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John Sheppard

Fireship CUTTERS exploit

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Hi

apparently there is a new exploit around .. get few basic cutters sail to KPR .. attack a big ship (indefat/trinc) set eachother on fire or wait the big  ship to set you on fire .. hug the big ship so it has 2 cutters on each side or more .. then turn off survival explode and take the big ship with you..

costs the enemy 300k and absolutely nothing for you .. there is no way to defend against it other (you could say board but won't work coz cutters won't drop so low speed and just come around .. turning doesn't work coz they turn with you .. running doesn't work coz cutters are .. well usually faster .. and if you fire even few shots you set them on fire and die 

this is very annoying .. very unbalanced and you should do something about it .. specially when you don't fire a single shot and the cutters shoot eachother and set eachother on fire

thanks

 

(if this is in wrong section pls move it to appropriate one)

Edited by John Sheppard

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Basic cutters should provide money only, No PVP or PVE marks.

The purpose of a bass cutter is to make money to buy a REAL ship.

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I have the screen shot of the cutter involved - I joined about 2 minutes after the start and all the cutters were on fire rather quickly. 

fire ship cutter troll_1.jpg

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This is griefing at best and if they shot at each other which I believe they probably did - its an exploit - certainly the mechanic should not make it possible the set the fires so quickly or cause the the amount of damage involved as they will repeat this over and over.

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Consequence free ships will always lead to this kind of stuff.  No surprise there.  This is why testing happens.

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Hate the game not the Player this was F11'ed when we tried it the first time

 

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Being in the screenshot, I can respond to this.

We are still in testing, and this is part of that.  We've been in a very small number of battle like this.

Yes, this is ridiculous. We've already reported it because it is way overpowered. It's basically a 100% success rate, in my experience,  and rewards PvP marks and gold.

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12 minutes ago, Young said:

Hate the game not the Player this was F11'ed when we tried it the first time

 

So this wasn't the first time then?

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not at all is it against the rules  NO is it OP as shit yes F11 and do it till its fixed

 

Edited by Young

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Its not;'testing' if you know its OP and have done it before and have reported it - the 'defence' to the mod cheat was the same. 

 

 

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I'm not convinced that this is a tribuneable offence. It is however a gameplay mechanic that needs rebalancing. The basic cutter is too OP in every way, despite not being a good ship by any measure.

You could argue that this is griefing maybe, but not really an exploit. And in any case griefing is not typically punished in this tribunal in my experience.

Edited by Anolytic
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you don't understand do you?

there is no defence against it (other than not firing a single shot and keep sailing for 1h 30 mins till the battle ends which is stupid) and 100% success rate with no risks and only benefits

if someone can loose such an expensive ship within 5 minutes (that's how long the battle lasted they caught fire after firs couple of shots) then there is no point to sail in anything more than a 6th rate

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It would be worth knowing whether the cutters had to friendly fire to achieve the impact so fast given that its testing.

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49 minutes ago, Rouleur said:

This is griefing at best and if they shot at each other which I believe they probably did - its an exploit - certainly the mechanic should not make it possible the set the fires so quickly or cause the the amount of damage involved as they will repeat this over and over.

I agree it is greifing but there have been several instances in the pass were agreed upon green on green is allowed.

In the last cycle the fire ship became a big tactic in RvR and your fleet would fire upon it in a green on green instance setting it on fire so the timing was right when it come in contact with the enemy fleet. This was brought up and the Devs said this was in fact allowed since it was agreed upon green on green.

Personally, myself and several others have brought up the poor implementation of the fireship mechanic in the game, however it has usually has fallen on deaf ears.

Edited by Redman29

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Why should i stop have the admins commented on it. seems like OP it has been reported. But the question is why has fire ship mod been added in the first place for a basic cutter,...... So i see nothing wrong with it until told otherwise. 

Edited by Young

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wtf?

Devs put (multiple, stacking) fire modifiers in game.  We have warned about stacking modifiers. 

Devs have encouraged us in the past to use fireshipping in totally unrealistic ways.  We warned that guided bombs tend to unbalance Age of Sail combat.

Devs put free cutters in game and welcome them in PvP.  We have repeatedly pointed out the problems, but they insist you should die in a basic cutter with no consequences, even if you are suiciding.  They even removed officer lives to get rid of only mild incentive not to suicide.

Combining the above simply highlights known and accepted problems. Pirate players are also swarming other pirates around MT in basic cutters.  They can cap ships, have them exit, then suicide with no consequences and have their capped ship safely back in port. At least we are doing tangible harm to the enemy.

Devs say that basic cutters problems are only temporary, so officially there is no issue.

 

Edited by akd
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I gather you got the pvp marks from this - if that the case sailing a basic cutter should not earn any 

 

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In Fairness I don't think it is Griefing since fireship outfittings are specifically in this game, and are intended to have exactly this effect.  I think it is an unfortunate oversight by the devs.  Griefing would be doing it repeatedly to the same person over and over. 

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Just now, Rouleur said:

I gather you got the pvp marks from this - if that the case sailing a basic cutter should not earn any 

 

they can do same with normal cutter/lynx/pickle

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If this goes on regular PvP combat like i said before there would be absolutely no point to sail an surp/indy/trinc  since you cand get free pvp mark with 0 cost.. 

so since they said it's allowed pls let's get on this and all of do it.. from now on only basic cutters/cutters/lyxes/picles costs a lot less and will earn you quick points

will get my 30ppl right on it as soon as they wake up

(unless told that it's actually not allowed)

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Responding to akd - does this mean they also capped the ship and got the pvp marks?

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To help clarify what's actually happening in these battles one of the ship knowledge perks added in the new patch is called Fireships. It adds 0.4 to the chance of catching fire, 25% to the rate of fire spread, and 30% to the powder radius which I presume is the explosion. All 3 cutters in this case were made of Fir for an additional increased 10% increased fire rate and also used the open magazine access perk to add another 0.1 to fire chance.

Because Fireships is a ship knowledge perk one person with access to the perk can outfit multiple cutters with the perk and distribute them to friends for free. I think this is the main issue with the perk as it is.

I think the easiest way to balance this issue is for the Fireship to be moved to a permanent upgrade instead of a ship knowledge perk. Which would make more sense anyways. The additional cost of the upgrade would add risk to the endeavor but would still leave it viable for high stakes engagements like port battles.

Just as an additional note we have hardly had a 100% success rate with this tactic and have been sunk many times over, albeit without bearing any cost for our failures.

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 the cutter was hit by shore batteries and enemy fire

it does need to be fixed or adjusted

 

fireship.png

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