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Preliminary discussion of the changes to conquest - clan wars are coming

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3 minutes ago, oleander said:

They would have to wipe if they reset the map. Otherwise those that have outposts and ships stored in captured ports would loose everything. I suppose they could be given back through redeemables, but that would probably be complicated to get exact ships with refits and upgrades plus cannons.

They have done similar before when they changed round the freeports and changed the dockyards, they gave people redemables and I dont believe there were many complaints.

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4 minutes ago, oleander said:

It doesn't say anything about outposts or buildings. You can't have an outpost in an enemy port.

Yes, you can.  You just can't enter it in a warship.

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If they can do it without a wipe I'm all for it, I don't want to have  to grind...again. That's just a lot of moving to be done, you're talking about a lot of ports that are going to change. I guess we will see what happens.

 

6 minutes ago, Prater said:

Yes, you can.  You just can't enter it in a warship.

You can enter an enemy port with a trader, but unless something has changed you can't build an outpost there. At least the game has never let me do it...

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So, now you have decided that current National warfare is unbalanced, and want to provide equal opportunities to new players of any nation, can we finally address some long standing grievances over nation balance?

These include but are not limited to:

- Number of ports per nation: i.e. everything belongs to Spain. The whole premise of Historical Accuracy never held any water anyway, because the moment players start actually playing your game historical accuracy with regards to territory is out of the window.

- Regional distribution of desirable goods: i.e. if you want live oak, bermuda cedar, white oak, or teak you better not be Dutch. Really, what were you even thinking? (What? no nice wood in the Amazon forest?) This means that you basically NEED alts...

- Distance between ports. Again from the Dutch perspective. Most of the regions on the map are positively loaded with ports 5 min sail from each other. Except.... you guessed it... Dutch territories.

 

Don't have the time ATM to go into this further, but map balance has long been an issue. I will probably add more later

Edited by Knobby
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  • Captains who are not a member of a chartered war company will be able to enter any port in any ship. 

Are nation capitals considered ANY port?

Where can a free captain setup his outposts? where can  he teleport to/from?

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3 minutes ago, Knobby said:

So, now you have decided that current National warfare is unbalanced, and want to provide equal opportunities to new players of any nation, can we finally address some long standing grievances over nation balance?

These include but are not limited to:

- Number of ports per nation: i.e. everything belongs to Spain. The whole premise of Historical Accuracy never held any water anyway, because the moment players start actually playing your game historical accuracy with regards to territory is out of the window.

- Regional distribution of desirable goods: i.e. if you want live oak, bermuda cedar, white oak, or teak you better not be Dutch. Really, what were you even thinking? (What? no nice wood in the Amazon forest?) This means that you basically NEED alts...

- Distance between ports. Again from the Dutch perspective. Most of the regions on the map are positively loaded with ports 5 min sail from each other. Except.... you guessed it... Dutch territories.

 

Don't have the time ATM to go into this further, but map balance has long been an issue. I will probably add more later

But with the new mechanics you will be able to enter any port as long as you are not a member of a War Company, and I am not sure but I think you will be able to open outposts in any port so it does not matter what the historical map looks like or which nation owns what, it will only affect where you start and from there you can sail anywhere and open an outpost.

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3 minutes ago, Archaos said:

But with the new mechanics you will be able to enter any port as long as you are not a member of a War Company, and I am not sure but I think you will be able to open outposts in any port so it does not matter what the historical map looks like or which nation owns what, it will only affect where you start and from there you can sail anywhere and open an outpost.

Perhaps, but distances will still matter, so if all nice woods are still a long way from the capital of some nations and not of others, there will still be imbalance.

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1 hour ago, The Red Duke said:

Full wipe, full merge, and Pandora to test it. B)

Keep player names.

Xp wipe? I hope not. 

Edited by Lordicious

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1 minute ago, Knobby said:

Perhaps, but distances will still matter, so if all nice woods are still a long way from the capital of some nations and not of others, there will still be imbalance.

Maybe, but where do you think all the big clans will be heading to first? The regions with important resources will be hot zones with big clans fighting to control them, maybe being far away from those hot zones might be a good thing to start with especially if you are not into RvR.

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The more I think about the plan, the more i like it.

Though it is a radical departure from the nation vs nation thing, it's the right direction, good thinking devs :)

I''d open up individual ports rather than regions for PBs also (even if the PB may need to take place in the regional capital at all times): more slots for action on an evening and it can make it a bit more ad-hoc like RvR used to be in the beginning (which was one of the strengths of the flag system).

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2 hours ago, admin said:

Captains who are not a member of a chartered war company will be able to enter any port in any ship.

Potential abuse by PvP non-charter players hiding in "enemy" ports.

Charters can rightfully conquer any part of the map, bringing back capital region blockades. Sailing through National water controlled by a foreign Charter would be a dangerous proposition. 

I like the Charter - Charter RoE, folks should experience it and get to know true allies. :ph34r:

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How about players not in a war company can only enter freeports & national ports.  Other port entry require smuggler flag. (Like now)

Players in a war company can enter national ports and any port that company owns. 

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Just now, Anne Wildcat said:

How about players not in a war company can only enter freeports & national ports.  Other port entry require smuggler flag. (Like now)

Players in a war company can enter national ports and any port that company owns. 

that way spain is the nation to play as no?

 

Edited by Katastrophik
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There are still a lot of issues that need to be clarified and more detail of how it will work in practice, for example how is hostility going to be raised? there was mention of bringing back the flag mechanic, if so more details of how that would work are needed.

Is there a limit on the number of regions a clan can control, and if there is no limit then how many outposts can clan members have as they will need to be able to move quickly between outposts to defend regions. The same will apply to their dock spaces, will ships for the defense be able to be stored in the War Company warehouse in each port?

How many attacks can be scheduled at a single War Company at the same time?

Do War companies of the same nation have to declare war on each other in order to fight or can they sneak attack?

Can other clans that are not War Companies intercept and fight War Company port battle fleets, i.e. can a clan screen a port battle?

If a War Company loses a region, will the same time limit apply to get their ships out of port before they are denied access?

I am sure there are many more questions still to be raised, but I do like the idea of clan war.

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8 minutes ago, Katastrophik said:

that way spain is the nation to play as no?

 

Sure, if you want tons of national ports. Maybe you will want to play underdog, play Sweden, get a massive warcompany going, maybe with members from other nations, and attack all Spanish ports to use those ports and tax the poor Spanish captains. 

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8 minutes ago, Anne Wildcat said:

How about players not in a war company can only enter freeports & national ports.  Other port entry require smuggler flag. (Like now)

Players in a war company can enter national ports and any port that company owns. 

Since nations cannot take ports from other nations. This concept no longer works. Which is my entire point about nations are redundant with this conquest proposal. 

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10 minutes ago, Anne Wildcat said:

Sure, if you want tons of national ports. Maybe you will want to play underdog, play Sweden, get a massive warcompany going, maybe with members from other nations, and attack all Spanish ports to use those ports and tax the poor Spanish captains. 

As I understand it the tax will be on goods traded at the port so it will be a tax for everyone using the port not just the nationals of the base nation.

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3 hours ago, admin said:

Nations will start taxing all activities in the caribbean (stamp tax) on all purchases, mining or forestry and player to player trade

Is this meant to be a money sink? Because it has serious impact on market fluidity. The fluidity is already hampered by the current 5% contract cost (among other things).

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What about the nations regions itself?

When it is like it is now noone of the regular players would play sverige oder denmark, because this nations have nearly no regions. Every regular player would join Spain or GB. Please get rip of historical placement and fix Problems like Denmark and Swedes Capitol are too close together.

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11 minutes ago, Mrgoldstein said:

as always the devs putup  a half baked post, wich causes confusion and many questions and dont answer any of them

The Devs have put up an idea for discussion. Sure a lot of stuff needs to be fleshed out properly, but hopefully this way we will get something that is workable and has most of the problems ironed out before it goes live. If you dont like something then say why and propose something else or at the very least say why you think it will not work.

I would rather they did it this way rather than just work it out themselves and post it to live servers.

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4 minutes ago, Skully said:

Is this meant to be a money sink? Because it has serious impact on market fluidity. The fluidity is already hampered by the current 5% contract cost (among other things).

It will be money generation for the clan who own the region. I guess the 5% contract cost may go and become the tax rate (at least thats how I see it). If a clan start taxing too much then it gives more incentive for people to force them out. High taxes has always been one of the biggest motives for change.

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I like this more and more.

Those who don't want to deal with RvR have the freedom to not be tied down by RvR "clans" and still go about their business to sink anyone they see.

If you eventually feel that an RvR clan is being too oppressive, you can always join the RvR scene and fight for a couple ports to control

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5 minutes ago, Sven Silberbart said:

What about the nations regions itself?

When it is like it is now noone of the regular players would play sverige oder denmark, because this nations have nearly no regions. Every regular player would join Spain or GB. Please get rip of historical placement and fix Problems like Denmark and Swedes Capitol are too close together.

+1

They don't have to all have the same number of ports, but it is wwaayy too lopsided with the usual historical default.

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1 hour ago, oleander said:

If they can do it without a wipe I'm all for it, I don't want to have  to grind...again. That's just a lot of moving to be done, you're talking about a lot of ports that are going to change. I guess we will see what happens.

 

You can enter an enemy port with a trader, but unless something has changed you can't build an outpost there. At least the game has never let me do it...

But if you had an outpost in there before, you don't lose your stuff if an enemy takes over.  you can still get it out with a trader and contraband.  You can't use the buildings if I remember right either.

Edited by Prater

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