Cargo Transfer between fleet ships in OW

[Reorx Redbeard]

Like the title says. I would really like to have the abillity to transfer cargo between my ships when sailing the open world. 

Edited July 30, 2017 by Reorx Redbeard

[Liq]

Agree but it should take some time, eg. 10-15 sec sails down in OW and not moving while your crew transfers the stuff, so you can't put valuable cargo on a fast traders lynx fleet while being chased in OW and then in battle send the traders lynx away

[Sir Texas Sir]

This would be abused so much, the whole point of ports is to do you trading in them not go to some safe spot in the middle of the ocean and trade.  The same goes for fleet ships.  Some one can switch there goods and than dump the fleet ship if they think they are about to get chased or something like that.  That or they will use the fleet to bring tons of repairs for far away fleet grindings and flipping.  So I say no to OW trading between any ships.  

Though I do think in battle they should allow it.  Put a small timer on it so that if your trading cargo in the middle of battle you have to actual stop and trade and that makes both ships at risk and vulnerable.

[Hethwill]

In battle I think you can access the hold of your fleet ships.

Tell them to stop. Sail next to them and transfer.

Not the most safe thing to do though.

[Skully]

1 hour ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

This would be abused so much, the whole point of ports is to do you trading in them not go to some safe spot in the middle of the ocean and trade.  The same goes for fleet ships.  Some one can switch there goods and than dump the fleet ship if they think they are about to get chased or something like that.  That or they will use the fleet to bring tons of repairs for far away fleet grindings and flipping.  So I say no to OW trading between any ships.  

Though I do think in battle they should allow it.  Put a small timer on it so that if your trading cargo in the middle of battle you have to actual stop and trade and that makes both ships at risk and vulnerable.

 

Quote

We also use outlaw battles to deliver and share Repairs and Rum so not to overload our 1st rates which are slow already.

Do I see an issue here? 

[Slim McSauce]

7 minutes ago, Skully said:

 

Do I see an issue here? 

Pirate dogma, nothing they do can be abuse until everyone else does it too.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Slim Jimmerson

[Sir Texas Sir]

Just now, Skully said:

 

Do I see an issue here? 

But that is in a battle that you can join at any time, but he's actually kinda wrong on that one.  We couldn't use the outlaws to switch repairs at that time.  We use open world NPC for that.  You tag an AI.  You capture the ship and than put repairs on it so some one else can come up and take them off.  You can't do that in an outlaw battle before hand as fleets weren't allowed in there and the only way to trade in battle at this time is with a capture ship with no crew on it.   

What I'm saying is that any one be allowed in any battle they are on the same team and I don't think FFA/Pirate battles would count as same team.   While in battle you can stop and do a trade with a team mate to give them some of your repairs, but I would put a good timer on it so it can't really be done in the middle of battle but more for the end of battle timer when your getting ready to jump out.9

Though now with the capture of all 5th rates below it makes it even more easy to repair while away from home.  Hit a trader.  Capture trader and take control of it.  Go into port repair your ship and buy supplies if they have it.  Pop out and hit another trader/NPC.  Switch back to you combat ship and send the trader off with min crew.  Get out of battle sink trader so it doesn't slow you down. 

I haven't tested the fleet thing with outlaw/FFA battles yet.  If they fight against you than it can be abused by bring a low crew trader with repairs.  Board it and get all the repairs off it and leave a little crew and than leave.  Keep doing this every time you need more repairs on your main ship.  Though the trader would slow you down in OP so this would be more the grind a fleet thing than something you would do for OW PvP hunting.

 

I would lock the trade to after the battle is over to be honest.  That way we can trade loot or repairs at the end of the battle.

[Skully]

9 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

But that is in a battle that you can join at any time, but he's actually kinda wrong on that one.  We couldn't use the outlaws to switch repairs at that time.  We use open world NPC for that.  You tag an AI.  You capture the ship and than put repairs on it so some one else can come up and take them off.  You can't do that in an outlaw battle before hand as fleets weren't allowed in there and the only way to trade in battle at this time is with a capture ship with no crew on it.   

Yes, you can. Stuff the repairs in a cheap fast ship and sail to your main fleet. Start FFA and surrender the cheap ship.

I think the question becomes, is resupply at sea a valid tactic or not?

It is a modern concept and has little to do with 18th century sailing.

It's easy to say yes and go from there. If not, then we need to find ways to block it (if at all possible).

[Raekur]

I suppose the thing Skully is pointing out is this again is something that the pirates have as an advantage over the Nations. Any pirate can bring supplies on a Trader Brig and enter a battle with it to be captured and used to resupply people and then either captured or sunk. I think the main issue once again is the convenience that the pirates have over the nations in this. Pirates can initiate battle instantly without the need for an AI fleet or some other hostile target being present. So now we have that to add to the list of things that further the gap between what Nations can do and what Pirates can do. It does not take a major thing to imbalance something, just a few small things can have a much greater impact.

[Guest]

Lets be honest, when a guy is hauling cargo with a trader brig in his fleet and he sees a pirate coming right at him, he wants to destroy all his cargo before the tag. Currently the AI's cargo can't be destroyed so its actually more viable to ignore the player and take his fleet ships. The whole purpose of this thread is to try to let traders destroy even more of their goods which is dumb, particularly since NPC capture is back in and trader ships are worthless to capture OR sink. Only their cargo is valuable now.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Flinch said:

Lets be honest, when a guy is hauling cargo with a trader brig in his fleet and he sees a pirate coming right at him, he wants to destroy all his cargo before the tag. Currently the AI's cargo can't be destroyed so its actually more viable to ignore the player and take his fleet ships. The whole purpose of this thread is to try to let traders destroy even more of their goods which is dumb, particularly since NPC capture is back in and trader ships are worthless to capture OR sink. Only their cargo is valuable now.

Agreed. The transfer of cargo was difficult enough in port during this timeframe and while I have nothing against it in battleinstance I do feel that in OW it would mainly be to rob the pursuers of the treasure - i.e. cargo. I know This because I allways sinks my fleet ship, destroys my cargo and has fireship fitting on my mainship whilst trading. The notion to rob a perfidious pyrate or a bloody brit or a damnable dutchmen of his prize is a powerfull one. I also think that destroying cargo in OW should take minutes rather than the instant process it is today.

[CaptVonGunn]

11 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

This would be abused so much, the whole point of ports is to do you trading in them not go to some safe spot in the middle of the ocean and trade.  The same goes for fleet ships.  Some one can switch there goods and than dump the fleet ship if they think they are about to get chased or something like that.  That or they will use the fleet to bring tons of repairs for far away fleet grindings and flipping.  So I say no to OW trading between any ships.  

Though I do think in battle they should allow it.  Put a small timer on it so that if your trading cargo in the middle of battle you have to actual stop and trade and that makes both ships at risk and vulnerable.

See I think the opposite.. in OW sure but you need to stop for min of 30 seconds before you can swap.. then after your done and want to move again another 30 seconds to get going...  In battle it makes ZERO sense to be able to trade cargo.... the time for doing it is to much in OW the compressed time covers some of that

 

[Sir Texas Sir]

6 hours ago, Raekur said:

I suppose the thing Skully is pointing out is this again is something that the pirates have as an advantage over the Nations. Any pirate can bring supplies on a Trader Brig and enter a battle with it to be captured and used to resupply people and then either captured or sunk. I think the main issue once again is the convenience that the pirates have over the nations in this. Pirates can initiate battle instantly without the need for an AI fleet or some other hostile target being present. So now we have that to add to the list of things that further the gap between what Nations can do and what Pirates can do. It does not take a major thing to imbalance something, just a few small things can have a much greater impact.

actually you can do the same.  Put said ship in your fleet.  Tag an ai and than it surrenders once you leave the battle without telling it to escape.  Battle over the guys still in it can go take repairs off it and be on there way.  

Didn't think of the way Skully put it thought that is one way to do it to.6

[Raekur]

Texas...you miss the point, again. If you read what I stated again carefully you will see where I pointed out that the pirates can perform this maneuver AT WILL and DO NOT NEED AN AI target. This has been pointed out in another thread that you also commented the same on and still have yet to realize that the pirates have a clear advantage in this regard and you constantly dismiss it as being the same for both pirates and nationals. The pirates can do this in the middle of the map where there are NO AI fleets for over 90km at will. How can you sit there and say that the nations can do the same????

So how about this as a simple solution, either grant nations the ability to initiate combat with each other OR give the pirates what they used to complain about before which was the same abilities as the nations, which in this case means removal of pirate vs pirate and then the pirates would be on the same playing field per se as the nations. To continue to state that the nations and the pirates have the same abilities is delusional at this point,.

[CaptVonGunn]

On 7/31/2017 at 3:27 AM, Raekur said:

Texas...you miss the point, again. If you read what I stated again carefully you will see where I pointed out that the pirates can perform this maneuver AT WILL and DO NOT NEED AN AI target. This has been pointed out in another thread that you also commented the same on and still have yet to realize that the pirates have a clear advantage in this regard and you constantly dismiss it as being the same for both pirates and nationals. The pirates can do this in the middle of the map where there are NO AI fleets for over 90km at will. How can you sit there and say that the nations can do the same????

So how about this as a simple solution, either grant nations the ability to initiate combat with each other OR give the pirates what they used to complain about before which was the same abilities as the nations, which in this case means removal of pirate vs pirate and then the pirates would be on the same playing field per se as the nations. To continue to state that the nations and the pirates have the same abilities is delusional at this point,.

Yes Pirates can BUT anyone can also enter that battle while they are doing it.. It will NEVER close...  That is the disadvantage... Outlaw battle stay open.. BUt either way... it should take TIME to do in Open World...

[Raekur]

The problem is that the FFA aspect of the pirate battle will make it very confusing because everyone will show up as red. While this might make things "fair" it will take nation players much longer to get used to it because nations can not create FFA battles to practice in. The other aspect that FFA gives pirates is a better controlled training area where the pirates can control what ships are inside and the BP difference can result in easier xp gains when compared to hunting AI. More so when you consider that once someone's hull gets to critical level then that person is permitted to back off and repair. 

As far as a nation player finding a pirate FFA battle is that the nation better have quite a few more ships than the pirates do to balance the above mentioned training curve.

This is part of the reason that I think the FFA should be open to ALL factions and the excuse that Nation players will abuse it holds no more credit then saying that pirates would not. FFA for all would also help nations deal with the pesky little brand new players who are sitting outside major trade hubs in a basic cutter who will not respond to hails. I have seen to many instances where I pass one of these guys in a trade ship and not more then 5 min later I have a hostile on my backside even after avoiding the typical trade routes.

[CaptVonGunn]

6 minutes ago, Raekur said:

The problem is that the FFA aspect of the pirate battle will make it very confusing because everyone will show up as red. While this might make things "fair" it will take nation players much longer to get used to it because nations can not create FFA battles to practice in. The other aspect that FFA gives pirates is a better controlled training area where the pirates can control what ships are inside and the BP difference can result in easier xp gains when compared to hunting AI. More so when you consider that once someone's hull gets to critical level then that person is permitted to back off and repair. 

As far as a nation player finding a pirate FFA battle is that the nation better have quite a few more ships than the pirates do to balance the above mentioned training curve.

This is part of the reason that I think the FFA should be open to ALL factions and the excuse that Nation players will abuse it holds no more credit then saying that pirates would not. FFA for all would also help nations deal with the pesky little brand new players who are sitting outside major trade hubs in a basic cutter who will not respond to hails. I have seen to many instances where I pass one of these guys in a trade ship and not more then 5 min later I have a hostile on my backside even after avoiding the typical trade routes.

HUH?   You get ZERO XP unless you sink someone... so not sure what the rest of the point is. It is actually very easy to create a National Training zone that is MUCH safer then a Outlaw battle.. You just a single AI combat ship or a trader with a escort.. Dis-mast him then sail off and train .. He wont leave because he isn't a trade ship.. 3 min after you start your battle is closed to the world while you train and repair over and over for 90 min