Patch 10.3 - New event, PvP marks changes, changes to knowledge slots and other fixes

[vazco]

35 minutes ago, Peter Goldman said:

Wait, are you trying to tell me that PFK was a PvP Clan? I think that any PvP players from PFK actually went pirate.

No, they didn't, at any point in last 2 years. I know only about one guy that went pirate. We had a quite good group, until latest changes inclined most people to focus on PvE again, at least for now. We also had a good core group doing PvP for all this time. In fact we even have pirate players coming to us, trying to get to PvP action... as spies.

 

2 hours ago, Simon Cadete said:

Maybe some kind of reputation system would be nice as well

Yes, it would. I call this "renown".

[Elbizor]

2 hours ago, The Red Duke said:

That is a good point. 

Question Do you consider good or bad that you are open to attack when you are unwilling to be attacked ?

How do you know for sure that you won't cross a enemy sailing out ?

With teleport there is a assurance you won't be attacked.

I see that as limitative as it removes half the pvp opportunities. You know, the ones where you are unwilling to pvp but the enemies are willing to pvp.

 

because they want to be able to base in a Freeport deep in enemy waters for easy ganks but be able to tp home when they want.

 

[Bach]

It's only been a few days but we are starting to see an increase in PvP on the OS or at least players traveling around in Pvp boats.  The average boat size has increased as we now see Endy and Connies more often.  It seems to be causing the formerly dominant Aggy builders with CMs get less brave as smaller groups with Connies can threaten more than the old groups in frigates.  So good or bad this patch remains to be seen yet but it's showing potential.

The only major down side was the not having a warning on the PvP -> Combat mark conversion so some players got the short end of the stick.  I agree.  I spoke against it. You spoke against it. We had our say. Now get over it. None of us actually PvP for rewards anyway. Whatever you built up in the last few weeks will be replaced in the next as more targets are hitting the seas now. We PvP for that thrill and that victorious feeling. Truth is, that if there was no rewards for PvP we would still be doing it.  So let it go and let's move on.

[Bach]

7 minutes ago, Elbizor said:

because they want to be able to base in a Freeport deep in enemy waters for easy ganks but be able to tp home when they want.

 

This can be successfully done. WO proved it. Those guys worked Free Ports successfully for weeks racking up interdiction kills deep in enemy territory.

[Elbizor]

 

2 minutes ago, Bach said:

This can be successfully done. WO proved it. Those guys worked Free Ports successfully for weeks racking up interdiction kills deep in enemy territory.

WO?  half  the  pvpers in the game used free ports before the wipe as easy access to soft targets!

[Slamz]

7 hours ago, Aphilas said:

You realize that in battles like this everyones uses up 40-50 hull repairs, 15-30 rig repairs and 100+ rum? At current prices that is around 80-100k. Multiply that by 15 people participating in battle on our side. That's 1.2-1.5 mill spent on consumables alone. Lost 4 ships, capped 7, so differece i 3 ships.

And other side got nothing at all while had, I asume, around 8-12 mill worth of losses.

So you're saying PvP is Serious Business and actually matters??

It's not just World of Warcraft where we all run in circles and bop each other and graveyard rush until we get bored with it?

I'm getting more excited for this game every day!

[Bach]

7 minutes ago, Elbizor said:

 

WO?  half  the  pvpers in the game used free ports before the wipe as easy access to soft targets!

Yes but WO did it AFTER the wipe and that's a much higher level of coordination to pull off.

[Elbizor]

2 minutes ago, Bach said:

Yes but WO did it AFTER the wipe and that's a much higher level of coordination to pull off.

That's how it should be, none of this easy tp to Freeport -gank someone-  tp back.

Every nation has a port next the port of another nation

[Hodo]

14 hours ago, Slamz said:

So you're saying that as a Lynx or Privateer you can still capture a ship that instantly exceeds the value of the ship you were using for PvP.

I don't see the problem.

If you sailed a Constitution you could capture Indiamen, probably 2-3 at a time, and again instantly exceed the value of the ship you were using for PvP.

Yes it's scaling but it's supposed to. You're not supposed to easily bring in a 500k ship with a ship that costs 25k to click out. But if you can bring in a 40k ship with a 25k ship then you're doing pretty good, I'd say.

 

Same reason you can't make a lot of profit in a Trader Lynx but you can do really well in triple Indiamen.

LOL you have never hunted have you?

In real life or in this game.  It isnt just about the profit or the kill.   While I can go out and easily take a LGV NPC in a Cutter and make bank and never have to pay a dime for repairs.   But that isnt really fun for me.  It isnt fun for anyone except the simple gamer.

I could blow nearly a million on a Constitution to go hunt with.  And maybe just maybe run across an indiamen once in a blue moon.  AND if it is loaded with valuable cargo I might be able to pay off the ship and make profit for the trip.  Seeing as the cost of a Constitution on the market ranges around 1mil, then the cost of guns, is close to another million if you buy longs off of players on the market.   So you are looking at a 2mil ship, that NEEDs to make 2mil to break even.  Then you need to make up for any damages sustained and time at sea to match overhead.    I usually factor 7.5K per ship rating per real life hour.  So a 7th rate can make 7.5k in an hour running single combat orders, a 6th rate can make 15k, and so on.  So a Constitution is a 4th rate 4*7.5= 30k per hour+ 2mil ship cost + repairs.  

So my overhead in the Constitution is considerably higher than you think.  An empty Indiamen is only going to sell for about 600k on the market maybe 1.5mil IF I am luck and price gouging.   Then I have to factor in shop fees.

Maybe my purser and I spend to much time together but I am not seeing how my profit margins are better in the Constitution vs the Lynx or Privateer, if anything they are about the same.

 

 

[Hodo]

4 hours ago, DrZoidberg said:

Nowdays u cannot make games succesfull, if u force player into boring actions for hours without ensure the succes. It just will slowly kill the populaton. I dont say OS sailing is useless, but after exploring the map (outpost making).

Eve does it.

No teleporting unless you have jump clones.  AND gate camping is a thing.

[Slamz]

8 minutes ago, Hodo said:

 It isnt just about the profit or the kill.

You're right.

It's about crushing your enemies, seeing them driven before you and hearing the lamentation of their women.

You worry too much about profits. War is always an expense. How you make your money to afford your war is the real question you should be asking.

[Hodo]

59 minutes ago, Slamz said:

You're right.

It's about crushing your enemies, seeing them driven before you and hearing the lamentation of their women.

You worry too much about profits. War is always an expense. How you make your money to afford your war is the real question you should be asking.

There are a few rules to being a successful privateer.

- Anything stolen is pure profit

-Fear makes a good business partner

-War is good for business

-Peace is good for business

-Beware of small expenses: a small leak will kill a ship

These are from the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition and they apply quite well here.

 

[Qwolf]

1 hour ago, Slamz said:

You worry too much about profits. War is always an expense. How you make your money to afford your war is the real question you should be asking.

Don't traders have fun doing trade runs of Georgia Clay and Virgin Island Sunscreen or whatever from port to port?  And don't the people that love missions enjoy running missions?  So why is that warfighters are told over and over again in this forumn that "having fun doing PvP is reward enough"?  Traders and Grinders are allowed to have fun and GET PAID, but not PvP players?

[Nelson Hornblower]

@adminIf you are going to have an event. I'd recommend to have the ship wreck refilled every hour or so. It's silly to have it there for one or two people get it when they see it and then it's empty the rest of the time. Replenish the wreck so it continues to draw people out to fight over it.

[Luc]

Just wondering. Will there be a rebellion and the pirates are splitting in one faction and the rest scramble to individuals. 

[DrZoidberg]

Dear Developers!

I think u must support easier OS sailing, and u must support PVP. This is the 2 main reason if player leak happens.

Please enable automatic movement between outpost to ships without cargo. They should move till next server restart or till 1 day real time (24 h).

To support PVP: Let make outposts in freetown, and let players teleport to thier ships. I understand, that u dont want to threaten nooby PVE players by ganks. The solution is easie. To make an outpost in freetown should be far more expensive, than in homeport. Like 100-500 K gold. So players can have 1-2 max, and to move it will be very expensive. PVP marks should worth at least 5, but better if 10 PVP mark.

Thx for attention.

[EL LOCO]

Loss of 300 players since patch PVP1 at peak .  Ouch.   No PVP .   Ouch.    Bad mistake.     Now everyone will have unlocked 5 slots.   

That was a bad decision to remove PVP marks.

[Fengist]

Grind -1?

Thank you!

[Qwolf]

One final (perhaps) thought on this topic of rewards for different styles of play:  If I were the hypothetical King of England, I'd rank the priorities of my subjects as follows:

1. Fighting my enemies.  Attacking trading, defending trading, and attacking and defending ports.  Building and defending an empire.

2. Crafting ships, modules, and cannons and bringing them to the player market to support #1.

3. Gathering and bringing to the player market all the resources needed for #2.

I would not care much about:

4. Attacking AI bot ships for target practice.  Practice is helpful for future warfighters, XP is kinda helpful for future warfighters, and gold is helpful for individual players, but mostly meaningless for national goals.

5. Trading Panamanian Hats and Havana Mojitos from port to port.  Earned money is helpful to individual players, but actual trade of trade goods to the AI is mostly meaningless for national goals.

So if the point of the game is to work as a nation to accomplish national goals, #1-3 should be appropriately rewarded to incentivize players to work in the national interest.  I think the concern expressed here is that presently, the game (the King so to speak) seems to richly reward #4 and #5 while making #1 - 3 less rewarding.  My feeling is that many players want to help the national cause by doing #1-3, but dislike the fact that the reward structure forces players or encourages them to do their own thing and ignore the national interest things.  I mean, setting aside the PvP complaints that have been said before, consider Iron. Iron is being sold to the AI by the thousands in far away ports because its far more rewarding to sell to the AI than put it on the market for players to build ships and cannons.  If you can sell to the AI for 106 right away but to players for 80 in a couple of days, why would you sell to players? 

My respectful recommendation is that the developers consider that the rewards system (marks, gold, XP, etc) should match the rewards a hypothetical government would give for player actions.  They would reward actions in the national interest, and do so based on the relative risk to the player and benefit to the national interest. 

[Fengist]

2 hours ago, Qwolf said:

Don't traders have fun doing trade runs of Georgia Clay and Virgin Island Sunscreen or whatever from port to port?  And don't the people that love missions enjoy running missions?  So why is that warfighters are told over and over again in this forumn that "having fun doing PvP is reward enough"?  Traders and Grinders are allowed to have fun and GET PAID, but not PvP players?

Because you were paid in a currency that non pvp players couldn't get which gave you an unfair advantage over them.

[Fengist]

4 minutes ago, Qwolf said:

One final (perhaps) thought on this topic of rewards for different styles of play:  If I were the hypothetical King of England, I'd rank the priorities of my subjects as follows:

1. Fighting my enemies.  Attacking trading, defending trading, and attacking and defending ports.  Building and defending an empire.

2. Crafting ships, modules, and cannons and bringing them to the player market to support #1.

3. Gathering and bringing to the player market all the resources needed for #2.

I would not care much about:

4. Attacking AI bot ships for target practice.  Practice is helpful for future warfighters, XP is kinda helpful for future warfighters, and gold is helpful for individual players, but mostly meaningless for national goals.

5. Trading Panamanian Hats and Havana Mojitos from port to port.  Earned money is helpful to individual players, but actual trade of trade goods to the AI is mostly meaningless for national goals.

So if the point of the game is to work as a nation to accomplish national goals, #1-3 should be appropriately rewarded to incentivize players to work in the national interest.  I think the concern expressed here is that presently, the game (the King so to speak) seems to richly reward #4 and #5 while making #1 - 3 less rewarding.  My feeling is that many players want to help the national cause by doing #1-3, but dislike the fact that the reward structure forces players or encourages them to do their own thing and ignore the national interest things.  I mean, setting aside the PvP complaints that have been said before, consider Iron. Iron is being sold to the AI by the thousands in far away ports because its far more rewarding to sell to the AI than put it on the market for players to build ships and cannons.  If you can sell to the AI for 106 right away but to players for 80 in a couple of days, why would you sell to players? 

My respectful recommendation is that the developers consider that the rewards system (marks, gold, XP, etc) should match the rewards a hypothetical government would give for player actions.  They would reward actions in the national interest, and do so based on the relative risk to the player and benefit to the national interest. 

You assume everyone wants to play the way you do. A true rogue pirate wouldn't give 2 shits about any nation or its goals.

Edited June 23, 2017 by Fengist

[Qwolf]

2 minutes ago, Fengist said:

You assume everyone wants to play the way you do. A true rogue pirate wouldn't give 2 shits about any nation or its goals.

1. If all you want to do is trade and PvE, that's totally fine by me.  There is even a whole server for that.

2. Your rogue pirates point is well taken, and is a whole different can of worms on Pirate mechanics.

[Hodo]

4 minutes ago, Fengist said:

You assume everyone wants to play the way you do. A true rogue pirate wouldn't give 2 shits about any nation or its goals.

A true rogue pirate wouldnt be able to build ships, guns, or operate out of any one port for a long period of time.   Real rogue pirates wouldnt have a nation, or a place to call home.  They would scramble from day to day just trying to make it. They would also be at risk of being voted out of the captains spot because of a bad voyage.   Yep... you dont want that.

[Fengist]

4 hours ago, Hodo said:

A true rogue pirate wouldnt be able to build ships, guns, or operate out of any one port for a long period of time.   Real rogue pirates wouldnt have a nation, or a place to call home.  They would scramble from day to day just trying to make it. They would also be at risk of being voted out of the captains spot because of a bad voyage.   Yep... you dont want that.

I don't consider sitting in some tropical port drinking rum to be a struggle.

[Twig]

Does anyone have some informations about that event? It came out from nowhere at friday at a time where normal people work