Forthcoming shipbuilding changes [Heavily Moderated]

[Wesreidau]

Yeah, at this point it feels like they're throwing out the quality system, which is woven into every other part of the game, because they are unhappy with how many people use the dirt-cheap crafted exceptionals. The answer is to make exceptionals exceptionally hard to craft, not flatten the entire quality scale out to "crafted=yellow". I don't even know why they'd keep with it being yellow.

 

The whole point of grey-green-blue-purple-gold is to mimic the quality color scheme used by World of Warcraft to divide loot into easily understood tiers. They failed to balance the difficulty in attaining higher tiers, and almost act like we're not buying blues because we don't like the color. I mean... they changed the color of fir and teak and oak to blue. Why in the name of God. First, they're the crappy wood types, and second, why paint them up like they're Tier 2 mega lootz. Its silly. We're not building teak ships because the wood name was green, we just don't like the wood's bonus compared to Live Oak.

[Magnum]

My FEEDBACK:

 

Well, between

 

- the Russian Pirates [RUBLI] getting "special" ships (Santa Cecilia).

- the Russian Danes [RUS] getting "Special" ships (Strong Hull L'Ocean).

- and the removal of any usefulness of screening fleets because the dev's allowing "Log in to port battle" mechanics by Russian [RUS] attackers.

 

You might as well wipe me RIGHT NOW - I am done testing the "Russians [RUBLI] [RUS] Win" game.

 

Good day.

[Hethwill]

That's no feedback Sir.

 

It is blindness.

 

If you refer to the Tournament prizes you will see teams from all over the place that received prizes including the ships you refer.

 

If you refer to the Treasure events of the past you will see a lot of people got some of the ships you refer and more.

[Powderhorn]

Your xenophobia does you no credit.  Your stereotyping of all who use a Cyrillic alphabet as Russian does you no credit.  If you are done testing this game, you will of course not mind having your El Capitán title brought back into circulation.  The fact that all quarter finalists, British and American-flagged teams included, received vessels, gives the lie to your statement.  Do not mask your envy in hate.

 

I would strongly urge you to recuse yourself for a period of time until you are able to comport yourself more civilly.

[Magnum]

Your xenophobia does you no credit.  Your stereotyping of all who use a Cyrillic alphabet as Russian does you no credit.  If you are done testing this game, you will of course not mind having your El Capitán title brought back into circulation.  The fact that all quarter finalists, British and American-flagged teams included, received vessels, gives the lie to your statement.  Do not mask your envy in hate.

 

I would strongly urge you to recuse yourself for a period of time until you are able to comport yourself more civilly.

 

Wow, what a bone headed dude you turn out to be - I simply dislike the Russian clans having unfair advantages "IN GAME" and you trundle out xenophobia? WTF?

 

Are you saying [RUBLI] are NOT Russian Pirates and that RUSSIAN UNIFIED SAILORS [RUS] are NOT "RUSSIAN" again WTF? ARe you insane?

 

----

 

I AM RECUSING MYSELF from this "game" so sit down an STFU about xenophobia

 

And you are more than welcome to the El Capitain moniker - it is tainted by your obtuseness now anyway.

[OlavDeng2]

Wow, what a bone headed dude you turn out to be - I simply dislike the Russian clans having unfair advantages "IN GAME" and you trundle out xenophobia? WTF?

 

Are you saying [RUBLI] are NOT Russian Pirates and that RUSSIAN UNIFIED SAILORS [RUS] are NOT "RUSSIAN" again WTF? ARe you insane?

 

----

 

I AM RECUSING MYSELF from this "game" so sit down an STFU about xenophobia

The following clans recieved 4 santa cecilias due to tournament:

 

RDNN, RUBLI, WO, LG, Ocean, SLRN.

 

As such, I think it is pretty clear it isnt russian bias considering WO, Ocean and SLRN are most definetely not russian, i believe RDNN are a mix and im unsure about LG

[Magnum]

The following clans recieved 4 santa cecilias due to tournament:

 

RDNN, RUBLI, WO, LG, Ocean, SLRN.

 

As such, I think it is pretty clear it isnt russian bias considering WO, Ocean and SLRN are most definetely not russian, i believe RDNN are a mix and im unsure about LG

 

Why were there several "strong hull" (RECENTLY BUILT) L'OCEAN in the Savanna Port Battle - where did they get the BP?

 

They were Ironclads against canvas canoes they were so OP - gamebreaking.

[OlavDeng2]

Why were there several "strong hull" (RECENTLY BUILT) L'OCEAN in the Savanna Port Battle - where did they get the BP?

Lemme take a long hard minute to think...

 

so Ocean, swedes won the tournament, the danish are allied with the swedes so obviously the danes went to the devs to get the BP /s

 

edit: also, you are british, unless something changed recently you got access to Oceans as well, oh and can i mention brits used agamemnons and rofl stomped the french(i believe?) with them? where was your bitching then?

[TommyShelby]

Level of salt here is crazy Magnum.

 

Olav explained the Santa Cecilia. Perhaps i should go over the L'Ocean stuff.

 

First of all. You didn't complain when the British and US were the only ones with access to L'Ocean BP.

Second. You have access to L'Ocean BP (You are British), you can have "OP L'Ocean" too if you want.

Third. OCEAN T1 won the tournament, we got L'Ocean and Aggy BP's (4 of each) as prize from the devs. Instead of being selfish douchebags we thought to ourselves, perhaps we should share these BP's with other nations that dont have access to those BP's? 

So guess what, we gave 1 L'Ocean BP to Sveno (HRE). We sold 2 L'Ocean BP's for cheap, Danish bought 1 and French bought 1. We make L'Oceans for the Spanish since we didn't have a BP for them. 

As for Aggy BP's we gave 1 to Sveno (HRE) and sold 1 to Spanish and 1 to French. 

 

We make those 2 ships for anyone in our "alliance". 

Your ignorance is beyond me. I have never experienced any russian bias in this game so please remove your disgusting comments and attitude. Leaves a horribru taste in my mouth. 

[JollyRoger1516]

Level of salt here is crazy Magnum.

 

Olav explained the Santa Cecilia. Perhaps i should go over the L'Ocean stuff.

 

First of all. You didn't complain when the British and US were the only ones with access to L'Ocean BP.

Second. You have access to L'Ocean BP (You are British), you can have "OP L'Ocean" too if you want.

Third. OCEAN T1 won the tournament, we got L'Ocean and Aggy BP's (4 of each) as prize from the devs. Instead of being selfish douchebags we thought to ourselves, perhaps we should share these BP's with other nations that dont have access to those BP's? 

So guess what, we gave 1 L'Ocean BP to Sveno (HRE). We sold 2 L'Ocean BP's for cheap, Danish bought 1 and French bought 1. We make L'Oceans for the Spanish since we didn't have a BP for them. 

As for Aggy BP's we gave 1 to Sveno (HRE) and sold 1 to Spanish and 1 to French. 

 

We make those 2 ships for anyone in our "alliance". 

Your ignorance is beyond me. I have never experienced any russian bias in this game so please remove your disgusting comments and attitude. Leaves a horribru taste in my mouth. 

Though Magnum needs to tune down a bit your statement of the British side  is not true at all.

 

I have from the moment any of this blueprint limitation started constantly warned of the imbalance it creates and the unsatisfied people on the server. Nonetheless this was pushed forward and forward and now the voices just get louder. I have all of the new ships and still I hidhly advise against continuing this way.

We too ahve produced the ships for everybody in our alliance and even given a BP to the US so they too could craft the L'Ocean however that doesn't change the underlying problem. One of the crafters of rare ships even got annoyed after a few days simply by the amount of requests that he got bombarded with and that he never got around to actually playing anymore. Luxury problem I know but still not a funny one.

 

I agree that russian bias is a bullshit argument that has reached through so many games that it is hard to get rid of anymore.

[Magnum]

Level of salt here is crazy Magnum.

 

Olav explained the Santa Cecilia. Perhaps i should go over the L'Ocean stuff.

 

First of all. You didn't complain when the British and US were the only ones with access to L'Ocean BP.

Second. You have access to L'Ocean BP (You are British), you can have "OP L'Ocean" too if you want.

Third. OCEAN T1 won the tournament, we got L'Ocean and Aggy BP's (4 of each) as prize from the devs. Instead of being selfish douchebags we thought to ourselves, perhaps we should share these BP's with other nations that dont have access to those BP's? 

So guess what, we gave 1 L'Ocean BP to Sveno (HRE). We sold 2 L'Ocean BP's for cheap, Danish bought 1 and French bought 1. We make L'Oceans for the Spanish since we didn't have a BP for them. 

As for Aggy BP's we gave 1 to Sveno (HRE) and sold 1 to Spanish and 1 to French. 

 

We make those 2 ships for anyone in our "alliance". 

Your ignorance is beyond me. I have never experienced any russian bias in this game so please remove your disgusting comments and attitude. Leaves a horribru taste in my mouth. 

 

Tommy

 

The thread asks for feedback - I gave mine. Perhaps I stated it in the wrong way - so I'll restate it:

 

In EVE all players pay the same price to play the game - all players have equal access to the "good" gear. Grinders might have "more" gear but not "better" gear.

In NA all "testers" pay the same price to play the game - SOME have access to "better" gear.

 

All of you are free to disagree with me.

 

To be disgusted because I called the members of [RUS] Russian is really really wierd - what do you think [RUS] stands for?

[Powderhorn]

That feedback is fine.  As is often the case, phrasing is everything.  

 

When you accuse all those of having a Santa Cecilia of being Russians, when you imply that the developers favor the Russians, simply because you believe the players to be Russian (after all, those who got the ships are as Olav pointed out:

 

 

RDNN, RUBLI, WO, LG, Ocean, SLRN.

 

As such, I think it is pretty clear it isnt russian bias considering WO, Ocean and SLRN are most definetely not russian, i believe RDNN are a mix and im unsure about LG

 

that is where things take a turn for the worst.  We welcome all players of all backgrounds into this game.  As soon as you start throwing around lump statements as you did, it is an issue that we take very seriously.  Hopefully that explains my response to it as well.

[TommyShelby]

Snip

My comment was aimed at Magnum and him alone. I know several Brits have made constructive criticism, Magnum however, has not (Afaik atleast). 

 

 

In NA all "testers" pay the same price to play the game - SOME have access to "better" gear.

To be disgusted because I called the members of [RUS] Russian is really really wierd - what do you think [RUS] stands for?

"Better gear"? Santa Cecilia? L'Ocean? Aggy? Rattle Heavy? 

 

Having tested every ship except Rattle heavy i can tell you that none of them are "better" than their counterparts. 

Santa Cecilia is an allrounder. She has pro's and Con's when compared to other ships of her class but she doesn't outperform them. 

L'Ocean is no better than Santi, it's got different pro's and Con's than Santi but it is well balanced. 

Same goes for Aggy compared to Connie and Inger. 

 

From what i've been told the Rattlesnake Heavy is the same. It's got pro's and con's but isn't straight up better than the other ships in it's class.

 

Disgusted of you calling RUS russian? Nope. 

Disgusted by you acting like a Hypocrite and calling "russian bias"? Yes very much so. 

[Magnum]

My comment was aimed at Magnum and him alone. I know several Brits have made constructive criticism, Magnum however, has not (Afaik atleast). 

 

snip, opinionated bloviation ....

 

Disgusted of you calling RUS russian? Nope. 

Disgusted by you acting like a Hypocrite and calling "russian bias"? Yes very much so. 

 

I have edited my original post so you HYPER SENSITIVITY will not be offended - I did not call russian bias - I called "some players have access to better gear"

 

As long as the BP's to these most desirable ships are not available to every paying player (tester) equally there will be "salt" - mark my words.

 

----

 

Perhaps they are just testing how far they can go before people rebel?

[Wesreidau]

Take a moment here to look at how Magnum feels about tournament rewards being exclusive and unattainable to him by any means.

 

Then read the OP, and realize tournament rewards are the new way to distribute the exciting and rare ships. since the devs are abandoning the quality system in favor of tournaments and events.

 

It should be clear we'll see more of this problem after release, unless the devs move away from tournament rewards and back to play rewards.

[JollyRoger1516]

In EVE all players pay the same price to play the game - all players have equal access to the "good" gear. Grinders might have "more" gear but not "better" gear.

In NA all "testers" pay the same price to play the game - SOME have access to "better" gear.

 

He is right with this. As a player with less time it will take me several days to craft a ship often enough to have the blueprint drop (unless lucky) while a 'hardcore' player will probably craft the required ship 10 times on release day. Access is faster for you yet equally reachable for both of us. However forcing me into a tournament means that I would NOT HAVE ACCESS to the new content as I would be unable to bring up the time required as I would've been under the old system. In addition it would also force players into events they do not enjoy - many people paly this game with only two aspects - craft and fight, fight and trade or trade and craft. Especially the last one has absolutely no interest in a tournament yet his main interest is heavily impacted by the new developments!

Edited November 5, 2016 by JollyRoger1516

[Kloothommel]

I believe RDNN are a mix and im unsure about LG

RDNN is mostly Danes and Norwegians, some Germans, Dutchies and even Aussies. Do we have the odd Russian or Ukranian. LG are mostly from the Russian Federation as far as I know. (Correct me if I'm wrong!)

 

Why were there several "strong hull" (RECENTLY BUILT) L'OCEAN in the Savanna Port Battle - where did they get the BP?

We bought the BP from the Swedes and started crafting like madmen. In a region with Strong Hull Bonus. With materials we gathered. that must seem very shocking to you...

 

 

PS: I too have a Santa Cecilia as a tournament gift. One I didn't ask for but am very happy to own, and I am very grateful for this.

 

PPS: I too would like to see ships available for all on equal chance. This levels out the playing field and makes the test of skill more real.

Edited November 5, 2016 by Kloothommel

[Powderhorn]

Please note that how "rare" ships are kept "rare" is still something in development.  Blueprint overhauls are scheduled for Dec - January patch.  If it's not working currently, I imagine it will be changed.  We are, as always, testing things to see what works and what does not.  Please be sure to approach such issues in such a way.  If it is already in the plans to be fixed, the general pulse of development on this game has been to focus on things one at a time, rather than having a sort of Brownian motion where a lot of little things are changed, but no real progress is made for lack of focused attention.

[Wesreidau]

I'm approaching the issue as a professional software tester who's input is valued.

 

This is broke, your proposed fix is worse, do not waste development time pursuing an even worse solution, fix what's broken, here's how.

 

If my input is not valued, I'll let you burn yourselves down on your own dime.

[Magnum]

Here is how: Make EVERY single Blueprint available for purchase with in game cash in Country Capitols for a price that is the same for all countries, Make the ships you want to keep rare VERY expensive - even INSANELY expensive. Since every single player has equal access to "making" in game cash it is eminently fair .....

 

It also has the advantage of being stupid simple.....

 

To do otherwise is to promote systemic unfairness - game-breaking by any standard.

[Wesreidau]

The fact is you made the bed you're sleeping in. Back in January, all the crafters learned to crank out exceptional ships in the destructive grind to get the next blueprint, because exceptional ships offered the best drop rate by far. Once you realize exceptional ships are barely more expensive than basic ships, you'll never make anything less. This was an apparent flaw all year. No effort has been made to fix it. The latest proposal is a frustrated "we quit, here, all ships are exceptional". It does not bode well.

[Sir Texas Sir]

That's no feedback Sir.

 

It is blindness.

 

If you refer to the Tournament prizes you will see teams from all over the place that received prizes including the ships you refer.

 

If you refer to the Treasure events of the past you will see a lot of people got some of the ships you refer and more.

The only issue I have is why haven't any things been planned for the other servers.  PvP1 isn't the only server in this game after all.   So if there is ever a merger than the guys that have had a chance to get these rare ships will have the advantage of having had chance  to get them when others didn't.   Well unless they do a wipe when they do the merger.

[Fenris]

Lemme take a long hard minute to think...

 

so Ocean, swedes won the tournament, the danish are allied with the swedes so obviously the danes went to the devs to get the BP /s

 

edit: also, you are british, unless something changed recently you got access to Oceans as well, oh and can i mention brits used agamemnons and rofl stomped the french(i believe?) with them? where was your bitching then?

Hear,hear

[JollyRoger1516]

The fact is you made the bed you're sleeping in. Back in January, all the crafters learned to crank out exceptional ships in the destructive grind to get the next blueprint, because exceptional ships offered the best drop rate by far. Once you realize exceptional ships are barely more expensive than basic ships, you'll never make anything less. This was an apparent flaw all year. No effort has been made to fix it. The latest proposal is a frustrated "we quit, here, all ships are exceptional". It does not bode well.

The issue is not just the blueprint crafting. Being in a ship with less mods has always been a disadvantage people wanted to not be subject to which I consider compeltely valid. The nerf of upgrades mgiht ahve made this advantage less but even 1% will still be 1% and give the golden ship an advantage. I would like to see the upgrades returning to old form and every ship gettin either a 3/5 choice or the ability to attack as many upgrades as possible provided they don't occupy the same space (only one rudder ugprade). This would allow compeltely fair fights. It is contrary what people complained about for the last 6 months not unfair when one ship is fully boarding modded and the other is fully shooting modded - very simple to win this by simply keeping at range or clasing rapidly - dont fight ont he enemies advantage. The real issue with this was only that marines aren't craftable giving gold marines a massive advantage. A nerf wasn't the necessary fix (gold boarding vs green will still auto win even on attacks vs defense)  - all upgrades should've been made craftable to provide equal chance instead. At this point you take upgrades with you for a 1-2.5% advantage that feels crap yet will lose you the fight if the captains are equally skilled if you didn't bring it...

 

So of course people go for golden ships if they don't want to be steamrolled by top clan gold ships (it seems nigh on impossible for somebdoy with a job and family to still keep up with crafting decent ships now - only groups or people with 10hours a day can still craft good ships now)

Edited November 5, 2016 by JollyRoger1516

[OlavDeng2]

The only issue I have is why haven't any things been planned for the other servers.  PvP1 isn't the only server in this game after all.   So if there is ever a merger than the guys that have had a chance to get these rare ships will have the advantage of having had chance  to get them when others didn't.   Well unless they do a wipe when they do the merger.

you know why, and some people arent going to like this, the reason is because no one in PVP2 could be bothered to arrange something like the tournament. It was an average joe(molon labe) that started the tournament, granted i took over after a while but that was after the devs sponsored some rewards, so if people on PVP2 rather than bitch about there not being a tournament started their own tournament and asked the devs if they could also get some sponsorship, i am sure the devs would happily agree. This bitching about there not being somethign similar i dont like since whose fault is it that there isnt anything similar?