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Simon Cadete

End of the server

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12 hours ago, Slamz said:

In the end, 25v25 RvR in rare-wood slowboats of the most expensive kind is simply too broken for anyone to put up with, and, in what I think is the really sad part, not enough people enjoy open world PvP.

BLACK does not like OW PvP.

Everyone else learned to dislike RvR.

No PvP + no RvR = dead game.

 


So, yeah.

If everyone had come out to OW PvP I think we could'a had fun. Some people were starting too but it was too thin in population by then.

Maybe those of us that like ow PVP should, after the next patch, group up and split up between two nations? (Maybe GB and Pirates, Pirates and Spanish, or France and DN)? I know WO and even some Purge went to EU.  I was thinking of playing my EU pirate more (but really don't want to start over again with no gold or resources) just so I can fight against my Global French buddies. :)

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48 minutes ago, Anne Wildcat said:

Maybe those of us that like ow PVP should, after the next patch, group up and split up between two nations? (Maybe GB and Pirates, Pirates and Spanish, or France and DN)? I know WO and even some Purge went to EU.  I was thinking of playing my EU pirate more (but really don't want to start over again with no gold or resources) just so I can fight against my Global French buddies. :)

On 8/20/2017 at 2:45 PM, Skully said:

Before contemplating solutions, first we need to agree on some presumptions, lets start with:

  1. The game does not model real life alliances at all. And we game by those alliances, not by what the game dictates.
  2. You can only fight who is in your timeslot, regardless of Nation, Clan or alliance. (And yes, The Free Empire is fully aware of this presumption. Even @Jeheil is. ^_^)

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3 hours ago, Australian Minister said:

I can speak of High morals.

I came to you to talk, I praised you for your honesty with your "Declaration"post back in late July.

I even tried to get the Moderators to lock the thread and delete ALL post and ask all to PM each other.

I tried to tell you that this game is NOT Chess game but a game in Alpha/Beta/Early Steam Release Game.

So we the players have as much the responsibility to the health of the game as the Devs do.

Saying that, I feel the original post that is blaming one side or the other is unfair.

Like you said in the post I partially quoted that the "Disgusting and quite disturbing" chat in Global is extreamly sad.

But, the New Unity5 and the DEVS really pulling out an update of CLAN WARS is showing that they are trying to pull this game around.

I just hope and pray that when the new CLAN WARS update comes online that it will rekindle the old playerbase and bring new players on this game that we have such a love/hate relationship. 

But we still keep coming back.

Hmmm... OKEY
I don't even know who you are since you haven't introduced yourself, but if you say so... Okey
I'm easy

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8 hours ago, chailang said:

But what I see is that many unsuccessful people are complaining 

Not unsuccessful, just bored.

CCCP surrendered when we put Road Town into contention. You were bored with fighting NPCs and sitting in empty port battles.

Everyone feels the same way.

 

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1 hour ago, Slamz said:

Not unsuccessful, just bored.

CCCP surrendered when we put Road Town into contention. You were bored with fighting NPCs and sitting in empty port battles.

Everyone feels the same way.

You go on living in your world, and look at your poor port

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12 minutes ago, chailang said:

You go on living in your world, and look at your poor port

CloY6gOWIAIGNxr.jpg

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1 hour ago, chailang said:

You go on living in your world, and look at your poor port

Why do you think ports matter? I've been playing in Haiti and off the US coast for over a month without a French port anywhere near.

I would be happy to answer your questions about how we do it but I am surprised that CCCP does not have this knowledge. We cannot have a serious discussion about game mechanics if you don't know how the game works.

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2 hours ago, Slamz said:

game mechanics

Let's talk game mechanics then.

2017-08-10-ConquestCompetition.PNG.2ac7bf14277942cb774972d9d5d4dff8.PNG

I think we can all agree which Nation has lost the Conquest Competition and should be removed from play.

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11 minutes ago, Skully said:

I think we can all agree which Nation has lost the Conquest Competition and should be removed from play.

I have advocated for reducing the game down to 3 teams myself. I would get rid of Sweden, Denmark, USA, Dutch and I would rework the pirates into being actual "pirates" instead of "British emos who wear a lot of eyeliner and like black clothing".

Or keep the nations -- in fact, add more  if you want -- but group them into 3 overarching teams.

I feel like this game needs to either be a 3-team game or a complete clan-based FFA.

The current setup does not work.

 

Maybe you're on to an interesting idea where a team loses enough ports and gets absorbed by the conquering nation but that's sort of what people have been using their forged papers to do anyway.

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5 minutes ago, Slamz said:

 instead of "British emos who wear a lot of eyeliner and like black clothing".

 

don't judge me :-P

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6 minutes ago, Slamz said:

Maybe you're on to an interesting idea where a team loses enough ports and gets absorbed by the conquering nation but that's sort of what people have been using their forged papers to do anyway.

What's left behind is the casuals and rookies. Hence the Capital should fall to the conquering team. This will slowly bring down the number of teams, unless some egocentric megalomaniac rises to bring about the Nation again. :D

In either case the casuals and rookies would be protected by a strong Nation.

Should all other Capitals fall, then we can call the season to an end and declare a winner. All bow to the e-peen and lets make sure we take him out first in the next season. :lol:

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21 minutes ago, Slamz said:

I have advocated for reducing the game down to 3 teams myself.

 

With the way a number of people in this game just can't stand the smell of each other forcing them into the same teams would increase the bickering in Nation Chats exponentially, with a corresponding increase in the overall salt and new player alienation.  It was bad enough a couple months ago that I deleted the hopeless Nation Chat window for a few weeks.  You'd have to get rid of nation events because of the increased infighting and schemeing and clans of alts on all sides.

 

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1 minute ago, Barbancourt (rownd) said:

would increase the bickering in Nation Chats exponentially

So much of the bickering is actually the result of 8 teams though.

"Attack the Danes!"
"Don't attack the Danes!"
"I single-handedly made a deal with the Danes where they get all our ports and keep them forever!"
"Ally with the British!"
"WHO SUNK MY BRITISH ALT!"

If there were 3 teams I think a lot of the actual reasons that people bicker would go away.

There'd be a lot less reason to need alts, too, as it would be a lot harder to end up with so many teams that need them.

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On 8/23/2017 at 8:04 AM, Slamz said:

In the end, 25v25 RvR in rare-wood slowboats of the most expensive kind is simply too broken for anyone to put up with, and, in what I think is the really sad part, not enough people enjoy open world PvP.
That maybe so, but the whole idea is to have massive battles. People get tired of ganking each other. One day they they want to challenge pure force on force.
I however agree that RvR should not solely base on 25vs25, hence why proposed different mechanic where Screening, Raiding and Conquest gives plenty of fighting for smaller groups of players.
 

BLACK does not like OW PvP.
This is not true. Its just been your assumption based that you are new on this server. You need to read what @Sir Texas Sir said above. When merge happened we had no intake in numbers. GB and US could easily screen us out separately by 2 to 1 and still fill in 25 in a PB waiting for whats left. We didn't want to lose lands, teleporting grounds etc. So we all decided that we need to build foundation first. We were working our asses off, grinding money and resources. We hated it, but in the end BLACK was the first clan to build very first 1st rate on the server. The 1st rate we brought all the way to New Orleans just to help you nation. Then we were the first to build and bring to battle full x25 1st rates.
I think we are the only clan on the server which has 3 full Iron Fleets positioned in 3 corners of the map for fast response.
Yes we got carried away a little, but we also hunted plenty. When French showed up around Mort, none of us had hunting ships in Mort, because naturally we don't hunt around our own capital lol. 
Most of my guys never bothered to grind slots on them all that much either.
The statement "BLACK does not like OW PvP" is a complete nonsense. We love doing that. We did same shit to nations as you did to us in Mort for a very VERY long time. We also used fast ships and were pulling all sort of tricks like hiding in battles (battle screens before patch), luring them into traps etc. And we did all that without immunity of this shit invisibility and speed buff mechanic.
Our guys tried to chase you with whatever they had in Mort, but WO/WO aren't all that good at it :) You came prepared and we were not. It took days to start organizing for OW chasing game again. I personally was fine as all my ships are taggers.


BLACK's plan of "RvR only" does not work in a game where RvR is broken in so many ways.
There is abook Ender's Game. Don't bother with the film as it tells you nothing of Ender and his mentality. When he fights, he plan to win the battle once so he does not have to keep fighting again and again. For this he doesn't simple win a battle. He destroy the enemy. He removes the very will to fight.
BLACK does not plan to play specific type, nor we prefer specific types of game play. We just adapt and thats the key. We had to do RVR to ensure our survival. Now when its done and you start attacking our Capital we had to adapt. We used RvR because we were ready for that to take the heat to your land and took your ports. You were out of Pirates capital on the next day, which gave us and the Mort rats some space. Then we started to prepare to fight you back when you show up again.

The reason why today people dont really bother protecting their home land (same as you never did - we sunk enough mission runners and traders around your capital and surroundings and your nation never bother to response) is because its nearly impossible to catch anyone with invisibility and the speed buff. The most sensible thing is to let them hunt in your capital and just go and hunt in theirs. And thats pretty much what every nation been doing - hunting in pirates and pirates hunting in nationals.


Once invisibility is removed as well as the speed buff and I hope with all my heart that it will happen, then you wont have your immunity. Then it will really show who are the true hunters are.

 

Edited by koltes

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1 hour ago, koltes said:

Then it will really show who are the true hunters are.

Aka. The Battle Camping Revenge Fleets? 

Sorry, i forgot. On global proper Battle Camping Revenge Fleets were never an issue and obviously the many veterans saying it used to be an issue must be nuts or just terrible at the game. :)

PS, back when we could TP i liked to TP back and hunt the hunters. 

Edited by TommyShelby
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2 hours ago, TommyShelby said:

Aka. The Battle Camping Revenge Fleets? 

Sorry, i forgot. On global proper Battle Camping Revenge Fleets were never an issue and obviously the many veterans saying it used to be an issue must be nuts or just terrible at the game. :)

PS, back when we could TP i liked to TP back and hunt the hunters. 

I see what you are saying. But have you tried to play after the last patch when they added invisibility and speed buff on exit? We would never have any issues with Battle Camping Revenge Fleets if there wouldn't be magic buffs like that allowing to hunt with immunity.

There are easy mechanics and balances that sorts all of the issues. They are all sensible and should have been properly implemented there would have never be such issues in the first place.

Battle Camping - sorted by making No Attack - No Join having the same timer as battle entry. If today we have 3 minutes to join battle, then on exit there should also be 3 minutes NO JOIN or attack timer. Then there is no point battle camping in the first place as they cant exit and join battles that have already started.
Revenge Fleet - sorted by adjusting speed of the ships so in the Open World its properly reflects speed in a battle. Fast ships should also be much faster in OW too. We start having problems with people showing up in tanky ships and we cant catch them or it takes too long to catch and they run to free towns. If you come hunting to enemy waters be ready to face revenge fleet or you cant call yourself a hunter. Speed vs tank is the decision you have to make. I do not believe that hunters need any protection from revenge fleet other than having ability to build fast ships that are actually fast in OW too. You take 2 surprises. One is built as semi tank, turning dueling ship and the other is fast racing boat. The speed difference in battle is sufficient. The speed difference in OW is too little. Taking into account the actual speed ships travel in OW the speed difference is not enough to catch targets between Mort and Baracoa which is BS.
Escaping chase by tagging AI or entering missions - will be sorted when attacking AI or entering mission will have join circles like in outlaw battles. Long story short, you can jump right on top of them. Join AI battles timer should be no more than 2 min. This way mission runners can tag AI or start a mission and they will know that they wont get attacked if there was no enemy in visible range. But if they were running from a chase, attacking AI will be useless.
Teleporting - on top of teleporting to your nations owned outposts the game should also allow teleport from free towns to your capital. Issue with teleporting was that you could magically appear and hunt in enemy waters operating from near by free towns. But having ability to teleport to your capital would greatly assist protecting your capital. This also should be the case in the new coming mechanic, when clans own port that is their Base of Operations (clans HQ), they should be able to teleport to it from any free port.
Free Town camping - its no longer a big issue with no teleports, however still exist. Every free town should have a green zone. It is better still to remove all free towns except for 4-5 that would be located in capturable land share one shop/market becoming a global trade hub network.
Battle open timers (those that you have been pushing for 2 minutes) - would not matter how long they are open if ROE mechanics were done properly. Join circle just needs to increase every second.

Here is ROE done in a more sensible way that will suit you and me and will suit the defenders.

2WvPgEC.jpgPUprVdl.jpg

 

 

PjdPHXP.jpg JjQ9iVp.jpg

Edited by koltes

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9 hours ago, Slamz said:

I have advocated for reducing the game down to 3 teams myself. I would get rid of Sweden, Denmark, USA, Dutch and I would rework the pirates into being actual "pirates" instead of "British emos who wear a lot of eyeliner and like black clothing".

Or keep the nations -- in fact, add more  if you want -- but group them into 3 overarching teams.

I feel like this game needs to either be a 3-team game or a complete clan-based FFA.

The current setup does not work.

We've pretty much got the idealized 3 teams on EU, all it led to was GB+Danes (2 of those) trading ports weekly and thus hardly any fighting. At least with more nations theres a chance that theres a real war somewhere.

Hopefully with the patch we're moving closer to clan FFA.

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21 hours ago, Anne Wildcat said:

Maybe those of us that like ow PVP should, after the next patch, group up and split up between two nations? (Maybe GB and Pirates, Pirates and Spanish, or France and DN)? I know WO and even some Purge went to EU.  I was thinking of playing my EU pirate more (but really don't want to start over again with no gold or resources) just so I can fight against my Global French buddies. :)

Please see Koltes post above.  To say we don't like PvP is BS.  I PvP mainly on my second account cause it's set up more for light ships and frigates of the OW style of fighting.  I even solo hunt with that char.   Coming to some one's capital and kiling a crap load of new guys and traders is not PvP either...well it is but doesn't make you the kings of OW PVP like some act.  They gave up after two weeks.  We actually keep to our plans and finished them and by time (2 weeks) they got bored and stop playing and went to EU.  I'm sorry some of the players on this game has attention span of a nat and Legends is prob going to be there game when it comes out so they can get that instant fight over and over.   

10 hours ago, Slamz said:

I have advocated for reducing the game down to 3 teams myself. I would get rid of Sweden, Denmark, USA, Dutch and I would rework the pirates into being actual "pirates" instead of "British emos who wear a lot of eyeliner and like black clothing".

Or keep the nations -- in fact, add more  if you want -- but group them into 3 overarching teams.

I feel like this game needs to either be a 3-team game or a complete clan-based FFA.

The current setup does not work.

 

Maybe you're on to an interesting idea where a team loses enough ports and gets absorbed by the conquering nation but that's sort of what people have been using their forged papers to do anyway.

We tried 3 in with Pirates having there own mechanic in POTBS and while it worked, it really didn't give the big picture like you would want in an OW sandbox game. I think they should drop it down to 6 full nations.   GB, Dutch, France, Spain and US.  US had a big part of the area during that time, way more than Dane/Swedes.  I say drop those two cause of that.  Yes I agree pirates need there own mechanics.  They should be a faction not a Nation.  Maybe them more like Privateers that can fight for any of the main nations (Merc Units in Mechwarrior Online is a good example).  Than if you don't have a LoM than your just a Pirate/Outlaw.   This way you can have your players that want PvP and can move around to get it more than just being stuck in a core nation.  Many Privateers didn't sail under there home nations flags.  Many of them actually got rich by fighting for the other side.  

The other problem is you get a different spread out of nations depending server and player base.  EU players are so against dropping extra nations cause those are the oens they like to play cause it's prob the closes nation to there home nation, but sadly those nations were't big influence in this region at this time.  It's like saying I can have a US nation in WWI battle front type game.   Yah we helped out and did some stuff but US wasn't really involved in that fight even though we had troops, we just supported the other nations for the most part.  This game is suppose to be about the Caribbean not the Meds or North Sea.

7 hours ago, koltes said:

 

I loved that you brought up Ender Games, great book they destroyed the movie which could of been so much better.   It crushed him at the end to find out it wasn't a game all along and he was actually commanding real fleets the whole time and the death of thousands along with a whole race destroyed at his own hands.

What I think is funny it wasn't even two weeks from when they started to camp Mort to when they gave up and run to EU server cause they got board.   Just like the guys that just give up and stop playing after loosing one port even though they have 20 other ports still.   I swear some of the players on here have attention spans of a nat.  We look at the whole picture and long time results of things.  That is why when we found out how weak US is we did not attack them. We only took ports after they flipped and brought two ports into port battle.  Than waited until they did it two more times before we took another.  You think the get the hint that if they don't attack us (not talking about OW PvP) they might stop loosing ports to us.

In real wars there are calls you make and some times it means you will loose lives.  We made the call to tell folks not feed ya'll by going out and getting killed. Just wait and we will see.  We waited and got ready and now look....France PvPers got bored and ran off and than blame we don't want to fight.   Funny how when we are ready to fight or every time we came out you ran.  Ya'll only fight when you want to, just like we prefer to fight on our own terms.  Your doing not different than what we have been doing, well other than getting bored and stop playing after two weeks....lol.....oh look a shiny silver piece...wonders off distracted....

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1 hour ago, Aegir said:

We've pretty much got the idealized 3 teams on EU, all it led to was GB+Danes (2 of those) trading ports weekly and thus hardly any fighting. At least with more nations theres a chance that theres a real war somewhere.

Hopefully with the patch we're moving closer to clan FFA.

What I like is that clans don't have to listen to an alliance and if they want to take a port they can and than hold it.  If they want to turn it into a International trade zone they can. If they want to screw over a nation that has heavy econ in one port than they can take it, turn it Neutral so they stay and jack the prices up on tax through the roof. I'm going to bet you we are going to see a lot of carebears cry when folks do this.  Those players need to stay in the safe ports if they don't want this to happen.  On PvP2 we had the same problem with the nations, but it was more the big nations against the little, but this will allow a few clans that don't agree with the rest of the nations to do what they want.  If a British clan hates the US Clan even though the majority of the US and GB have an alliance that clan can still go to war with the other clan it has a problem with and not involve all of that nation.

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8 hours ago, TommyShelby said:

Revenge Fleets

7 hours ago, koltes said:

If you come hunting to enemy waters be ready to face revenge fleet or you cant call yourself a hunter.

I fully agree.

There is no such thing as revenge fleets, enemy reinforcements arrived sooner as opposed to yours.

On 9/11/2016 at 9:36 AM, Skully said:

We call sailing alone to Capitals, suicide missions. :D

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Just wasted 45 min sailing to my first bottle in a week. 

41 Gold coins

73 Rum

62 Sugar

And you wonder why the game is bleeding........................................................................................

aint doing that again

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15 minutes ago, BallsOfSteel said:

And you wonder why the game is bleeding........................................................................................

aint doing that again

Hehe, hating the RNG goddess as well, but we know fully well the risk/reward of a bottle. ^_^

It just needs some spice. 

 

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15 hours ago, koltes said:

For this he doesn't simple win a battle. He destroy the enemy. He removes the very will to fight.

So.... you're saying.... you wanted to remove people's will to fight so that BLACK could resume what they really wanted to begin with, which is a life of PvE.

You know there's a whole separate server for that where Ender has already "won".

15 hours ago, koltes said:

We had to do RVR to ensure our survival.

I think this summarizes the flaw in BLACK's approach to this entire game. You really didn't. What you needed to fight was the perception that you needed to RvR to survive.

BLACK has tons of alts, at least several in several different nations that I know of. You literally do not need to own any ports once you have that. You can certainly argue it hurts anyone who is not in a clan that uses alts but for guilds like yours and mine, it does not present a problem.

PURGE has 3 people with alts in other nations and that has been all we ever needed to operate anywhere we want without any regard for which nation owns which ports.

You always seemed to think we were meta-gaming the forums by saying ports don't matter ("they're saying ports don't matter because they don't want us to attack them! We should take their ports!"). We were literally informing you of the facts of the state of the game, which is that ports don't matter.


You should have learned to live out of free ports back when the USA was a superpower. You'd have turned into actual pirates.

Ultimately, the only problem I had with the game was the lack of people on the OW to fight. Too few hot spots, too widely dispersed.

Edited by Slamz

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