Forthcoming changes in the next testbed patch

[AfkSailor 31]

11 minutes ago, Taranis said:

Seems to me that the costs of cannon and crew a bit too high on TB server.  Even winning your fights - you still end losing a ton of cash in re-crew and repairs.  The fact that you can't sell captured ships or canons is overly punitive.

War is expensive? Hopefully there will be enough dedicated econ'rs making money for their clans.

[Taranis 246]

22 minutes ago, AfkSailor said:

War is expensive? Hopefully there will be enough dedicated econ'rs making money for their clans.

Winning your battles should at least offer a steady state / balance - otherwise it will dishearten players.

Also, grinding gold for the sake of grinding gold and getting ganked is not something that will retain players for long.  I mean I am guessing that there are only so many masochists out there.

[Dharus 244]

As testers perhaps people ahould think about the alternatives in place first?

It seems pretty clear to me that crafting repairs and crew replacement might really benefit the recrew, repair options offered by the shop.  I see none of that stuff sold by players on testbed.  The high cost might be incentives for player economy options especially since mod crafted items are gone.

Let's get some real numbers on cost from there before whining about cost of only one aspect of the game.

[Dharus 244]

1 minute ago, Intrepido said:

I challenge you to think how to do one medkit in the testbed server. Maybe you are going to realize of some things.

Then fix that first?  Why is it hard for rational, progressive analysis of problems than knee jerking complaints.

Edited April 23, 2017 by Dharus

[Lannes 168]

On 19/04/2017 at 6:21 PM, Hodo said:

He was never given the newest ship.  That is the point.  He was probably England's greatest admiral and naval tactician during that time.  He was assigned to ships as needed and available.

 

Vice-Admiral Nelson hoisted his flag in Victory on 18 May 1803, with Samuel Sutton as his flag captain. Thus, Nelson was not the Captain, the 'Victory' was his flagship and under his command only because she was part of his squadron. Captain Sutton was in command of his ship.

A modern instance of the difference between being an Admiral commanding and a Captain's command, was the 'Bismarck' in its encounter with the 'Hood' and 'Prince of Wales'. When Admiral Lutjens was hesitating to order the division made up of 'Bismarck' and 'Prinz Eugen' to open fire, Captain Lindemann took command and ordered 'Bismarck's gunnery officer to open fire, because he did not want 'to have his ship shot from under him', as it was reported he said.

[PIerrick de Badas 1,271]

8 hours ago, Cabral said:

 So you started using gold upgrades in PB's because you had them in abundance or you learned to duplicate aswell?

because we began to buy mgn for 300k on la navasse in continue and spend more than 650 million in mgn

[Remus 622]

2 hours ago, Dharus said:

It seems pretty clear to me that crafting repairs and crew replacement might really benefit the recrew, repair options offered by the shop.  I see none of that stuff sold by players on testbed.  The high cost might be incentives for player economy options especially since mod crafted items are gone.

They cannot actually be sold till devs sort ouut the sell contract drop downs.

[PIerrick de Badas 1,271]

8 hours ago, Cabral said:

 So you started using gold upgrades in PB's because you had them in abundance or you learned to duplicate aswell?

because we began to buy mgn for 300k on la navasse in continue and spend more than 650 million in mgn

[PIerrick de Badas 1,271]

8 hours ago, Cabral said:

 So you started using gold upgrades in PB's because you had them in abundance or you learned to duplicate aswell?

because we began to buy mgn for 300k on la navasse in continue and spend more than 650 million in mgn

[Fenris 550]

4 hours ago, Intrepido said:

I challenge you to think how to do one medkit in the testbed server. Maybe you are going to realize of some things.

Gather sugar and Tobacco and make some?

Whats the problem?

[Jim Beamreach 193]

1 hour ago, Intrepido said:

1. Find the nearest ports which produce tobacco and rum.  Have you seen the map with the ressource distribution? Time sink.

2. Build an outpost. Well, two outposts. I assume you dont have any issue removing 2 outposts for some tobacco and rum.

3. Build the respective building. Money sink.

4. Wait until its refilled and gather it. Money sink.

5. Delivery all the goods to one port in which you have outpost and finally craft it. Time sink.

 

No problem mate.

 

I think we can only craft rum and for rum you must first get wood for barrels then u can craft them. Next thing you need sugar,  then u can craft rum. You must collect fishmeat and salt for foodsupplise

So you need tobacco u need rum and foodsupplise. Two thinks must be craftet first and you must get all ressources together. Its more than only sugar and tobacco.

Sry Fenris, Interpido is here right. But if you only sail a Ship around 300 crew. Like the Frigatte 280 crew. You can restore your crew on the ship in the habor without investigate some money/gold. 

And i got a question about free crew how high is the limit for a RA i was thinking its 340 but on tb it looks like it is 310.

[Remus 622]

2 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

Yeah I forgot that to made rum you need sugar and barrels. Thanks, this proves even more my point.

PS: I didnt take into account fish and salt because with all the sailing you should get more than enough. However it is true that you have to deliver too the food supplyes to the crafting point.

I'm not sure you would get enough fish and salt from sailing. Each medkit needs 16 fish and 4 salt.

Anyone know how many sugar and tobacco the buildings make a day?

[Fenris 550]

21 hours ago, Intrepido said:

1. Find the nearest ports which produce tobacco and rum.  Have you seen the map with the ressource distribution? Time sink.

2. Build an outpost. Well, two outposts. I assume you dont have any issue removing 2 outposts for some tobacco and rum.

3. Build the respective building. Money sink.

4. Wait until its refilled and gather it. Time and Money sink.

5. Delivery all the goods to one port in which you have outpost and finally craft it. Time sink.

 

No problem mate.

 

It is not a problem for me, but apparently it is for you.

One of us is doing something wrong here

 

[Liq 8,549]

So you will remove Global Chat due to the toxicity.. But at the same time bring back pirate free-for-all, while the participants are able to chat through the same nation chat.. I can see where this is going. Half the pirate players does not think attacking other pirates is a good thing, the other half does.
There will be a shitton of salt in the national pirate chat. Not quite sure how to counter it. But I feel like the 'toxicity' level will be a lot higher than the occasional salt in global chat.
I think there should be a big, clear message on when someone creates a character choosing pirate, saying there will be Free-For-All and the possibility for him to get completely wrecked by players of his own nation. After all, everyone should know that and takes that risk on his own.

 

[victor 1,599]

On 24/4/2017 at 7:59 PM, Fenris said:

It is not a problem for me, but apparently it is for you.

One of us is doing something wrong here

 

you

[Werewolf 285]

4 hours ago, victor said:

you

No.... you. I will gladly spend the time to go gather those mats from my farms after a few days, craft 500 medkits, and sell them to your lazy ass for a ridiculous fee. Just because YOU see it as a waste of time, some others don't. Some of us actually ENJOY trading, gathering mats, making items and selling them to other players. I know several captains who have never engaged in PVP outside of being caught in OW in their traders.

Edited May 5, 2017 by Werewolf

[VirtuallyIdiotic 1,588]

@admin Now if there is no plan on making missions the means to increase hostilities against regions and only have it where that regions national NPC ships are the main means there are regions where the traffic is very scarce and makes it close to impossible to raise hostilities. Especially regions that are spread creating the ship traffic to be very thin. There needs to be an increase of NPC traffic in certain regions. 

[Sir Texas Sir 7,073]

11 hours ago, Liquicity said:

So you will remove Global Chat due to the toxicity.. But at the same time bring back pirate free-for-all, while the participants are able to chat through the same nation chat.. I can see where this is going. Half the pirate players does not think attacking other pirates is a good thing, the other half does.
There will be a shitton of salt in the national pirate chat. Not quite sure how to counter it. But I feel like the 'toxicity' level will be a lot higher than the occasional salt in global chat.
I think there should be a big, clear message on when someone creates a character choosing pirate, saying there will be Free-For-All and the possibility for him to get completely wrecked by players of his own nation. After all, everyone should know that and takes that risk on his own.

 

When I was on this morning a group of pirates was doing nothing but tagging other pirates as soon as they got out of the green zone from the capital and I said group so it wasn't a solo guy. It was a group that would tag one guy and all jump in to sink them.  I can see how this is going to get every toxic fast.   Not to mention we are so restricted on other things now we have to watch out for guys like this. I know it's test bed and ever test server gets guys like this when there is nothing else to do they just PK over and over and camp new spawn camps and such.  Sounds like that is what we are getting. Some bored players that are now camping a capital cause they can just get easy kills  instead of going to a nations capitals and actually fight a national instead of camping solo players.

20 minutes ago, Davos Seasworth said:

@admin Now if there is no plan on making missions the means to increase hostilities against regions and only have it where that regions national NPC ships are the main means there are regions where the traffic is very scarce and makes it close to impossible to raise hostilities. Especially regions that are spread creating the ship traffic to be very thin. There needs to be an increase of NPC traffic in certain regions. 

We still don't know anything about the hostilities stuff yet.  Hell they haven't even finished the ship crafting stuff.  It's not like we won't see that for another couple of weeks at this rate.

[Jarlath Morrow 275]

1 hour ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Sounds like that is what we are getting. Some bored players that are now camping a capital cause they can just get easy kills  instead of going to a nations capitals and actually fight a national instead of camping solo players.

I was just thinking about this, actually.

As it stands, the most accessible PvP in Naval Action is to 1) Make a testbed Pirate character, 2) Redeem the money and xp, 3) Buy a store ship, 4) PvP at Mortimer Town.

[victor 1,599]

15 hours ago, Werewolf said:

No.... you. I will gladly spend the time to go gather those mats from my farms after a few days, craft 500 medkits, and sell them to your lazy ass for a ridiculous fee. Just because YOU see it as a waste of time, some others don't. Some of us actually ENJOY trading, gathering mats, making items and selling them to other players. I know several captains who have never engaged in PVP outside of being caught in OW in their traders.

Not so much.

I have far more than a couple thousands hours of playing in this game as a crafter only character. I saw endless changes in crafting and their consequences on the market. Until now - with every patch that hit the servers - I was able to produce things for my own use (even if I am a crafter, I also do missions and OS pvp from time to time) and the surplus was well enough (let's say a 75% of production) for selling it to other players gaining profits as a trader.

Well, what I am learning from testing crafting on testbed (BTW, are you also testing eco and crafting on testbed?) is that there will be not enough time/resources to produce a sufficient surplus to sell on the market

So the end of the story is that - with this new eco system - I will craft just for myself (not mentioning the PVPers that - especially in the case of the ones involved in RvR - have an eco alt)... so your smart business plan of selling medkits (FYI now there is rum instead) will end going up YOUR ass (sorry for being vulgar, but since you used kind terms like that with me, you will allow me to do the same, won't you?).

If you don't get it, my point is in fact that dedicated crafters will be screwed by the patch because the autoproduction of goods (especially of consumables like rum, repair kits and cannons) will be the way people will use their eco slots and labor hours. 

Look at the material you need for all of them: you can (almost) have it all in one char and in near ports: iron, coal, oak, fir, sugar. Moreover, no more player to player trade will mean no more selling of labor hours for gold, mate! So why should a PVPer buy a consumable from you when he can just simply slap in his ports 5 buildings and craft them for a lower price just waiting the resources and the labor hours grow and - every three days - make a "harvest and craft click fest" that - in 20 minutes - will refill its stocks of consumables?

This new eco systems (at least as far as consumable are concerned) is build with the purpose of letting PVP oriented characters to self-sustain them. So, the only things that crafter will be able to sell after the wipe will be SHIPS, but .... listen, listen ... for crafting (each unit of) the best ones you need a crapton of resources and - what's new - also PVP marks if not RvR marks (that you will no longer be able to convert from PVE marks, when patch goes live).

So, Mr. Crafter ... how many hours of game will you take to grind the materials for a ship AND to kill dozens of players in PVP?

You could tell, I will buy marks from PVPer. Ok, but with which gold will you buy the marks if you cannot sell BEFORE good ships and consumables will not have a market?

But - what's even more important - even if you will be able to craft let's say a constitution (yes, also for her you will need a bulding permit that you can buy only with PVP mark), which pricetag will have your ship? Will it be sufficient to make it competitive with the ships that will be build up "on demand" in the organizations by their own crafters, that have easy access to a huge amount of resources and marks from the organization's warehouse?

And, let's say that you answer: "I will join an organization". Well ... good luck in being other's slave and work just to craft things for others with almost no profit, because that what "only crafters" do in PVP clans. After all .... they are warriors and you just a humble artisan that faces no risk! Because that's the mood that you are likely to find there.

So, I confirm the diagnosis, my Sir: YOU are doing it wrong.

 

 

Edited May 6, 2017 by victor

[TBD 88]

There is wonderfull PVE server for crafting and trading. Lots of crafting and traging clans. Honestly, if PVP centric server bothers you that much, you should try it. There is nothing wrong with being crafter and trader, they just changing priorities and rewards between servers. PVP server is geared toward PVP players and will put non PVP activities at disadvantage. Most hard core guys have alts to trade and craft. Single player crafter/trader is not needed for them. PVE server is opposite in priorities. Yes a balanced server would be nice but I do not see it happening due to different goals of different players. We will have two extremes. The best part you get to play all three servers and choose the one that works best for you.

Test server changes daily and none of us know what will stay and what will get discarded. We have no clue how the final product will look like. 

Edited May 6, 2017 by Comrade I Stalin

[Liq 8,549]

On 5.4.2017 at 6:30 PM, admin said:

• Most upgrades will be removed from the game and transferred to individual ship knowledge, with bonuses that will depend on individual ships and/or class.
• Sailing a ship and getting kills will add to XP on that ship that will unlock knowledge slots over time (currently all ships have 5 slots). 

I've tested the following:
Unlocked a slot on the trinc on my account, chose powder monkeys, tested the reload in battle. 55 sec. Then traded it to someone who didn't have the slot unlocked. In the ship stats it shows the powder monkeys, but in the equipment screen, it dosen't. Tested in battle too, also 55 sec.
Intended?
(Sorry for the watermark; I'm still looking for a decent editing software which doesn't cost 200 Euro+.)

[TommyShelby 3,536]

On 6/5/2017 at 8:54 AM, victor said:

You could tell, I will buy marks from PVPer. Ok, but with which gold will you buy the marks if you cannot sell BEFORE good ships and consumables will not have a market?
- As a PvP'er i will start out with a shitty ship from the shop. Earn some money and marks (If i can find PvP that is). Then when i get to 5th rates i'll start buying cannons, ships and consumables from the market (Because i'm a lazy shit and hate crafting.) 
- As a crafter/trader i'd imagine you'll trade a bit to get some startup cash and then start building whatever it is you want to sell. (Be it ships, cannons or consumables).

But - what's even more important - even if you will be able to craft let's say a constitution (yes, also for her you will need a bulding permit that you can buy only with PVP mark), which pricetag will have your ship? Will it be sufficient to make it competitive with the ships that will be build up "on demand" in the organizations by their own crafters, that have easy access to a huge amount of resources and marks from the organization's warehouse?
- The pricing of ships will depend on 4 things;
1. The price of materials and resources.
2. Amount of Labor Hours needed. 
3. The greed of the PvP'ers selling their marks. (If the price for marks is high, the price for ships will be high).
4. The greed of the crafters selling the ships. 

And, let's say that you answer: "I will join an organization". Well ... good luck in being other's slave and work just to craft things for others with almost no profit, because that what "only crafters" do in PVP clans. After all .... they are warriors and you just a humble artisan that faces no risk! Because that's the mood that you are likely to find there.
- I only know how it worked in the 2 clans i been in. TDA and OCEAN.
- In both clans we work together. Money, PvP marks and such will be given to the crafter by the PvP'ers. Then the crafters and traders buys up resources and materials for crafting. They then build ships which are either really cheap or free for the clan members. 
 

This is based on my experience in the game as someone who mainly does PvP. I'm not saying this is how it works in all clans or for all players, but this is how its worked for me and the 2 clans i was in.

[victor 1,599]

18 hours ago, Comrade I Stalin said:

There is wonderfull PVE server for crafting and trading.

This says it all: no PVP MMO game lives without PVE playerbase

If that's the thing (PVP servers that get rid of PVE players), preapre to play only naval action arena, uncle Josif!

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by victor

[victor 1,599]

44 minutes ago, TommyShelby said:

This is based on my experience in the game as someone who mainly does PvP. I'm not saying this is how it works in all clans or for all players, but this is how its worked for me and the 2 clans i was in.

If I did mainly PVP I would have answered exactly as you did. But I am a crafter so I see thing on the basis of my experience, which is a crafter's one.