2nd Bull Run Campaign Questions

[kjchan]

Hi guys,

Gaines Mill and Malvern were great fun.  Now I've got 2 extra Career points and 2nd Bull Run is up next (I haven't yet done the 2 minor battles).  Looking ahead at 2nd Bull Run, the army layout is kinda confusing...there's 4 corps slots there and I only have 3 corps.  Should I be chucking all my 2 points into Army Org?  I'm currently halfway on AO, and if I dump 2 points there it will unlock 4 divisions per Corps and 2500 man brigades.

Should I do that, and then beef up the Corps I intend to use for the "Main Army" slot to max capacity in men and then assign the 2 other corps to Vanguard and Rear Guard?

[Hitorishizuka]

If you're Union you can technically get away with only one fully-stocked Corps as it's easily winnable on the first day (with a minimum of bloodshed, even). Either way 4 divisions per Corps is very important, so yes I would say to put your points into AO.

 

[kjchan]

Thanks Hitori!  Plus the 2nd AO point for 2500 man sized brigades?

So if I hear you correctly, put my best corps in the vanguard and seek to crush it on the 1st day?

[Hjalfnar_Feuerwolf]

Nah, I would take the 2nd and in my case 'flesh' Corps. Mine only fields 1-star-brigades, which is enough to advance and successfully assault on the first day. Your elite 1st Corps would only take unnecessary and expensive losses. Just assault the first enemy defensive line up in the north with full force and then sweep south to the objective, at least that worked for me.

Edited August 21, 2017 by Hjalfnar_Feuerwolf

[Aetius]

5 hours ago, kjchan said:

Thanks Hitori!  Plus the 2nd AO point for 2500 man sized brigades?

So if I hear you correctly, put my best corps in the vanguard and seek to crush it on the 1st day?

No - you only need up to the "4 divisions per Corps" level. Watch the per-corps brigade caps in the battle start screen - they'll stay at 20 (4 divisions x 5 brigades) until a bit later in the war, and then they will go up to 25. When they go up to 25, you need to get AO up to the "6 brigades per division" level to avoid being at a serious disadvantage.

As the Union, I usually swing around the left, pushing the Confederates off the objective from behind. You've got plenty of time for this, as the first timer doesn't mean anything - but keep an eye on your back, because the Confederate reinforcements come in around the middle of the second timer. Also, ignore the initial battle: going up that hill is a waste of men and ammunition, and it's entirely irrelevant to the outcome of the battle. (Although I stupidly keep fighting that battle in my videos, as I keep forgetting, and I've been burned too many times failing to take an early objective and losing the battle because of it ... *cough* Chickamauga.)

You do need some experienced troops in the attack for flanking fire and making sure anyone who runs to the rear gets put down, but I recommend at least one relatively green division for the attack through the woods on the left (or right). It's mostly close-range fighting and melee, so it's both suited to units with smoothbores, and produces a lot of casualties.

Edited August 21, 2017 by Aetius

[Hitorishizuka]

If you have the advantage I'd fight the opening battle anyway, especially if you have relatively green troops. Every opportunity to kill the enemy and get your troops experience should be taken, so long as you fight smart.

[maniacalpenny]

As Union I took my whole army and camped the reinforcement spawn...

 

A very dirty tactic, you could probably simply wait for the reinforcements in the trees and fight them instead if you are against spawn camping. I have no mercy in Legendary though. The only tactic that is too "low" for me is brigade combining, although skirmisher splitting is arguably just as bad.

[jamieva]

You don't need 4 corps, I just beat it with 2 1/2 as the union.  First corps swing around from the bottom of the screen and then after the first timer runs out, all of your other troops will show up to reinforce your attack.  Go all in then and you easily will win the battle on 1st day.

[kjchan]

Hmm so looking at the map, this appears to be the first time I'll really be assaulting fortifications.  Can't remember another Union battle that had us attacking this large of a fortification set.  Are they pretty thin fortifications and easy to rush in and punch through like the fortifications the Union has had in the past in defensive battle sets?  Or should I be more deliberate and surround a singular set of fortifications with multiple brigades and massed artillery to force a breech that will get exploited by successive waves?  I'm thinking a my-left against their-right flank sweep through the bottom of the map which will allow me to approach the VP under cover of the trees...

Edited August 23, 2017 by kjchan

[maniacalpenny]

Should work fine. Keep in mind that the Confederate reinforcements of a significant number spawn on the left border of the map, so you should be prepared to fight them.

[i64man]

One strategy I used before is to sneak a unit of scrimishers with sniper rifles on the right side of the map  across the river and snipe them from there while pounding the unit at that position with artillery. Once they break, rush 2 bde forward and take over their position and wait for their counter attack. Once I have their attention I move another couple of units next to the first two and expand the front. Once they break, I swing two more from behind my line into the woods and sweep right to left.

[Aetius]

3 hours ago, kjchan said:

Are they pretty thin fortifications and easy to rush in and punch through like the fortifications the Union has had in the past in defensive battle sets?  Or should I be more deliberate and surround a singular set of fortifications with multiple brigades and massed artillery to force a breech that will get exploited by successive waves?  I'm thinking a my-left against their-right flank sweep through the bottom of the map which will allow me to approach the VP under cover of the trees...

The fortifications along the railway are low quality, and you can overrun any of them at your convenience. The real defensive line is the treeline at the top of the ridge - it's mostly 100% cover and getting up there is slow and burns Condition. However ... if you attack the far left or far right and stay clear of the units in the more central fortifications, you can effectively take those units out of the battle. The AI will hold those positions even after it's clear the line has been compromised, and they are too far away to provide fire support to units on the ridgeline. The sweep works, but it's easier (and safer) to push behind and along the ridgeline rather than to roll along the line of fortifications.

[vren55]

you probably get the  2000 men upgrade but you don't need 4 corps. Not even at Antietam do you need 4. You just need the requisite 3 (I think it's 3 required). And even at that yeah... you only need the 1st corps stacked to entirety. THe 2nd corps wouldnt reach the fighting before your 1st corps finishes objectives. THis is b/c all you really need to do is Human Wave the crap out of the northernmost foritifcations, attack with green brigades first (lined up 3 wide, 4 deep, bunched up is better) by doing the right click and pull command ordering all brigades to march right up to the enemy fortifications, then charge order them.

After that, rest a few secs, repeat with the fresher brigades on the 2nd fortifications (always remember to move arty up while doing so) and then push into forest with the remainding brigades,w here you can just sweep down to the Stony Ridge.

[Hitorishizuka]

9 hours ago, kjchan said:

Hmm so looking at the map, this appears to be the first time I'll really be assaulting fortifications.  Can't remember another Union battle that had us attacking this large of a fortification set.  Are they pretty thin fortifications and easy to rush in and punch through like the fortifications the Union has had in the past in defensive battle sets?  Or should I be more deliberate and surround a singular set of fortifications with multiple brigades and massed artillery to force a breech that will get exploited by successive waves?  I'm thinking a my-left against their-right flank sweep through the bottom of the map which will allow me to approach the VP under cover of the trees...

You can either take a wide swing around left and flank everything and come at the VP from behind or you can go up front.

If you go up front, clear the railway with a broad first push (lots of trees to use as cover while you fight it out). Then stack a column up and attack the hole at the wheatfield on the NE half where there are no fortifications and a couple buildings and you can use that as a wedge to push into the back trees and then down to the VP.