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UGCW Feedack 0.75


Nick Thomadis

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6 minutes ago, Aetius said:

I hope they are good now, since they are all you capture on Legendary as the Confederates. :)

Nope, still junk. Don't bother with 20 pdrs for now if avoidable.

They're all I capture on hard mode as CSA too, exception is Chancellorsville where I captured lots of James.

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I think with the 20lb parrots, that people are mistaken that the 20lbs means massive damage.  Not the case.  20lb parrots only had a 3 5/8 inch bore, and since they're rifled, not much use for canister.  20lbers were long range anti battery guns at best.  Their shell rounds only carried about 20 balls or so with the bursting charge. So, no 20lb parrots are not good close quarter guns.

That's why the 24lb Howitzers and 12lb Howitzers, and the 12lb Napoleons are good close quarters guns, massive bores, lots of canister something on the order of 48 - 50 balls per canister round, and they're all smoothbore.  Perfect for canister.

The Whitworth is also a useless close quarters gun.  About the same bore as the 20lb Parrott only hexagonal so the rounds fired by the Whitworth were also useless as shell, case, or canister guns.  Whitworths make great anti battery guns.

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Just now, A. P. Hill said:

I think with the 20lb parrots, that people are mistaken that the 20lbs means massive damage.  Not the case.  20lb parrots only had a 3 5/8 inch bore, and since they're rifled, not much use for canister.  20lbers were long range anti battery guns at best.  Their shell rounds only carried about 20 balls or so with the bursting charge. So, no 20lb parrots are not good close quarter guns.

That's why the 24lb Howitzers and 12lb Howitzers, and the 12lb Napoleons are good close quarters guns, massive bores, lots of canister something on the order of 48 - 50 balls per canister round, and they're all smoothbore.  Perfect for canister.

The Whitworth is also a useless close quarters gun.  About the same bore as the 20lb Parrott only hexagonal so the rounds fired by the Whitworth were also useless as shell, case, or canister guns.  Whitworths make great anti battery guns.

Strange that as a rifled cannon they are not rated by bore. Rating by weight is for smooth bores.

I've heard all the arguments that 20pdrs weren't a very good cannon but they're still far too weak in this game, even worse than 6pdr field guns. They're okay if you have a three star battery, but there are better gun options. Being that we capture hundreds of these cannons they need a boost. 

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9 minutes ago, GeneralPITA said:

Being that we capture hundreds of these cannons they need a boost. 

I do want them to be effective in their role, but I'd really like to see some more variety in the AI's choice of artillery, especially on Hard and Legendary. I think right now the weapon quality selection is simplistic and based on cost and shop availability to that side. The "best" gun for the Union appears to be the 20pd Parrot, and I'd guess the "best" gun for the Confederates is the James (which is historically odd, but whatever). Since Hard and Legendary crank up the weapon quality for the AI, it actually ends up with a less powerful artillery mix focused entirely on long-range counter-battery fire because those are the most expensive guns.

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6 minutes ago, Aetius said:

I do want them to be effective in their role, but I'd really like to see some more variety in the AI's choice of artillery, especially on Hard and Legendary. I think right now the weapon quality selection is simplistic and based on cost and shop availability to that side. The "best" gun for the Union appears to be the 20pd Parrot, and I'd guess the "best" gun for the Confederates is the James (which is historically odd, but whatever). Since Hard and Legendary crank up the weapon quality for the AI, it actually ends up with a less powerful artillery mix focused entirely on long-range counter-battery fire because those are the most expensive guns.

I continuously rail on darth about this. AI weapons need to be diversified and the upper limit needs adjustment (otherwise you fight 6k scoped snipers at Rio Hill f.x.)

WIP

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1 hour ago, GeneralPITA said:

Strange that as a rifled cannon they are not rated by bore. Rating by weight is for smooth bores.

I've heard all the arguments that 20pdrs weren't a very good cannon but they're still far too weak in this game, even worse than 6pdr field guns. They're okay if you have a three star battery, but there are better gun options. Being that we capture hundreds of these cannons they need a boost. 

True your first comment.  This was still at a time when the weight of the round was how guns were gauged.   Per Military specifications.  And of course rifle guns were still fairly new to the service at this time.  ( Here's a reference to this very question )

20lber's had the nasty habit of exploding on the gun team, metallurgy at the time not being as good as it is today. 

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1 hour ago, Aetius said:

I do want them to be effective in their role, but I'd really like to see some more variety in the AI's choice of artillery, especially on Hard and Legendary. I think right now the weapon quality selection is simplistic and based on cost and shop availability to that side. The "best" gun for the Union appears to be the 20pd Parrot, and I'd guess the "best" gun for the Confederates is the James (which is historically odd, but whatever). Since Hard and Legendary crank up the weapon quality for the AI, it actually ends up with a less powerful artillery mix focused entirely on long-range counter-battery fire because those are the most expensive guns.

Agreed, I shouldn't be facing 500 James cannons at Chancellorsville. I think there were maybe 60 in the entire rebel arsenal, they were variable in their form, and were discontinued after a few years. This is me playing as CSA so the Union had all those James guns...so it's doubly odd. 

Napoleons should be more prevalent, those were the bread and butter. I mostly have parrots, amazingly I only have 1 full 10pdr ordnance battery by Gburg. 

I've destroyed every single enemy artillery battery and bought every single cannon from the armory before every grand battle, 650 is the max you can achieve on hard mode by Gettysburg. 30% of my arsenal is 20pdrs. 

Disclaimer: I only buy the 24pdrs with rep points. I generally spend rep on manpower. 

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- on day 3, Culp’s Hill  whats with the lack of reinforcements for the union? I keep running out of ammo.

 

- Also Could we get a phase with Stuart, that's my only compliant with Gettysburg? Would love to see Stuart show up day 4.

 

Furthermore it would seem that on my csa play though I completely missed day 4, Holy crap its a huge battle. on my union playthrough this is whats currently happening. As of day 4 of Gettysburg, after tons of fighting as the union. I am pretty sure the csa is screwed, , Longstreet is dead (died day 2), hill's forces smashed( day 1 my forces took the high ground and the ai tried to take it back but failed, counter attacked and dealt a devastating blow to hills command, finally  ewell took some damage day 1 and almost had me at culps hill.

Going into day 4:

its union 60k vs 10k csa.

 

 

Edited by Nox165
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Well I finished my Confederate on Medium difficulty playthrough of Brandy Station and Gettysburg.

Brandy Station was... interesting given how much arty and cavalry I had. It was a fun distraction I suppose and I'm glad I didn't have to use my men.

As for Gettysburg...

I kinda whooped the AI's arse, but i'm not sure how to feel about it. These were my results:58a40168af720_2017-02-15(6).thumb.png.843facb6a52f09e6fe6bbb4b348f72af.png

In the original iteration of Ultimate General.. the Gettysburg battle was spread out after several days even if you seized Cemetery Hill. 

Here though, I flank blitzed the Union and seized Cemetery Hill on Day 1, leading me to basically win the battle... having only engaged probably a quarter of the Union army and a little under 4/5s of mine. 

On one hand, i'm proud that I was able to do what Lee wasn't able to do. Capture Cemetery hill and essentially dislodge the Union from its position and force it to retreat. Plus I inflicted huge casualties on the Union, capturing a lot of their troops that I surrounded in the town, and on the map border. I'm immensely satisfied I saved most of my men. 

It did end a bit quickly, but that's because I think I made a lot of smart decisions that led to me cordoning the AI in the town after seizing Cemetery and leaving some men on the hill itself to block reinforcements off.  Playing UG: Gettysburg allowed me to anticipate a lot of things. I am fully satisfied by the battle conditions itself and the size of the union force.

I do have concerns on the Ai ...it didn't seem to prioritize protecting Cemetery Hill, its major victory point, aggressively enough. It lingered far too long on trying to retake Oak and Seminary ridges, and then literally allowed me to blitz Cemetery ridge, by leaving most of its men in the town. Granted, I blocked the men that it sent to retake cemetary, which had been depleted on earlier assaults on Seminary and Oak ridges, but I admit I was a bit surprised that my knowledge of playing through Gettysburg on the union side (thus knowing their defense weakspots and reinforcement times) would give me such a huge advantage. 

Still liked the battle though and i'm happy I was able to outsmart the enemy AI.

Edited by vren55
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That would mean Slocum has 14 000 men ? Seems like a bit too much, maybe Vren could provide the full screenshot so we could see the timer ...

PS : I see Stannard's brigade on the screenshot and he even had time to get captured so it seems unlikely. 

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On 2/15/2017 at 0:17 AM, Aetius said:

I hope they are good now, since they are all you capture on Legendary as the Confederates. :)

I thought they would be good so i gave my elite cannon battery 24 pieces. They are still bad. I had them shelling the Confederates almost the entire second day at Little Round Top and they got ~350 kills. If they don't get the 3rd buff in the next patch i will just reequip my unit with Napoleons (the best cannon imo).

 

 

Btw am i the only one that thinks Gettysburg as Confederates is very easy? I just finished playing it and won on the first day taking 10000 casualties which is ~15% of my entire army. Most of my losses were from heavy cannon and infantry fire that were positioned in the woods at the outskirts of town.

 

Getty.jpg

Edited by Acika011
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6 hours ago, Col_Kelly said:

 

That would mean Slocum has 14 000 men ? Seems like a bit too much, maybe Vren could provide the full screenshot so we could see the timer ...

PS : I see Stannard's brigade on the screenshot and he even had time to get captured so it seems unlikely. 

 

 

7 hours ago, GeneralPITA said:

Seems about right for a quick day one victory before reinforcements arrive.

Forum refuses to let me upload a full screen shot because I can only upload 300kb. Unfortunately the timer wouldn't help you because I don't have reconaissance. The time on the clock says 1863 July 1 15:30, which basically tells me Day 1 victory just after some of Howards reinforcements arrive.

P.S. How the hell did you know I captured Stannard by that screenshot? I can't see him :P. I did capture Greene, Stannard, McDougall. and some others..

 

As for why the Union had so little troops... It might be because my 3rd corps only had one division. I only deployed a total of 59K infantry, 200 cavalry and my artillery (which is shown on screen b/c it was in my first two corps).

Edited by vren55
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I can now confirm that the Day 1 victory on Chancellorsville is possible.

20170215162400_1.jpg

Actually, I have a comment here - the game ended as soon as the timer confirmed I had the farm: if I had known that, I would have taken maybe half the casualties. I seized the farm very quickly with 37 minutes left on the timer at victory - Howard and Sickles Corps had showed up just before, but they did not even get to attack me. If they had done so I would have held the position but lost maybe 1,000 more men. This was on Brigadier-General.

IMO, the player should have to wait until the timer ticks down to 0, and control the farm, to win. At least allow Howard and Sickles to make one big attack on the farm. Otherwise it's just too easy. 

Edited by Squadron HQ
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Ah this is great to hear! I had a quick try with my "30 seconds till capture confirmed" save seen pictured in my thread on this subject and it still went to second day. Will try re fighting the whole battle when I get home tonight. 

 

Edit:: Replayed from start and crashed through for a Day 1 Victory. Awesome stuff :)

Edited by GrinningD
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Has anyone else noticed, playing Gettysburg with the Union, that they're not getting to use the fourth divisions of their second and third corps on the battlefield? I don't think I saw them in any phase of the two Union games of Gettysburg I've played now. Do they only appear if the battle goes more poorly for you or something?

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3 hours ago, waldopbarnstormer said:

I would like to know if it is possible to select which brigades merge if I have 3 or more in a division? Is it possible to merge brigades 2 and 3 or will the selected brigade always merge with the first brigade of a division? 

First brigade will almost always merge unless it is illegal. Traditionally I have things set up so the brigade to merge is first and the brigade to be merged into is second and it's been fairly reliable that works. Every so often I've seen it to where the first brigade tries to merge into third instead, not sure why.

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On 2/14/2017 at 4:03 PM, GeneralPITA said:

I continuously rail on darth about this. AI weapons need to be diversified and the upper limit needs adjustment (otherwise you fight 6k scoped snipers at Rio Hill f.x.)

WIP

Well, I usually consider hard and legendary to not be historical anyways because you're effectively fighting double size armies.

There IS actually a really easy fix for the 20 pdr problem. Just that the only other option to give the opposing side would suddenly make hard and legendary impossible if not done properly because the only other option among the expensive guns are 24 pdrs. ;)

As far as the range of weapon strength goes, there's not much leeway to give skirmishers better guns that aren't snipers once they're equipped with Burnsides. And enemy skirmishers start getting equipped with Burnsides I believe after Fredericksburg, by default. And Rio Hill is still beatable even with 6k scoped snipers; it is extremely painful though if you aren't lucky with the cavalry charges causing surrenders quickly.

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18 hours ago, Viperlord said:

Has anyone else noticed, playing Gettysburg with the Union, that they're not getting to use the fourth divisions of their second and third corps on the battlefield? I don't think I saw them in any phase of the two Union games of Gettysburg I've played now. Do they only appear if the battle goes more poorly for you or something?

This is, and has been, a fairly widespread problem. I think it has to do with limitations on reinforcements and deployment that are not visible to the player. For example, in Gaines' Mill, your second Corps trickles in bit by bit, with odd unit groupings and sometimes missing units. In your first playthrough, this is very unexpected and disconcerting, given how far those units have to travel to get into the fight. The last two groups are often unable to reach the fight, and you have zero control over who comes in when and how they are distributed.

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2 minutes ago, Aetius said:

This is, and has been, a fairly widespread problem. I think it has to do with limitations on reinforcements and deployment that are not visible to the player. For example, in Gaines' Mill, your second Corps trickles in bit by bit, with odd unit groupings and sometimes missing units. In your first playthrough, this is very unexpected and disconcerting, given how far those units have to travel to get into the fight. The last two groups are often unable to reach the fight, and you have zero control over who comes in when and how they are distributed.

It's kind of realistic - units often got lost due to poor maps or bad roads, didn't come in in proper march order, the commander couldn't organise properly etc. Unfortunately after one playthrough you can simply game by shifting stuff in the camp, so it's not a dynamic feature.

I agree how disconcerting it is though. 

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