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Rothgar the Red

Trade, PvP & Crafting suggestions

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So I should start by stating that I haven't gone as in depth as some other more veteran players here, I'm sure you can tell by my amount of posts. My play time isn't that absurdly high either, but I have listened to as many players as I could and though I don't know a tremendous amount about the game, I thought of some things that hopefully veteran gamers could either expand on, run with, or completely shut down. Either way, it's a learning experience for me.

I've noticed that this game is focused on OW PvP and Port battles (I think that awesome and it drew me to this game on the first place), but what I'm also noticing is a lot of grind. Now I've grounded a lot, I don't mind grinding for a good cause, as long as I can see a reward in the not so distant future. The major problem I'm seeing is that grinding is on EVERY front in this game. Gold, Character XP, Ship XP, Crafting XP, PvE Marks, PvP Marks, Conquest Marks, I mean even mission runs, delivery missions, and Trading runs! 

This whole thing seems very disconnected with each other. PvP seems to be completely counter to Trading. Why can't we come up with a different solution? 

Bear with me as I break with down as best as I can, and my suggestions that I think could help the game, traders, PvPers, Roleplayers, and RvR.

First and foremost: 

Trading
Trading should be the lifeblood of any major empire, it dictates the market for its Captains and its military might!

Why not have all ports consume goods?
Use this to push traders to transport more goods of a particular type towards specific places. This already occurs to some ports in the game, but what happens if you make it all ports? What happens if the price of the goods reflect this. 

What would happen if after a while, those ports weren't getting their shipments of goods? 
Maybe a small bonus to grinding out hostility in that area(small bump)?
Maybe less powerful AI fleets would appear.
As time goes on, the less and less shipments that get through, the more damage it does to the port (accumulating negatives).

Either way, it's a benefit to those who would possibly want to nab that port.

What happens if that port is well supplied however? The traders are doing their jobs?

Maybe a small negative (just hamper) to would be hostility hits.
More powerful AI fleets?
Maybe a cheaper crew cost, since they're in a wealthy area and there's a surplus of sailors or scallywags?

Why not have all ports producing goods?
I mean every hour on the hour, more resources or goods show up. Have them be on sale for more than what a player can make, as to preserve the need for buildings, but when an AI trader comes into port, have them at least have a higher chance to carry that ports produced items out.

Both of these could work into a wicked PvP mechanic.

Port Raids
Blockading a port should hamper it, Raiding a port should strip it of most stockpiled resources that the port was using to survive. While I think, having players items be stolen could be realistic, I would think having the trading goods, food, and port products from its own production be a much easier hit on the economy. 

PvP
Bounty missions/Letters of Marque
I detest these marks, absolutely hate them as they only benefit those that are already playing in PvP, so they can obtain better ships. (It's like how WoW was with Grand Marshal gear way back when. It's pretty easy to pummel down a guy with green or blue gear when you have epic gear.) 

I actually liked it how it was before the patch in that aspect. Wars should be decided by two things; Battles of men and the battles of Wealth. With Dura being 1, I fail to see the need for this as another grindfest.

But if the game has determined to keep them, maybe using a bounty system on specific Nationalities might better help the choking bottleneck of these items.

You could even add letters of Marque by clans to hire other nationalities to attack specific ports or nations. Having PvPers earn more than what they earn now.

Crafting
Let players cap unranked ships. This will not only help them get out of the monotonous grind for gold when they start, but get them into a ship they can PvP with. Likewise, they can deconstruct them and use that to help them push their Crafting XP.

They become more useful in PvP AND they start having a goal to become investors in crafting, pushing the economy more!


I know I'm not a veteran, nor do I post much, but I do want to make this game better, and I want to bring in more people. But I can see why some are getting slightly aggravated with everything right now and why some are reluctant to join.

Thanks for your time.

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6 hours ago, Rothgar the Red said:

It's like how WoW was with Grand Marshal gear way back when. It's pretty easy to pummel down a guy with green or blue gear when you have epic gear.

I can just say that this is exactly one of the issues.  There is gear that is rare, and that will be dominating.  Casuals do not have a change vs HC grinders.  Gear Based VS Skill Based.  These big bonuses and rare items will lead to gear based system.  Even before wipe it was gear based but not as bad as it is now.

Even if bonuses were small, we would still be after those items.  Casual gamers would be also competitive.

REAL PvP player would never want this kind of gearing as we have now.

Edited by Cmdr RideZ

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On the point of PVP marks, I'm having some confusion over what ships grant marks and which ones don't. Is there a thread for that info, because putting 'pvp marks' in search gives me about 10,000 irrelevant hits on that subject.

I'm getting concerned because as a PVP EU, USA player on the second smallest and farthest faction away from the action, don't get me wrong, I DO appreciate a challenge. But the odds of us ever getting PVP marks are getting pretty slim to none. We've been shot in the knee caps with the restrictions and now supposedly they are taking about expanding the list of ships that don't grant PVP marks. Devs, please, you're killing us.

I've spent the last 3 days making the daily sail down to . . . where the action is, and on the off chance that I actually DO manage to find another player, they might be in a ship too small to earn a mark if it is sunk, or too big to risk having to sail home in a basic cutter for nothing.

I understand the theory behind not granting marks for the 7th rates, to prevent 'baby seal clubbing' and there are valid arguments to be made there. But PVP is PVP.

When you are looking to go south fast, you want to take something fast, and your most viable targets are going to be small, fast ships. But apparently you get NOTHING for that if you get into a scrap. Then you either survive and return home empty-handed or you sink and you sail back to wherever you came from in a basic cutter because TP to capital is gone, and that's it for the day.

As far as I'm concerned the only ship that shouldn't grant marks for sinking others or being sunk is the basic cutter. It's a starter ship whose only purpose should be to transport defeated captains to their burial sites and help new players into something better.

In less than 24 hours, we're about to be in the same situation as some of the British players, getting more conquest marks than PVP marks. The only difference between us and the Brits in that case is that they will have actually built ships requiring PVP marks.

God willing, we'll be rolling out our first connie by the end of the week, a ship most nations don't even craft anymore because they're up to something better.

You're killing us. The yanks don't mind fighting for these marks, but it'd be nice to get marks for whatever we fight. I will say I'm very proud thus far of the US faction's willingness to pitch in, because the USS Constitution will have been a national effort, no doubt, but we're starting to feel like a family of beggars who hit the street corners in the morning, meet up home at end of the day, and dump their pennies on a table to see if they can come up with a dollar.

Edited by ajffighter86

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3 hours ago, ajffighter86 said:

On the point of PVP marks, I'm having some confusion over what ships grant marks and which ones don't. Is there a thread for that info, because putting 'pvp marks' in search gives me about 10,000 irrelevant hits on that subject.

The following ships give PvP marks:

  • Belle Poule
  • Bellona
  • Brig
  • Mortar Brig
  • Bucentaure
  • Cerberus
  • Constitution
  • Cutter
  • Essex
  • Frigate
  • Lynx
  • Mercury
  • NavyBrig
  • Niagara
  • St. Pavel
  • Pickle
  • Pirate Frigate
  • Privateer
  • Rattlesnake
  • Rattlesnake Heavy
  • Renommee
  • Santisima
  • Snow
  • Surprise
  • Traders Brig
  • Traders Cutter
  • Traders Lynx
  • Traders Snow
  • Trincomalee
  • Victory
  • 3rd Rate
  • Ingermanland
  • Le Gros Ventre
  • Indiaman
  • Santa Cecilia
  • LOcean
  • Agamemnon
  • GunBoat
  • Endymion
  • Indefatigable

The following ships don't

  • Basic Cutter
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3 hours ago, ajffighter86 said:

 

The problem of making alliances with ALL neighbours

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Then clarify this then, please:

Do you have to actually sink the ship? There's just too much confusion and rumor in the US nation about certain ships not giving marks, because sometimes we get them and some times we don't.

Is it necessary to deal damage first to the enemy ship? Meaning if you are using chain and get no hull hits does it count if you board? I understand you can't both get marks and capture the ship, but if you capture the ship and don't keep it, sometimes it doesn't give marks and it's possible it's my imagination but it seems to depend on the ship. Is this a bug?

Can a developer verify the information from Remus above?

Edited by ajffighter86

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5 minutes ago, ajffighter86 said:

Do you have to actually sink the ship?

Yes.

You get marks for kills and assists only, not for damage and not for capture. If the ship does not sink no one gets anything (except someone gets the ship, maybe the original owner keeps it). If no one caps a defeated ship I understand it gets credited as a kill (and an assist if appropriate) when the last player leaves the battle instance but I won't say for certain,

I cannot say how kills and assists are awarded, but if a ship is boarded and defeated and then sunk, it is the player who boarded who gets the kill, even if that is all he did and someone else brought the ship to the point of sinking.

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3 minutes ago, Remus said:

Yes.

You get marks for kills and assists only, not for damage and not for capture. If the ship does not sink no one gets anything (except someone gets the ship, maybe the original owner keeps it). If no one caps a defeated ship I understand it gets credited as a kill (and an assist if appropriate) when the last player leaves the battle instance but I won't say for certain,

I cannot say how kills and assists are awarded, but if a ship is boarded and defeated and then sunk, it is the player who boarded who gets the kill, even if that is all he did and someone else brought the ship to the point of sinking.

Sink through the boarding interface? Because once a ship raises the white flag it no longer takes damage unless that was changed in the wipe patch.

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Just now, ajffighter86 said:

Sink through the boarding interface? Because once a ship raises the white flag it no longer takes damage unless that was changed in the wipe patch.

Yes, it was changed in the wipe patch.

After boarding, press Esc to return to your ship. Then look at the other ship and press X. You now get the opportunity to take the other ship's cargo, also to capture it (player ships only) or sink it.

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5 minutes ago, Remus said:

Yes, it was changed in the wipe patch.

After boarding, press Esc to return to your ship. Then look at the other ship and press X. You now get the opportunity to take the other ship's cargo, also to capture it (player ships only) or sink it.

Gonna try it. If that's how it works, then 'I regret that I have but one like to give for your post.'

Thank you.

[And sorry to the OP for running off on this topic but its pretty bad when veterans to the game are having a hard time understanding the process for a rather critical game mechanic now, I've got a ton of rumors to put to rest now in the US nation, lol]

Edited by ajffighter86
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I just thought that if all ports consumed items, and the interaction with a starvation/blockaid action it would push for PvP and the protecting supply cargos would offer enough targets of opportunity for a clan. 

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