Preliminary discussion of the changes to conquest - clan wars are coming

[Ink]

1 hour ago, Slamz said:

Can people from different nations be in the same war company

It is not possible yet but perhaps in the future we will come back to this question.

[Slamz]

1 minute ago, Helbent said:

What does this mean for production buildings?

I was also thinking about this and that all alts will be Spanish.

Unless we can make outposts in any port, in which case I guess alts are no longer needed (except for the usual extra labor hours or "hauling alts", etc).

[Jorge]

5 hours ago, Hodo said:

As Intrepido said below.. NO.

Thank you sir well said.

 

This idea, while interesting would lead to more problems than it is worth. It will just lead to CLANs being the only thing that matter, and national pride will mean nothing.   There will be no point in being British, US, Pirate, or Dutch, they will all be the same.  

 

So why have nation chat then, just have clan and global chat.   

National prides are killing this game. 

Pls admin, change it asap. 

[Katastrophic]

5 minutes ago, King of Crowns said:

if your going to do this you have to downsize the amount of people that can join the battle. I get it.. yall want the big 25vs 25 battles. HOWEVER, 25 vs 25 is not fun for everyone. it takes so much logistics and hours  and hours of planning for that crap to happen. if you going to do this then the max amount of people that can fight the battle should be equal to the number of people in that clan. smaller clans have nothing to do except hunt  pvp. this 25 vs 25 crap has got to stop. IT takes to much and the game doesn't have the population.  you have to find away to equalize the numbers to make it where big clans are equal to smaller. 

i agree,or let the defender decide what kind of PB it will be and how many players per side (with a minimum ofcourse)

[Helbent]

2 minutes ago, Slamz said:

I was also thinking about this and that all alts will be Spanish.

Unless we can make outposts in any port, in which case I guess alts are no longer needed (except for the usual extra labor hours or "hauling alts", etc).

Ya, I interpreted this as port ownership no longer matters. Which means no need for cross-nation alts (a good thing IMO), but it also means people will just move from one port to another looking for the lowest tax rates. My guess is there would be lots of activity right after a reset to claim areas, but after about a month or so we will settle into the same stagnant map we have now, and alts will now be the way to safely store goods (ie take a port, then never use the "company" warehouse, just give it to an alt thats in a clan and have them store it safely for you). If you own the port and are collecting the taxes, then there is 0 cost to you to do this.

[Michael Corvinus]

Bit late on Nations giving up ports to the enemy. British Council are planning to give New Orleans to the Danes.

So now you're going to allow the big clans to attack smaller clans in same Nation?? Lol great way to keep the player base.

Edited August 2, 2017 by Michael Corvinus

[Guest]

Sounds pretty good, a more fluid experience than perpetual wars between perpetual nations set in stone.

My only concern is this - what will the RoE be?

Because it sounds as though the most likely case for access to every port and clan wars is that it would be free-for-all for most people, so while you have access to all ports you're also potentially at risk of "outlaws" everywhere. Something that is sure to create alot of angst when there's no distinction between friendly players, friendly ports e.t.c.

[z4ys]

@admin remember the idea you one had with land permits? Every participant gets a land permit to build a port building in the conquert port.

Maybe its time to resurrect this idea.

Like war companys can build port bulding. Such buildings produce resources which get added to the store. The war company can set prices or at least gets a fee for the said goods.

 

[King of Crowns]

8 minutes ago, Katastrophik said:

i agree,or let the defender decide what kind of PB it will be and how many players per side (with a minimum ofcourse)

CLAN roster can be the number with a min and max of course. say WO has 18 ppl in their clan roster. if they control the region then the battle can have a maximum of 18 people in. 

[Red Dragon 13]

7 minutes ago, Michael Corvinus said:

Bit late on Nations giving up ports to the enemy. British Council are planning to give New Orleans to the Danes

Good joke. Lol

[Michael Corvinus]

4 minutes ago, Red Dragon 13 said:

Good joke. Lol

We'll see tomorrow shall we.

 

[Katastrophic]

7 minutes ago, King of Crowns said:

CLAN roster can be the number with a min and max of course. say WO has 18 ppl in their clan roster. if they control the region then the battle can have a maximum of 18 people in. 

yes that sounds like a plan as long as the minimum is like 10 players that can enter

[Red Dragon 13]

10 minutes ago, Michael Corvinus said:

We'll see tomorrow shall we.

 

Man, the pirates have it as far as i know

I m talking Global server

 

Edited August 2, 2017 by Red Dragon 13

[Hodo]

22 minutes ago, Jorge said:

National prides are killing this game. 

Pls admin, change it asap. 

LOL...

National pride for the nation you play in game is what actually makes this game more than just a bunch of clans doing their own thing. 

 

[DeRuyter]

35 minutes ago, Jonathan Arlington said:

And that's the point. For the people which like "to sail under a flag" it means something to fight together for that. Call it role play romantic but this was a part of all of that. Open world, Nations, The war aganst your Nations arch enemy. It was something to enjoy. This change will kill that instantly and remarkably. It will kill the "Age of Sail"-Romance for a big MMO-Clan-vs-Clan-Battle-Royale which works fine if you play "The Division" or some other lone raider game but not in this "Age of Sail" scenario.

 

I am with you here there should remain a sense of nationality. There have been ideas posted to have a national reputation system which regulates what ports you can get in and what forts fire on you. Also I believe Ink posted that different nations can't be in the same war company so in effect you still have national based companies. So if your clan or war company mostly attacks Spanish ports then you may not be able to enter Spanish ports other than those taken by your war company (maybe allow smuggler trader though).

[Qwolf]

In my view, this would be a huge disruptive change, crush any national spirit that exists, channel everyone into a few, very profitable clans, and be historically inaccurate.  I strongly oppose the proposed clan mechanic.

If the problem is that small nations are undermanned and not much fun to play, here are simple solutions in my view:

Problem:  Smaller nations have no chance:

Solution: Give each nation 3 unconquerable regions to protect smaller regions and make it fun and fair for everyone. 

Problem: No incentive to join or remain in smaller nations:

Solution: Give a salary of gold and/or marks to captains, based on rank, that equals number of regions in a nation divided by number of captains.  Salaries are historically accurate.  Captains got paid.  Make this salary visible on join nation screen to help captains decide.  Big nation captains would likely make less than small nation captains and provide incentive for big nation captains to join small nations.

How it could work: Nations with lots of captains but few ports would get small salaries. Small nations with even 3 unconquerable regions would get good salaries.  If you could make 10x the amount of gold and marks serving another smaller nation, players would consider that in choosing their nations, even things out.  Example:  100 British captains control 10 regions. 1 region for every 10 captains.  Based on rank, British Rear Admirals receive salary of 10000 gold a week.  Conversely, 10 Spanish Rear Admiral captains control 3 regions.  Or 1 region for every 3 captains.  They receive a weekly salary a much higher salary of roughly 30000 gold.

Finally, I continue to believe that if you want improved RVR (which is fun and is working, not sure why some are calling it "broken") you need a way to give nations some sort of national power.  Elected leaders setting national objectives.  Serve two weeks.  New election, new leader and new clan required. Let those leaders use tax revenues and conquest/victory marks from controlled regions to unite the nation behind a common goal.  Options for elected leader(s) 1:  Distribute some or all of national revenue to captains  2:  Use tax revenue to reward PVP play against certain nations.  3.  Use tax revenue to reward hostility points in certain regions or for port battle attack or defense. 4.  Use tax revenue to reward shipbuilding resources sold in the capital or elsewhere. 

Final point, if there are only 3 Spanish players, in a national leader system, that means one of them is president/leader every 4 weeks.  That's a strong incentive to join Spanish, be El Presidente!

[Slamz]

6 hours ago, admin said:

• Open conquest - buy a flag start a port battle (but it is placed for 30 mins to allow time to react)

In thinking about this, 30 minutes is still not long enough.

A single battle in this game can easily be 45 minutes or even more. And then even a "nearby" flag is likely 30 minutes sail away.

A 30 minute flag timer still pretty much requires people to be out of combat and close to the scene in order to have time to react. (Extra true because the flag grabbers will have had hours to get together and organized. There could be 50 of them. It'll take us longer than 30 minutes to bring in the kind of support we'll need to engage them.)

Edited August 2, 2017 by Slamz

[CaptVonGunn]

7 hours ago, Daguse said:

say good bye to the small clans. 

Why? Not all clans are into Port Battles.  

 

  I am more interested in how they are going to deal with none War Clans screening for war clans to keep people out of a Port Battle? 

[Prater]

16 minutes ago, Slamz said:

In thinking about this, 30 minutes is still not long enough.

A single battle in this game can easily be 45 minutes or even more. And then even a "nearby" flag is likely 30 minutes sail away.

A 30 minute flag timer still pretty much requires people to be out of combat and close to the scene in order to have time to react. (Extra true because the flag grabbers will have had hours to get together and organized. There could be 50 of them. It'll take us longer than 30 minutes to bring in the kind of support we'll need to engage them.)

Kidd's Island to Bermuda need at least a 40 minute flag to get to the destination, and that is with Basic Cutter or Pickle.  This is without the 100 ton flag.  Kidd's Island needs 35 minutes to make it from the Bahamas, again without the 100 ton flag.

Edited August 2, 2017 by Prater

[Bart Smith]

Please - no flags again. That was worst idea ever imo. And no 100% hostility eco bomb...

Edited August 2, 2017 by Bart Smith

[VirtuallyIdiotic]

The more I look over this the more it makes me uneasy. Not because it is a poorly conceived idea. There are some very strong points to this idea. Issue is how long have has this game been in testing? You are wanting to change course again? If anything these ideas should be an addition to the game not a replacement to a system. Make the national owners get economic benefits or something. War Companies are able to regulate prices, etc. 

[Jean Baillon]

I like the idea of clan wars but I am also really attached to the nation.

In the new system there should be a way for the nation system AND the clan war system to exist or else the nations are useless.

First there should be an incentive for companies to possess ports of their own nation (a bit more income)

Second the players of the same nation should not be able to attack themselves in Open World ever. If there is a war between two clans it should be settled in PB or other means.

PvP in the same nation will ruin the cooperation between players of a same nation and there will be more ganks as the players of a same nation won't defend each other if they are not from the same clan or company.

To avoid attrition of some nations we would just need to limit the ports a nation can capture to just a few juicy ports with important resources.

 

 

 

Edited August 2, 2017 by Jean Baillon

[Fellvred]

"Current Problems
New player experience is uneven and heavily depends on the nation you join."

 

Some really interesting ideas but it's seems like a lot of development time for adding another level of complexity to a fairly flawed port battle system. I'm just a little confused as to how this will help new players to experience decent battles and enjoy themselves in the weaker nations/clans. It looks like War Companies will still be limited to one nation?

Personally I can't see the new player issue being sorted until smaller ships have a useful purpose in port battles and future raids/large scale battles/missions. As we seem to be moving away from the shackles of historical accuracy maybe we could test out some different styles of port battles with different slots/BR limits? (with 3rd rates being the most common ship for SoL battles, and 5th rates and smaller the most common for frigate/hvy frigate battles etc).

I know a lot of people don't like the idea of 'magical' buffs but smaller ships (if in range) could give things like:

• increased scouting range/details on the enemy ships
• increased morale/reload bonuses
• boarding bonuses
• repair supplies
• increased supply of double charge/shot etc

Hopefully in the future a newer player taking a slot in a port battle/fleet action (with a small ship) would be greeted with cheers rather than the disgust and insults they might receive today

 

[CaptVonGunn]

8 hours ago, rediii said:

How would OW pvp work?

Would it be possible to attack own nations members? So is everything a outlaw battle then?

How does conquest work with this idea, is it still AI grinding?

Sound like same as now except that War Clans can attack each other even if same nation...  So a War can can't greif other clans in their nation unless they are also war clans... (or that is how it appears:)

[CaptVonGunn]

Will this mean a return t NON-Regions? So that the Bahamas for example would be a mix of Pirate British and US and even the Odd Spanish Port? Rather then the current Regional control? This would also make for more chances for PBs and fighting if we were fighting for each port again