimmerson

[victor]

50 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

Stop spreading this lie. It was around that time we had the largest player boom in nearly a year and it held on for months. The population steadily dropped of regardless of the noob friendly updates.

See for yourself http://steamcharts.com/app/311310#All

a boom that lasted two months is just a bubble; 

Look at July and August data in the link you posted and you will check that all the boom of June was gone in just two months. So the correct reading of the data is: once returning people tested the hardcore mode of the game, they quit within two months.

So, basically, YOU had better stop spreading lies, mate!

Edited October 4, 2017 by victor

[Farrago]

2 hours ago, Sunleader said:

I saw the Prices Today.

From what I can tell its an Distance and Nation related thing.

So the Biggest Profits are gained by Trading Goods from or into Enemy Ports.

I have yet to see Good Offers from Free/Neutral Ports.

 

Trading inside the safezone does not seem useful from what I saw so far. As the Safezone Ports only Buy stuff exclusively produced in other Nations.

 

Bigger Problem might be that the best Trades need a Trader Ship and a Smuggler Flag to Dock on Enemy Ports.

 

This makes it high risk and high reward action. But not an PvP opportunity unless your a Ganker who likes blowing up Ships that cant Fight back.

 

 

Would have bern better if they had made the Big Profits available by Trading with Free Ports.

So you can use a Warship for it.

 

Small example.

San Augustin (US Port where I am) Offers Stuff for 1200~ Gold

Highest Price is offered by La Habana (Spain) with 200k Gold. So easily 1-2 Million Profit with a Tradeship

Other US Ports only offer 2-6k Gold not really worth it cuz Shop only has like 20 pieces

 

Sounds like it's how it should be: biggest profits available for biggest risks. I'm not really sure why you think a trader in OW is helpless. Players have been successfully doing this since the beginning of the game. Should you decide to give it a try, I recommend using ships designed for the purpose, don't overload them, use beneficial perks, plan your route carefully, and keep alert. Your chances will be even better if you sail with a friend. 

Edited October 4, 2017 by Farrago
Typo

[Slim McSauce]

31 minutes ago, victor said:

a boom that lasted two months is just a bubble; 

Look at July and August data in the link you posted and you will check that all the boom of June was gone in just two months. So the correct reading of the data is: once returning people tested the hardcore mode of the game, they quit within two months.

So, basically, YOU had better stop spreading lies, mate!

"after the first days of testing of the new "super hardcore" version of the game, the player number fell so low so quickly that Devs introduced of a lot of "casual friendly" features, including safety zones. That seemed to have stabilized a bit the playerbase and seems also to attract some newbie in the game"

One, the numbers didn't fall off in the first few days, that's a lie/misinfo 

Two, show me where "casual friendly" updates stabilized the game. From steam charts the numbers continually dropped of regardless of minor updates.

Edited October 4, 2017 by Slim Jimmerson