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OneEyedSnake

Balancing of Nations/Pirates

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I believe that the biggest balance issue, and part of the reason for the gank fleets, if not the whole reason, is simply player numbers in said nation, and or pirate "nation." To balance this issue i would suggest some sort of player limiting factor per nation that could be implemented by percentile. Depending on others opinions on how that percentile could work every nation should have a +- 0-5% of an even percent of the total players on the server that have logged on in the past X amount of time, allowing for an active nation. OR it could be a somewhat uneven balance more historical to the nations historical presence in the area, i.e. spain with a bunch of population followed by britian, america, dutch, swedes/danes, and pirates. This would limit the pirates, and make them also behave like pirates more than what they do now. However this is a game and that might not be very popular, or it could be very popular. Opinions, more implementation ideas, etc. all welcome. 

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39 minutes ago, OneEyedSnake said:

I believe that the biggest balance issue, and part of the reason for the gank fleets, if not the whole reason, is simply player numbers in said nation, and or pirate "nation." To balance this issue i would suggest some sort of player limiting factor per nation that could be implemented by percentile. Depending on others opinions on how that percentile could work every nation should have a +- 0-5% of an even percent of the total players on the server that have logged on in the past X amount of time, allowing for an active nation. OR it could be a somewhat uneven balance more historical to the nations historical presence in the area, i.e. spain with a bunch of population followed by britian, america, dutch, swedes/danes, and pirates. This would limit the pirates, and make them also behave like pirates more than what they do now. However this is a game and that might not be very popular, or it could be very popular. Opinions, more implementation ideas, etc. all welcome. 

1. No way to enforce someone to join particular nation.,,just because "percents" need to be balanced in your opinion.

2. Pirates will,i hope, become "REAL" pirates, when the game mechanics for them are set. We can just wait and see what happens.

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1 hour ago, Fenris said:

1. No way to enforce someone to join particular nation.,,just because "percents" need to be balanced in your opinion.

2. Pirates will,i hope, become "REAL" pirates, when the game mechanics for them are set. We can just wait and see what happens.

no way to enforce? by doing this you would be shutting down the ability to select a nation to start as. or change to depending on server count. like you could not select gb to start in if it was X% higher than all the other nations. you would be forced to chose a difference nation as it wouldnt be an option. I thought of this because i rememebr other games doing such a thing.

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Just now, sruPL said:

Devs can suggest which nation to join, but enforcing and freedom of choice is a very bad idea.

perhaps. but i do know this has worked in games for the past, a server suggestion would work well, and maybe add like a small xp boost for the first day or something as incentive? 

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Imagine an english player comes to play and when he create the character... "Oh wait!!! I can't to choose Britain???? Must I to choose Spain instead? I want to emulate my national hero (put the name of famous historic/movie guy here) but I can't!! WTF!!!"

Because that, you can't to force to choose a faction in this game.

 

And the problem with ganking is not a problem of faction population. Is a problem with the "gankeed" guy when he sail alone. Do you want examples of real and historic "ganking"? There are a lot of them.

The problem with ganking is the gakeed actitude. If you are caught by a big force...well you were caught, surrender and carry on or you can run and force "the gank", is the ganked guy who chose. Fair duels in the duel feature or small/big battles.

Edited by Siegfried
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1 minute ago, Siegfried said:

Imagine an english player comes to play and when he create the character... "Oh wait!!! I can't to choose Britain???? Must I to choose Spain instead? I want to emulate my national hero (put the name of famous historic/movie guy here) but I can't!! WTF!!!"

Because that, you can't to force to choose a faction in this game.

 

And the problem with ganking is not a problem of faction population. Is a problem with the "gankeed" guy when he sail alone. Do you want examples of real and historic "ganking"? There are a lot of them.

The problem with ganking is the gakeed actitude. If you are caught by a big force...well you were caught, surrender and carry on or you can run and force "the gank", is the ganked guy's who chose. Fair duels in the duel feature or small/big battles.

you know very well the problems ganking causes to population and should know that is not a game mechanic that is intended to be so popular. 

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2 minutes ago, Siegfried said:

Is a problem with the "gankeed" guy when he sail alone.

thats a population issue. some nations cant help that at all. especially in pvp2. 

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I am sick of people whining in battle chat and even creating tribunal cases when they were caught in inferiority.

But for more argumants, imagine a faction with only 5 guys. All that 5 guys are friends and always sail in group of 5 ships. They will "gank" every lone player of another faction with a population of 1000.

Edited by Siegfried
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Just now, Siegfried said:

I am sick of people whining in battle chat and even creating tribunal cases when they where caught in inferiority.

But for more argumants, imagine a faction with only 5 guys. All that 5 guys are friends and always sail in group of 5 ships. They will "gank" every lone player of another faction with a population of 1000.

idealistic situations in a perfect world do not apply on this forum post. as this is not a perfect world, and people arent always on to do that. I agree that ganking shouldnt be stopped completely. as it did happen in real life. I believe that in a lot of cases, the ganking fleet strategically deserves said victory and what not. But we are looking at limiting it to those strategic setups and to stop it from being a case of lack of people available in one spot. For that case anyways. But really this post wasnt supposed to be orientated around ganking. Rather it was for a larger picture in terms of server and nation balancing to where all nations are actually present and able to fight in mainly pvp2. The pvp1 server doesnt have that much of a problem, and i am guessing you are from server 1 sieg. Just because what you are saying is definitely true for that server. 

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8 minutes ago, sruPL said:

Starting with the fact that there is no such thing like "unfair" battle in Open World. It could be 10v1 or 5v10. It happened to me several times, but I do not cry. If you want a fair battle, go to duel or Small Battle or Port Battle. Why ganking happens? Players that are bored and suffering from lack of PvP go to the most populated areas. They go in a group to have a chance balancing any revenge fleets, increase chance of surviving etc. If the only thing they see is Indiaman or LGV and these are right now the most frequently sailing arround capitals (yes, there are barely any combat ships arround capital, mostly traders) then they just engage these traders. Anyway traders have a very super easy life with abnornal numbers of AI fleets, forts and towers. 

probably another pvp1 player id guess.  It isnt even just the trade ships. and as far as pvp boredom. Thats exactly the problem. Thats exactly what this addresses, it adds pvp by making more nations viable for pvp so there is more pvp around the map. And it happens to me as well, i do not cry either, i say gg, and move on. But both of you truly cant be blind to the fact that there is a severe problem when so many people are complaining about it and are quitting this game because of it. I agree with both of you, but it isnt about us, its about this game's server pop and a larger group of people complaining about it than not. and then quitting when people say this isnt a problem and dont help fix it, and so it doesnt get fixed.  The forts are a great thing for them though, i must say, good point, but that doesnt matter if you are in the middle of the water after popping out of a mission to a larger force in nuetral to hostile waters and rondomly there isnt a fleet for you to hide behind. Its those situations now that need to be addressed. They tried the whole invisibility thing and what not but that caused other problems. Larger populations for smaller nations and smaller population for unreasonably large nations, could fix this quite well. Or at least should be given a shot since this is in testing after all. and has been for several years. 

Edited by OneEyedSnake

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also id like to say in pvp2. literally duel and small battles do not happen. hardly at all. havent for about 8 months. You hop in there and you can wait for 2 hours, i did once, went to lunch, got back, waited some more, watched a 45 minute video on netflix. never got anything. 

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Yeah, I am from server 1 and playing Spain. I am a lone player mainly and well, I don't like to be ganked BUT at same I don't like to gank someone. I tell you, this last days I was in some ganking actions but I sailed with other people and I made my job to catch the poor enemy guy. All enemies chose to run, some with success, another fought back to the end or surrender when the capture was inminent.

Sometimes, (few times because I use to sail with care), I was ganked too and accepted my destiny, but didn't cry. One of my greater victories where in a case I was in a Trader brig alone and watching youtube and I was "ganked" by 3 trincomalees. I scaped lol. Well, this action was in the Spanish waters near Habana where Spain have superior local numbers and I was ganked anyway. I hope you understand this "real world" example.

Another example. In PvP1, Spain is underpopulated population but we "ganked" yesterday some brits in the Jamaica waters near of Port Royal where they, a big numbers faction, have superiority. I think faction numbers are not a issue here.

And historic, if you read about warships travels, there are a lot of ganking actions. Even in modern times, for example german ship Bismarck.

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4 minutes ago, OneEyedSnake said:

also id like to say in pvp2. literally duel and small battles do not happen. hardly at all. havent for about 8 months. You hop in there and you can wait for 2 hours, i did once, went to lunch, got back, waited some more, watched a 45 minute video on netflix. never got anything. 

In PvP1 neither. If you want to duel, you need meet with someone in chat or something like that.

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Just now, Siegfried said:

Yeah, I am from server 1 and playing Spain. I am a lone player mainly and well, I don't like to be ganked BUT at same I don't like to gank someone. I tell you, this last days I was in some ganking actions but I sailed with other people and I made my job to catch the poor enemy guy. All enemies chose to run, some with success, another fought back to the end or surrender when the capture was inminent.

Sometimes, (few times because I use to sail with care), I was ganked too and accepted my destiny, but didn't cry. One of my greater victories where in a case I was in a Trader brig alone and watching youtube and I was "ganked" by 3 trincomalees. I scaped lol. Well, this action was in the Spanish waters near Habana where Spain have superior local numbers and I was ganked anyway. I hope you understand this "real world" example.

Another example. In PvP1, Spain is underpopulated population but we "ganked" yesterday some brits in the Jamaica waters near of Port Royal where they, a big numbers faction, have superiority. I think faction numbers are not a issue here.

And historic, if you read about warships travels, there are a lot of ganking actions. Even in modern times, for example german ship Bismarck.

oh man, the war stories i have for you in my pavel vs 3-6 other players where i have come out on top. Those are what make this game great! But i would like to just say, in pvp2 there are nations whose pop max at one time is 6 players. at our highest server time there are 100-150 players on. and it makes for some different situations. a lot of people that have quit that server wanted balance in nations. because they didnt want to play the easy brits, and wanted to play a manned team of swedes, or danes, or spain (spain is the lowest on that server), or dutch, and well, couldnt. And thus got ganked constantly or had to just do nothing because of lack of players in these nations when there are 30 brits. or 50 pirates, or 50 americans on most of the time.

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I understand, but with limited slots for join to factions, the numbers will be worst. The factions in this game have real names and is impossible that. I am sure that in World of Warcraft it works, but not here IMHO.

And I am speaking as a Spanish guy playing as Spain, the biggest territory owner faction and one of the lower population in my server.

 

Edited by Siegfried

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Just now, Siegfried said:

I understand, but with limited slots for join to factions, the numbers will be worst. The factions in this game have real names and is impossible that. I am sure that in World of Warcraft it works, but not here IMHO.

And I am speaking as a Spanish guy playing as Spain, the biggest territory owner faction and one of the lower population in my server.

yea, i think sruPL's idea of adding a suggestion to go to a nation would work better for this game, and maybe with my idea of adding like a small xp incentive might actually get people to go to less populated nations.

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I see that you play as Dutch in server PvP2, well you can change to PvP1 and join the zerg alliance of Brits, Dutch and USA, ;)

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5 minutes ago, Siegfried said:

I see that you play as Dutch in server PvP2, well you can change to PvP1 and join the zerg alliance of Brits, Dutch and USA, ;)

hahaha im sorry man, i am committed to our nation and devoted to making her great again :lol: I may make an account for pvp1, but that euro server does things to my ping, and i might log in now and then just for some good pvp action. But definitely not as a main account haha

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7 minutes ago, sruPL said:

Devs are working on fixing stuff so PvP 2 and PvP 1 can be merged. They want to remove matter of ping from boarding and other stuff. Also ganking is not a problem for players quiting, you could as well say that players quit because they lose battles often. The problems current are broken hostility, war supply bombs, battlescreen camping, fine woods etc.

Battlescreen camping is not a problem, is a feature. If I must to gift my ship and cargo at the guy with more time than my for play is a bad move. Then other players will quit the game too. 

Sometimes I was pursued arround 2 hours when I was just to end the play session at 2 AM. That day I went to the bed at 4 AM because a guy living in other time zone saw me. Yes, I went offline in the post battle screen because that 4 AM thing, if they put the autokick to OW in 5 minutes I must to gift him my ship and cargo and save time or go to bed at 6 AM.

Other guy spoiling and wasting 2 hours of my time tagging me time after time when I could to scape in every sitiation with pure position and speed in battle but we had same in OW. In this case, for my principles I was not camping the post battle screen and he pursued me to the border of the map... He even said me he will create a post in the forums telling I was using the "camping exploit" if I don't exit again to OW. Lol

Recently, I could to make a fair scape with the pure speed of my LGV (not disappearing in front of the hunter with coward perk and the exited from the battle before me). He camped me outside and all my speed and distance advantage was reseted and we begin again in the very same spot in open sea TWENTY MINUTES AFTER!!!. Yeah I needed to take a shit, drink water and walk some for relax a long play session but all my previous efforts spoiled and ship and cargo lost because a broken mechanic and because I have principles and I don't camp the post battle screen.

The hunter, and I am hunter sometimes too, had your chance for catch that guy but fail, but if devs put the 5 minute limit and kick to OW, in practice it will be a "auto take your cargo button" and many players will quit or they not exit to the sea anymore.

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2 hours ago, Siegfried said:

Battlescreen camping is not a problem, is a feature. If I must to gift my ship and cargo at the guy with more time than my for play is a bad move. Then other players will quit the game too. 

Sometimes I was pursued arround 2 hours when I was just to end the play session at 2 AM. That day I went to the bed at 4 AM because a guy living in other time zone saw me. Yes, I went offline in the post battle screen because that 4 AM thing, if they put the autokick to OW in 5 minutes I must to gift him my ship and cargo and save time or go to bed at 6 AM.

Other guy spoiling and wasting 2 hours of my time tagging me time after time when I could to scape in every sitiation with pure position and speed in battle but we had same in OW. In this case, for my principles I was not camping the post battle screen and he pursued me to the border of the map... He even said me he will create a post in the forums telling I was using the "camping exploit" if I don't exit again to OW. Lol

Recently, I could to make a fair scape with the pure speed of my LGV (not disappearing in front of the hunter with coward perk and the exited from the battle before me). He camped me outside and all my speed and distance advantage was reseted and we begin again in the very same spot in open sea TWENTY MINUTES AFTER!!!. Yeah I needed to take a shit, drink water and walk some for relax a long play session but all my previous efforts spoiled and ship and cargo lost because a broken mechanic and because I have principles and I don't camp the post battle screen.

The hunter, and I am hunter sometimes too, had your chance for catch that guy but fail, but if devs put the 5 minute limit and kick to OW, in practice it will be a "auto take your cargo button" and many players will quit or they not exit to the sea anymore.

And you just shined a very bright spotlight on *one* of the issues that is really making me just wait for the next patch, because I *think* the devs said they're going to fix the 'escape' handling for OW battles. If you escape, you and your ship spawns in the nearest 'friendly' port. Which means to me - the closest national, allied or Free Town port. And I don't care that it may be exploitable in specific scenarios by using alts for teleporting cargo. That is a MUCH smaller kettle of fish when it comes to things that may make people rage-quit playing NA.

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As far as escaping to Open World from battles, I still would like for the player who manages to successfully escape the battle instance, to be spawned back to the Sea but just out of sight from the initial battle instance. This gives the successful escaping player a chance to continue his escape in the Open World, without being teleported to any port at all. 

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1 hour ago, Captiva said:

As far as escaping to Open World from battles, I still would like for the player who manages to successfully escape the battle instance, to be spawned back to the Sea but just out of sight from the initial battle instance. This gives the successful escaping player a chance to continue his escape in the Open World, without being teleported to any port at all. 

Unfortunately the devs have repeatedly stated that this is not an option since placing a ship semi-randomly in the OW carries with it the chance that it will be spawned on land. No idea why they cannot check and if beached, just try the randomizer again - but apparently they can't.

Edited by Angus McGregor
speeling mistak

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8 hours ago, sruPL said:

Devs are working on fixing stuff so PvP 2 and PvP 1 can be merged. They want to remove matter of ping from boarding and other stuff. Also ganking is not a problem for players quiting, you could as well say that players quit because they lose battles often. The problems current are broken hostility, war supply bombs, battlescreen camping, fine woods etc.

a server merge would be very very very bad. they did it before. How are your resources and trade opportunities in pvp1? do you easily make 10 mil a day? id bet not with how many people are on your server, id rather not add 50-150 extra on at any given time to that mess. 

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9 minutes ago, sruPL said:

Mess? Economy is a bit broken, but what's the reason of making 10 mil a day? Harder to earn money? That's perfect! We don't want players all arround with 20 1st rates and 100m in bank account. We had 2500 players in past, I started playing with arround 1500 and now we get about 600-700 peeks. Economy seems fine, but needs tuning. Server merge is not a very bad idea. That's a less job for Devs, I see bunch of these 100-150 PvP 2 players crying about how PvP 1 rules do not apply for their server and they ask for different treatment, other settings, fixes etc. We have a lot of US / Aussies on our server and they do not complain about pings and such.

they tried it in the past. it didnt go over well.. and also the only people with that many first rates on our server are the super populated nations. 

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until they can fix the economy and make it enjoyable for all nations, because britian isnt the only nation here, then another server merger will just cause another mass exodus in player base. I take it you werent around for that? 

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