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PvP2 Port reset - put your thoughts on Diplomacy here.

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I would like an open discussion to see where Individuals, Clans, and Nations are as far as diplomacy goes for after the port wipe.  There has been a lot of bad blood and alot of personal attacks and it has created a lot of poison and made the game toxic (at times).

 

While there are other nations with their own diplomacy stuff to consider, I will start with my own (personal) stance.

 

US, GB, VP, and Pirates.

 

Its a vicious war and I have no qualms with continuing it.  BUT not to the point where pirates take a capital or the pirates capital is taken (no nation will be able to resist Pirate Immunity, it will be a bum rush).

This is because that will force the pirates into an alliance thus breaking what it means to be a pirate.  Whether they cap or are capped the end result is the same.  Additionally, the loser can also abuse their alliance to join battles and take up spaces and troll etc.  I am on the fence on what to do, I back GB's US alliance 100% and would not support any peace if it meant they fight alone, but I also do not want to see Pirate nation ruined by a bad mechanic.  (Thank you devs, we all know you work hard and that this is not the final product and was the lesser of several evils given your constraints  o7)

 

 

War or Peace among nations, that's what this thread is for.  Please post your thoughts for your nation and your allies/enemies.

This is not a thread to formally agree to anything, just a way for us to brainstorm and get what we're always saying and thinking written formally down.

 

 

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I would like an open discussion to see where Individuals, Clans, and Nations are as far as diplomacy goes for after the port wipe. There has been a lot of bad blood and alot of personal attacks and it has created a lot of poison and made the game toxic (at times).

While there are other nations with their own diplomacy stuff to consider, I will start with my own (personal) stance.

US, GB, VP, and Pirates.

Its a vicious war and I have no qualms with continuing it. BUT not to the point where pirates take a capital or the pirates capital is taken (no nation will be able to resist Pirate Immunity, it will be a bum rush).

This is because that will force the pirates into an alliance thus breaking what it means to be a pirate. Whether they cap or are capped the end result is the same. Additionally, the loser can also abuse their alliance to join battles and take up spaces and troll etc. I am on the fence on what to do, I back GB's US alliance 100% and would not support any peace if it meant they fight alone, but I also do not want to see Pirate nation ruined by a bad mechanic. (Thank you devs, we all know you work hard and that this is not the final product and was the lesser of several evils given your constraints o7)

War or Peace among nations, that's what this thread is for. Please post your thoughts for your nation and your allies/enemies.

This is not a thread to formally agree to anything, just a way for us to brainstorm and get what we're always saying and thinking written formally down.

Ya know that since you GB&US are best friends and have an official peace ( and since February to be honest your two nations have tried off and on to stay peaceful but some players always ruined it.

I know this from doing privateer work for both sides and listening to whats going on. Thats beside the point but what is not is that you guys ( the biggest factions ) are not able and dont attack each other. What else does this leave ? Its pirates or little baby factions that stand no chance.

You guys created the boogy man named pirates. After the port wipe there will be no change. The two powerhouse factions will of course declare peace forever leaving nobody else to fight other than pirates. ..or the 6 french guys or maybe 10 danes orsomething.

Try war with a faction YOU SHOULD BE fighting and things could change.

Just the OP of a neutral bystander who has no interest in who fights who.

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To be honest the two largest nations should never be in a alliance for long.  Loo how stale things have been since pirates topped fighting the port stuff.   Who else is there to fight?  Even the smaller nations have an alliance with Brits (which I can see) but to be all honest it's pretty much every one against Spain (uh is there any one left other than one player and his alts?), Danes (They only have one real time zone to fight in and well that is more small nations fighting with a little brit thrown in) and Pirates (every one hates us).

 

I really wish Pirate capital was Kidd's Island not right int he center of things.  It's going to be to tempting for some one to try to roll them fast off the bat for the reason you meantion above.  I would be happy with just being a thron in the sides as other natiosn fight each other.  Some pirates can fight for one side or the other and some can just hate every one, but that will never happen when some of the top nations all have alliance with each other and aren't fighting other nations.

 

To be honest US and BRITS should be at war with each other.  The smaller nations should pick sides and help each other out.   And pirates should just be a thorn in every ones side.  Helping some and hunting others (or all).  

 

 

I'll be honest with you I expect US to try to do the GULF grab up  since there is little to no Spanish to fight back, but most nations are going to do this.  The good thing is that creates agro and a place for us to go get PvP no matter what Nation you are.   You might pick one side or the other.  Once we know the regions that give special perks in crafting ships those are going to be hot spots for sure.

 

Does any one know if the alliance votes will be reset on patch?   They should be so every one starts over from scratch after the patch with who you will align with or fight against.

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Does any one know if the alliance votes will be reset on patch?   They should be so every one starts over from scratch after the patch with who you will align with or fight against.

Alliance may or may not reset depending on the coding but I would assume yes.  Also, Aliiances will be extended as the Devs had said.

 

As for US GB Love, that is inevitable, it used to be Pirate GB love if you remember.  When you have 3 superpowers, its inevitable that two will team up against the other in real life or a game and that is not a problem that can be solved with or without changes from the Devs.  Its human Nature, the enemy of my enemy and all that.

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Alliance may or may not reset depending on the coding but I would assume yes. Also, Aliiances will be extended as the Devs had said.

As for US GB Love, that is inevitable, it used to be Pirate GB love if you remember. When you have 3 superpowers, its inevitable that two will team up against the other in real life or a game and that is not a problem that can be solved with or without changes from the Devs. Its human Nature, the enemy of my enemy and all that.

Not my fight since im just holding out for the pirate fix and probably become the only pirate clan left ( but will gladly privateer for former mates ) but if you guy consider 15 guys a super power you are gonna be in a.butt ton of trouble if this game ever goes live.

To be honest the two largest nations should never be in a alliance for long. Loo how stale things have been since pirates topped fighting the port stuff. Who else is there to fight? Even the smaller nations have an alliance with Brits (which I can see) but to be all honest it's pretty much every one against Spain (uh is there any one left other than one player and his alts?), Danes (They only have one real time zone to fight in and well that is more small nations fighting with a little brit thrown in) and Pirates (every one hates us).

I really wish Pirate capital was Kidd's Island not right int he center of things. It's going to be to tempting for some one to try to roll them fast off the bat for the reason you meantion above. I would be happy with just being a thron in the sides as other natiosn fight each other. Some pirates can fight for one side or the other and some can just hate every one, but that will never happen when some of the top nations all have alliance with each other and aren't fighting other nations.

To be honest US and BRITS should be at war with each other. The smaller nations should pick sides and help each other out. And pirates should just be a thorn in every ones side. Helping some and hunting others (or all).

I'll be honest with you I expect US to try to do the GULF grab up since there is little to no Spanish to fight back, but most nations are going to do this. The good thing is that creates agro and a place for us to go get PvP no matter what Nation you are. You might pick one side or the other. Once we know the regions that give special perks in crafting ships those are going to be hot spots for sure.

Does any one know if the alliance votes will be reset on patch? They should be so every one starts over from scratch after the patch with who you will align with or fight against.

They wont roll the pirates. They will both spend weeks fighting all the empty port battles to re capture neutral or undefended spanish ports THEN align and we will be right back where we are the day tje server rebooted.

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It will be very interesting to see how things work out.  Until we see exactly how the aggression and the following port battles are handled, it is a big guessing game.   Fighting for France, we have been battling the Danes - but the massive issue there is the difference in time zones and all the current port timers.  So I just can't see how future port battles will address that.  Today, it is very difficult to attack the Danes as their port times open at 5am Pacific USA time - and we have a decent amount of players in that time zone.  Even with a spread in the potential port battle times, it still is likely either attackers or defenders won't be able to muster a full force - especially if the port battles occur on a week day.

 

The discussion in this thread is assuming players don't change country.  Spain has such a small population (today) - but will players jump ship and move to Spain?  I suspect a fair few will. 

 

Place your bets and spin the wheel.... 

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Im more interested in what is going to play out once pirates go through "the change".

I cant picture many pirates on both servers staying pirates if they cant do port battles. I see them playing nationals since they basically are now OR playing a national as a pirate/privateer.

Then i see spain or france getting a population bomb.

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Well, according to the posts from admins about pirates, this patch won't be much change for pirate mechanics. Maybe I'm wrong.

I can say that no matter the nation, Total Oblivion will remain mates to mates. Currently this is a US and Dutch friendship. We will however remain competitive when needed. TOVNM does still have many friends in US, Brit, France and Pirate nations who we may at times give free passes to. But as for active aggression against to seek out....no, unless mutually agreed upon.

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This is how I see it would work for everyone.

 

1. We draw a line around capital immediate surrounding ports. Those are non touchable so Nation will always have some ports. Im talking about 10 or so ports to ensure that Nation is working no matter on the outcome of the wars it might have.

2. All other ports are a fair game.

3. No port battles happen on an instant. This needs to be declared 24 in advance. Post on forum - this and that port will be attacked at this and that time the following day.

4. People are not tagged before they could join the PB.

 

Start simple and see if we can cooperate and elaborate from here.

The main issue that you have is that Nations are not united. Some clans will do there own and fuck up any agreements

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Not my fight since im just holding out for the pirate fix and probably become the only pirate clan left ( but will gladly privateer for former mates ) but if you guy consider 15 guys a super power you are gonna be in a.butt ton of trouble if this game ever goes live.

They wont roll the pirates. They will both spend weeks fighting all the empty port battles to re capture neutral or undefended spanish ports THEN align and we will be right back where we are the day tje server rebooted.

People need to stop talking about Pirate Mechanics until all the Nation stuff is done as per Devs.   We are a Nation until than and we will just have to wait until the patch for Pirates comes out (prob going to be the next big one).

 

 

With that yah we will prob be having a blast every time they start to run up agro in an area we can just show up to fight them for the PvP and we don't even have to drive up our own agro.  Thus keeping Spain ports safe from capture even if no one is there to defend them for the most part.

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I'm not a fan of Mega-Alliances in games like this. In games past, I've seen them lead to a stale game environment, especially if the smaller groups get sick of constantly beating their heads against a Zergnaught.

We've got an opportunity with the incoming patch to take a fresh look at the game. Maybe try something different instead of just settling back into the previously established status quo.

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  BUT not to the point where pirates take a capital or the pirates capital is taken (no nation will be able to resist Pirate Immunity, it will be a bum rush).

This is because that will force the pirates into an alliance thus breaking what it means to be a pirate.  Whether they cap or are capped the end result is the same.  Additionally, the loser can also abuse their alliance to join battles and take up spaces and troll etc.  I am on the fence on what to do, I back GB's US alliance 100% and would not support any peace if it meant they fight alone, but I also do not want to see Pirate nation ruined by a bad mechanic.  (Thank you devs, we all know you work hard and that this is not the final product and was the lesser of several evils given your constraints  o7)

 

I'm a PvP1 player, I have no dog in this particular PvP2 fight.

 

Just wanted to throw out there, there's no indication that capturable national capitals are coming this patch.  This came up over the summer as a hypothetical idea (in OP of the linked thread).  The language was "Potential proposals for discussion:  Capitals could become capturable".  I've seen nothing since showing that this proposal is actually being implemented, in either this patch or a future one.

 

http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/15638-development-plans-for-conquest-mechanics-rvr/

Edited by Bramborough

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I'm a PvP1 player, I have no dog in this particular PvP2 fight.

 

Just wanted to throw out there, there's no indication that capturable national capitals are coming this patch.  This came up over the summer as a hypothetical idea (in OP of the linked thread).  The language was "Potential proposals for discussion:  Capitals could become capturable".  I've seen nothing since showing that this proposal is actually being implemented, in either this patch or a future one.

 

http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/15638-development-plans-for-conquest-mechanics-rvr/

Nor is any of it explained in full detail and prob won't be until the patch comes out.  They need something to reset the servers or it will get stale.  This could be total coquest or every so many months it resets.  I would say three months would be a good time to do resets or even monthly but I don't think monthly would be good with how much area Spain starts out with.   So the 3 month thing would be best as it will take a while to do battles and take lands.   

 

To be honest we don't know any detail and should just wait for the patch instead of just guessing and putting that info out there. In the very link you post the DEVS say there will be conquest.  They haven't said it can't be.  I'm going to bet we will be play testing these very things to see what works or not.

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Honestly the two big powerhouses US and GB shouldnt be allied. They should each ally with a smaller nation and help them grow.

 

As for Pirates being in the big 3 I doubt it. Our player base is small, and it has been one clan on Pirates sticking it to the big alliance.

 

This is hypotheitcally speaking, say you get Pirates down to one port. Who do you fight then? Do you go after a small nation, take them to one port? 

 

We all know US and GB stance with the other nations that are active and growing, France, Dutch, Swede. You wont fight them you will make a carebear alliance deal and turn PvP2 into a pve server. So the image I get and hear from others is you just want to fight the Pirates and the Danes. I personally think the devs dropped the ball on the whole alliance system. Its limiting pvp on a small population server. But hey thats my opinion. 

 

Why starve yourselves of pvp and ally i will never understand. The two biggest nations should be warring. 

 

Personally i hate ports and our clan took ports in the hope of getting battles. But when people avoid battles and ports end up being taken empty we said enough is enough. Time for a break and wait for reset. I wish this patch they said Pirates cant take ports and we can just come and Raid and just jump in your hostility missions and sink who ever.

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What we have now for an alliance is a result of voting by one group , and their alliance alts. At the onset, there were at least 5-6 other smaller groups that opposed this but were powerless to do anything about it despite what all the propaganda would have one believe. The mechanics of Politics are fundamentally broken and need fixing. I believe , and at the very least hope, that this is being monitored by the developers and is addressed accordingly. One group in any nation should not have that much "pull" or the rest of that nation is subject to their decisions. Which in recent history has certainly shown not always to be the best thing for the nation for sure. Player controlled mmo games have always failed. I think to an extent the core game mechanics should prevent this.

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Personally i hate ports and our clan took ports in the hope of getting battles. But when people avoid battles and ports end up being taken empty we said enough is enough. Time for a break and wait for reset. I wish this patch they said Pirates cant take ports and we can just come and Raid and just jump in your hostility missions and sink who ever.

 

Just because we can still take ports, doesn't mean we have to. We could make the choice to not participate in port battles and just do exactly you've just posted. Be Pirates. Jump people in hostility missions. Intercept trade ships. Be a pain in EVERYBODY'S side and not get involved in the affairs of Nationals, unless of course it's on a short term and we're being paid hefty amounts of gold for our services.

 

That's what I was getting at in my previous post when I said there's a chance to look at the game with a fresh set of eyes and not go back to previous ways.

 

I'm just a filthy casual rank and file member of BLACK, but if I could sweet talk the leadership with a sexy accent, I'd be lobbying for a policy of "ABSOLUTELY NO NATION BUILDING. WE'RE GONNA JUST PEE IN EVERYONE'S BOOT BECAUSE WE CAN"

Edited by Rhodry Heidenrich
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While I can't disclose the specific future plans of the Dutch, I can say that we intend to keep friendships with those nations who have helped us.  There are other nations with whom we intend to cease hostilities as it serves no purpose to be at war with them although we probably will not be allies (same with old alliances that have not been productive).   Any faction that we plan to attack will be for the purposes of growing or in defense of our nation  and it wont be personal.  Diplomacy will happen with or without an in-game mechanism to make it happen as it always has.

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This is how I see it would work for everyone.

 

1. We draw a line around capital immediate surrounding ports. Those are non touchable so Nation will always have some ports. Im talking about 10 or so ports to ensure that Nation is working no matter on the outcome of the wars it might have.

2. All other ports are a fair game.

3. No port battles happen on an instant. This needs to be declared 24 in advance. Post on forum - this and that port will be attacked at this and that time the following day.

4. People are not tagged before they could join the PB.

 

Start simple and see if we can cooperate and elaborate from here.

The main issue that you have is that Nations are not united. Some clans will do there own and fuck up any agreements

 

I'd be all game with this. Even before we can keep it at the 5 port minimum. With the resource map changing on top of port reset (at least stated), it'll be very interesting. I just have a big feeling that there will be groups of players who won't follow it no matter what. IF you've experienced a war to only your capital left a lot of people gain resentment against the opposition and wish for them to be at one port as well.

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LoL The way I see it the US or The Brits are going down.  NOT MATTER TO ME THE OUT COME.  Both sides been beating the war drums LOOK WE ARE PUSHING THE BACK. lol Yea you are, keep on pushing guys break us - O snap you wasted your time on empty port battles but that comes to a end, we hope this week. we the Rats will prob never give the Brits a reprieve until KPR Capital  IS taken.

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The Brit/ US alliance is a direct result of the Pirate war against the Brits. Even with the alliance, Pirates were able to take all the Brit ports on PVP2. Now Brits are taking some back only because Pirates have decided not to defend them very much.  Since Pirates were able to take all the Brit ports even with the US/Brit alliance, this is why the alliance needs to be there. It's not voted by one group. It's voted by most Brit and US players because they've seen and haven't forgotten what the Pirates were able to do and did to the Brits and I doubt it will be forgotten any time soon.

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The Brit/ US alliance is a direct result of the Pirate war against the Brits. Even with the alliance, Pirates were able to take all the Brit ports on PVP2. Now Brits are taking some back only because Pirates have decided not to defend them very much. Since Pirates were able to take all the Brit ports even with the US/Brit alliance, this is why the alliance needs to be there. It's not voted by one group. It's voted by most Brit and US players because they've seen and haven't forgotten what the Pirates were able to do and did to the Brits and I doubt it will be forgotten any time soon.

You were alllied before the war started. You planned to ally and wipe us out. They are the words from Cordova when he came on teamspeak. That is why the Dutch came to war against us and French after we had been at peace. He stated that he want the server to wipe us out. Don't start this bullshit we started the war. But remember when we were allied we never took your ports and the alliance worked against the US. Funny how you choose to forget.

As for the ports we are Pirates and we don't care about ports. We took ports in looking for a fight. Nationals car about pixels. We care about fights. That's the difference between us. On reset we will be doing things differently when we all come back.

Edited by Loco Bandito
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Just because we can still take ports, doesn't mean we have to. We could make the choice to not participate in port battles and just do exactly you've just posted. Be Pirates. Jump people in hostility missions. Intercept trade ships. Be a pain in EVERYBODY'S side and not get involved in the affairs of Nationals, unless of course it's on a short term and we're being paid hefty amounts of gold for our services.

That's what I was getting at in my previous post when I said there's a chance to look at the game with a fresh set of eyes and not go back to previous ways.

I'm just a filthy casual rank and file member of BLACK, but if I could sweet talk the leadership with a sexy accent, I'd be lobbying for a policy of "ABSOLUTELY NO NATION BUILDING. WE'RE GONNA JUST PEE IN EVERYONE'S BOOT BECAUSE WE CAN"

I agree with you. The best thing with this new patch is we don't need ports to find fights. We have the hostility missions with open timers to find the fights and we can choose which nation to help grow.

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I would like to see nations dropped altogether and PVP2 become a clans only server, PvP 2 would be great for this. Toxic national rubbish is killing it.

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You were alllied before the war started. You planned to ally and wipe us out. They are the words from Cordova when he came on teamspeak. That is why the Dutch came to war against us and French after we had been at peace. He stated that he want the server to wipe us out. Don't start this bullshit we started the war. But remember when we were allied we never took your ports and the alliance worked against the US. Funny how you choose to forget.

As for the ports we are Pirates and we don't care about ports. We took ports in looking for a fight. Nationals car about pixels. We care about fights. That's the difference between us. On reset we will be doing things differently when we all come back.

 

1.  The Dutch war with the Pirates is totally unrelated to the GB war with the Pirates except in that GB has volunteered come down to help us often.  We went to war because you guys couldn't hold the deal over Zutman and attacked our other ports.

 

2.  Secondly, not caring about ports  and only using them as an excuse to PvP is a complete lie.  If this was really the case, you wouldn't have been observed on enumerable occasions taking empty French and Dutch ports during periods of low server pop, as empty ports no matter when the port timers were set, apparently don't interest you.

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You were alllied before the war started. You planned to ally and wipe us out.

 

 

 

No we weren't allied with US. The ally system didn't even come out until after that incident. If Cordova had any agreements with the US before then I  was not aware or my clan mates as far as I am aware. So don't say "you". Cordova is the leader of a clan we work with because he is an good organizer, a fun guy to game with and generally seems like a pretty decent guy. Unlike the image you all tried to paint on him over that one stupid port. As far as I am aware, he didn't go to the US until he came to your TS announcing we were taking that port, but you all had a fit over it. We all had already sailed up there to take it, so he had pressure on him from us as well not to have us sail up there for nothing. We wouldn't have gone up there if we didn't think it was safe to take without problems.

 

 The whole issue could have been resolved much more civilized. But no, you all had to go over board and take all our ports. Now it has been revealed what you are capable of. You should have just taken a few ports, even at Jamaica to make your point, but no, you had to take it as far as you could.

 So if you really wanted to make this image that you are fighting against two super powers, you should have been a little more stealthy about what you are capable of instead of taking out your beef against Cordova against the whole Brit population, but that's the bed you made. Besides, I like being allied with US. No pirate harbor was ever safe for us to sail into even with Cordova's alliance.

Edited by Jima

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