why bringing ship capture back?

[Slamz]

11 minutes ago, Cimbi said:

You are comparing extrem situation.You should comper same players with same numbers

It's open world PvP.

Similar skill players with same numbers is by far the exception.

Almost every PvP fight is lopsided in some way. A lot of people trying to split hairs over 3% of this vs 4% of another thing are going to be very disappointed to discover that after grinding for 100+ hours with that scenario in mind, it almost never happens. When you come across the TYPICAL scenario -- a lopsided fight -- the number of knowledge slots you have unlocked is irrelevant.

Looking back over my own PvP fights, I'm not real sure I can think of a single one that made me go "You know, we'd have won that if I just had one or two more knowledge slots."

Even for a 1v1,  fights have more to do with maneuvers and tactics than with who has 10% more reload speed.

[Guest]

I'm willing to see how this is implemented, however I think 4th rates should NOT be part of this. They are just a little too strong to be so easy to get. 

Edited July 27, 2017 by Guest

[HarryButpain]

Well, since you have to pay extra to own more than 5 ships I guess it's an okayish change for newbs even when I, personally, do not like it..

We definitely do not want cannon fodder ships that you deliberately sail into the enemy to safe crafted ones, SOLs et cetera. Why not make it so that you can only do pve missions with capped npc ships? That way new players can still cap, let's say, a surprise or frigate on an MnC combat mission to make money in order to buy a crafted 5th for PvP.

Special woods, however, make 5th rates and above so expensive, and, perhaps, devs wanna consider to tweak prices there a little to boost the sale of crafted ships for reasonable prices that even new players can afford instead of simply screwing the entire ship market even further by allowing capped npc ships in pvp? 

And make it possible to search with trader tool for crafted ships and cannons to encourage a player driven economy (People in nation chat are alrdy complaining that nobody buys their cannons)!

Edited July 27, 2017 by HarryButpain

[Souvlaki]

I assume the problem they are trying to correct is that ships are too expensive or not available for newer players. This I think is as a result of ship building becoming overly burdensome. I cannot for the life of me understand why no crafting XP is given for sub-components. This would make it easier for players to rise in crafting rank and to produce decent ships that are in demand among mid-tier players (5th and 4th rates). Not only that, but in the process the market might actually have more sub-components available, also reducing the cost of ships and allowing existing builders to build more. Fix the root of the problem rather than just putting a band-aide on the issue.

[Sven Silberbart]

"Fix the root of the problem" +1

[Skully]

4 hours ago, Souvlaki said:

I assume the problem they are trying to correct is that ships are too expensive or not available for newer players. This I think is as a result of ship building becoming overly burdensome. I cannot for the life of me understand why no crafting XP is given for sub-components. This would make it easier for players to rise in crafting rank and to produce decent ships that are in demand among mid-tier players (5th and 4th rates). Not only that, but in the process the market might actually have more sub-components available, also reducing the cost of ships and allowing existing builders to build more. Fix the root of the problem rather than just putting a band-aide on the issue.

If we are talking root cause of why it is a overly burden to craft ships, then I would say the friction on the market is way too high.

On 7/11/2016 at 5:14 PM, Skully said:

To get a liquid flexible frictionless market, I've the economics patch proposal open at http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/15098-economics-patch-proposal/

[Captain MiniMe]

Sorry to jump in, possibly already answered but can't find it in these 4 pages.
Up to 4th rates, does this include or exclude 4th rates? 

[AlteSocken]

4 minutes ago, Captain MiniMe said:

Sorry to jump in, possibly already answered but can't find it in these 4 pages.
Up to 4th rates, does this include or exclude 4th rates? 

I guess we need to wait for the patchnotes to know ... or for reports of ingame testing :-/

[Captain MiniMe]

2 minutes ago, AlteSocken said:

I guess we need to wait for the patchnotes to know ... or for reports of ingame testing :-/

I am a verry impatient man, I hate waiting. ^^

[Vizzini]

One step forwards and then two steps backwards ....

 

everytime ...

[Cimbi]

10 hours ago, Slamz said:

It's open world PvP.

Similar skill players with same numbers is by far the exception.

Almost every PvP fight is lopsided in some way. A lot of people trying to split hairs over 3% of this vs 4% of another thing are going to be very disappointed to discover that after grinding for 100+ hours with that scenario in mind, it almost never happens. When you come across the TYPICAL scenario -- a lopsided fight -- the number of knowledge slots you have unlocked is irrelevant.

Looking back over my own PvP fights, I'm not real sure I can think of a single one that made me go "You know, we'd have won that if I just had one or two more knowledge slots."

Even for a 1v1,  fights have more to do with maneuvers and tactics than with who has 10% more reload speed.

You missed the point.I didn't say you don't need your brain if you are sitting in a 3/5 ship.I said it's give you an advantage.This advantage can be very small like 2% speed buff or can be huge like marines in boarding.So if every crafted ship is 3/5 and I don't have to spend 100+ hours unlock this slots probably I will be using crafted ship but If crafted ship just give me 3 permanent slots I won't buy them because it's not worth it.

[HachiRoku]

Yes yes yes give people expandable ships so i get more pvp. I dont give a hello kitty what im fighting as long as i have a fight

[Bart Smith]

Im not a fan of npc capture in NA. Step back if you ask me.

Edited July 27, 2017 by Bart Smith

[Wind Catcher]

To all those who are saying do not bring free ships back. Check Steam rating and read reviews. It is 'Mostly Negative' with people complaining about long grind, everything is too expensive and takes too much time, so keep fighting here while game is being rated with thumbs down. I believe free NPC ships up to 4th rate is a must. 

Edited July 27, 2017 by Wind Catcher

[Captain MiniMe]

I like it,

all it'll do is give lower ranked players some toys to play with. Makes it more open for them to lose a ship to gankers.
It'll disencourage the gankers to go for lower players as they might cap a wortheless ship and lose time.
It'll give clans some breathing room from having to provide low level ships every day because lower ranks lost them (which is all fine, everyone needs to learn) but it'll alleviate some of the pressure.
It'll give PVE'ers some additional value to go and cap AI ships for lower ranked clan members.
It won't saturat the market because the quality of the ships is low, so decent ships will still need to be made and it's restricted to 4th rates (up to or included remains to be seen).

I believe this is a good thing.

[z4ys]

16 minutes ago, Wind Catcher said:

To all those who are saying do not bring free ships back. Check Steam rating and read reviews. It is 'Mostly Negative' with people complaining about long grind, everything is too expensive and takes too much time, so keep fighting here while game is being rated with thumbs down. I believe free NPC ships up to 4th rate is a must. 

Because people want something like WoT. So they can hope in play 15min die and do something else. Thats called Naval Action Legends in will come out. So why make both games the same way again?  I thought the purpose of the hole split is to make 2 unique games. One focused on sailing,trading and OW the other one on shooting and even BR fights.

I dont understand why we have to make Naval Action OW a hybrid again.

Edited July 27, 2017 by z4ys

[Wind Catcher]

10 minutes ago, z4ys said:

Because people want something like WoT. So they can hope in play 15min die and do something else. Thats called Naval Action Legends in will come out. So why make both games the same way again?  I thought the purpose of the hole split is to make 2 unique games. One focused on sailing,trading and OW the other one on shooting and even BR fights.

I dont understand why we have to make Naval Action OW a hybrid again.

Well I played this game when it first released and it was great, then someone decided to make it a long grind and this is the result I think. I hope they bring back what people liked, because unfortunately it's too difficult for any new or casual player. We can't have 300 people per server in this huge open world, it won't work. Naval Action Legends is for Vets to have fun, the rest of population will require content that is casual player friendly. 

Edited July 27, 2017 by Wind Catcher

[z4ys]

1 minute ago, Wind Catcher said:

...Devs made it a long grind...

Why is the game a grind?

Because you need ship knowledge? - Its not necessary ( I am sailing most of the time a cerb since the wipe and i am still at 4 slots they arent that important like people do)

Because you need money? You can capture player ships and sell them for a lot of money to your nation (Thats fun + reward)

Because you need to haul stuff for building ships? For building 6-5 rates (which the capture is all about) you dont have to leave your capital waters everything you need in close by. Where is the grind?

Because you need to be max rank? Its easy to have fun on the low ranks as well. Nobody needs a speed fitted coni and the rank of an  admiral to do pvp. A brig /niagara /snow is fine for hunting as well.

 

What do people do when they join the game? They asked around. And what do we tell them? You need this that and that. Ofc they fall in the grind mode. But thats not the game fault its our own fault, because we think bigger is always better.

And one last thing. I dont know why people expect not to sail in an OW sailing game?

 

[Capn Rocko]

Please do not bring back ai ship capture! I enjoy being a shipbuilder for people and my economy relies on it.  Now all someone needs to do is run a mission and they get a free ship 

[Captain MiniMe]

5 minutes ago, Capn Rocko said:

Please do not bring back ai ship capture! I enjoy being a shipbuilder for people and my economy relies on it.  Now all someone needs to do is run a mission and they get a free ship 

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

SPOC

Edited July 27, 2017 by Captain MiniMe

[Capn Rocko]

Just now, Captain MiniMe said:

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

and what are the needs of the many? Free ships? lol

Anything under 5th rate, I build practically for free (to my clanmates) anyways. I understand if its to help players start off but don't give them free surprises and constitutions. Some of the 4th and 5th rates require permits (combat marks). I guarantee some people will opt for a free ship instead of paying 75 combat marks + 100-200k for a ship that will inevitably get lost in battle. Not to mention, suicide runs into enemy territory with no financial risk...

[Baptiste Gallouédec]

 The only inbalance in eco is that pve at high rank is like printing money, while a noob basic cutter can have hard time sinking a rookiesnow and then replacing any smallship lost in pve.

Give the lowest mission level better gold rewards & drop, maybe weaker opposition.

Give gold for participation/ sails damages /assists  in pvp  for 6th & 7th rank ships.

Add a ship / cannon buy contract in ports.

 

If you bring back npc capture, make it so you can't leave a port with it: you can just bring it to port to carry it's cargo, then you must brake it for parts or sell it to port for extra gold. I think that would be the best compromise.

[Wind Catcher]

1 hour ago, z4ys said:

Why is the game a grind?

Because you need ship knowledge? - Its not necessary ( I am sailing most of the time a cerb since the wipe and i am still at 4 slots they arent that important like people do)

Because you need money? You can capture player ships and sell them for a lot of money to your nation (Thats fun + reward)

Because you need to haul stuff for building ships? For building 6-5 rates (which the capture is all about) you dont have to leave your capital waters everything you need in close by. Where is the grind?

Because you need to be max rank? Its easy to have fun on the low ranks as well. Nobody needs a speed fitted coni and the rank of an  admiral to do pvp. A brig /niagara /snow is fine for hunting as well.

 

What do people do when they join the game? They asked around. And what do we tell them? You need this that and that. Ofc they fall in the grind mode. But thats not the game fault its our own fault, because we think bigger is always better.

And one last thing. I dont know why people expect not to sail in an OW sailing game?

 

Once you sink, it's a very long and painful road to get back into your favorite ship. It could take the whole week for 1 account to restore everything lost. Not many like it, so with free NPC capture time to go back into pvp is reduced. Not only that people will feel more comfortable knowing they can quickly get into a ship they like and start sailing again. providing more targets and action on OS. 

When right now after you sink, you log in just to find out you need to spend hours hauling just to craft 1 dura boat what happens then? you log out or quit the game. 

Edited July 27, 2017 by Wind Catcher

[Wind Catcher]

1 hour ago, rediii said:

 I play pvp on my 1 slot vic, 1 slot reno, 1 slot bellona and 3 slot suprise ... you dont need that shit guys.

Good for you, but new players struggle to get past surprise. We are not talking about Veteran players like you, we are talking about life and death of Naval Action here. Game has cancer and that cancer is produced by 'hardcore' players who made this game unplayable for the rest of the world. Sometimes you have to allow changes that would support game population and it's health. 

Edited July 27, 2017 by Wind Catcher

[z4ys]

21 minutes ago, Wind Catcher said:

Good for you, but new players struggle to get past surprise. We are not talking about Veteran players like you, we are talking about life and death of Naval Action here. Game has cancer and that cancer is produced by 'hardcore' players who made this game unplayable for the rest of the world. Sometimes you have to allow changes that would support game population and it's health. 

yeah but instead of leaving while its so called hardcore people would leave because they would get trolled and griefted.

And when you get everything placed in your mouth then the game is boring as hell. Going out rageboard and have a new ship isnt an achivement.

Edited July 27, 2017 by z4ys