Jump to content
Game-Labs Forum
Sign in to follow this  
admin

Endymion and Indefatigable

Recommended Posts

it depends on the ship and regional bonuses

empty endymion supposed to sail 15 knots

it kinda is not supposed to sail 14.98 with max weaponry

 

I think someone forgot to give my Endymion the memo on speed limits...   :P

post-20-0-47218700-1477197706_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think someone forgot to give my Endymion the memo on speed limits...   :P

 

Same lol. 

Oak Endymion, Exceptional Pirate Refit, Copper Plating. 

24pd Longs, 9 Pd Longs, 9 Pd Longs, 9 Pd Longs. (Gundeck, Top Deck, Bow and Stern chasers). 

16 knots max speed in Battle.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Same lol. 

Oak Endymion, Exceptional Pirate Refit, Copper Plating. 

24pd Longs, 9 Pd Longs, 9 Pd Longs, 9 Pd Longs. (Gundeck, Top Deck, Bow and Stern chasers). 

16 knots max speed in Battle.

speedboat of the seas and my live oak indefat with gold pirate refit bonus with 24s(once longs now med) and long 12s would do about 13.6(with all longs ill have to tinker with the meds speed diff)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have to jump in on the Endymion being broken; ran into one that chased me down in my le gros ventre (fir with built in speed, with exceptional speed trim, and exceptional copper plating).  I shot its sails down to 90% with a whole fleet of friendly ships he pulled in chasing him and he just kept gaining more and more distance (my sails were at 100% the whole time).  This ship is pretty ridiculous. 

Edited by Ultravis

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have to jump in on the Endymion being broken; ran into one that chased me down in my le gros ventre (fir with built in speed, with exceptional speed trim, and exceptional copper plating).  I shot its sails down to 90% with a whole fleet of friendly ships he pulled in chasing him and he just kept gaining more and more distance (my sails were at 100% the whole time).  This ship is pretty ridiculous. 

Turn upwind and say goodbye!

Endymion's sailing profile:

SailingProfileENDYMION.png

 

Le Gros Ventre's sailing profile: 

SailingProfileLEGROSVENTRE.png

Learn the strength of your ship and use it to your adventage. If you running downwind you will never going to get away it's one of the fastest if not the fastest downwind sailer in the game at the moment and compared with an LGV she is really bad upwind. I was in a fight where we were chasing an LGV with a Surprise and an Endymion in our fleet, but this guy sailed ridiculously close to the wind, and the Endymion was miles behind the whole time. There is no easier situation in an LGV then running from a solo Renomee/Endymion/Trincomalee. Especially if you invest into a gold staysails. The ship is not broken, it has a few downsides so it is well balanced imo. It has a very bad turnrate, only 340 crew for her heavy armament so running 24 pounders on her can be quite tricky. 

Edited by Lockheed
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Turn upwind and say goodbye!

Endymion's sailing profile:

SailingProfileENDYMION.png

 

Le Gros Ventre's sailing profile: 

SailingProfileLEGROSVENTRE.png

Learn the strength of your ship and use it to your adventage. If you running downwind you will never going to get away it's one of the fastest if not the fastest downwind sailer in the game at the moment and compared with an LGV she is really bad upwind. I was in a fight where we were chasing an LGV with a Surprise and an Endymion in our fleet, but this guy sailed ridiculously close to the wind, and the Endymion was miles behind the whole time. There is no easier situation in an LGV then running from a solo Renomee/Endymion/Trincomalee. Especially if you invest into a gold staysails. The ship is not broken, it has a few downsides so it is well balanced imo. It has a very bad turnrate, only 340 crew for her heavy armament so running 24 pounders on her can be quite tricky. 

 

Nevertheless, I think the Endymion has too little armour for the lack of turnrate. I'm very ashamed to say I lost the one you gave me Lockheed :wacko:, against a Trinc and a Surprise. Couldn't point enough broadsides at the Surprise after I sunk the Trinc which battered me somewhat, but being used to chalk those off with a gold carronade belle-poule it simply didn't occur to me that I would lose. Very sad tho, and I will look for another one to see if I didn't just do a terrible job on sailing. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even if the events had taken place in the last two weeks, all it means is that 2 more players on each server could craft them. 

 

Those events really should of gave a redeemable ship to test not a whole BP for the ship so only a few select few had them.  Than make them special drops for crafting levels and such.  The L'Ocean should be in the game for every one now at crafting level 50.  The SC can stay a rare even ship but you don't have to give the BP out to do this, just give redeemable ships to keep it special and rare.  H. Rattler should be added to the crafting tree cause it's such a key shallow water ship now a days that makes a big different when you have them on your team over a team that doesn't.  A good balance for this is to do like the Agomon is now allowed in 4th rate battles.  Let the Niagra into shallow water battles now.   It's open haul so you can still just shred it's crew with grape to make up for the cannon weight difference.

 

Don't worry mate, her reload will suffer a lot. With 24 pounders she will need more crew on gunnery then her entire complement. :) Will test it today with both 24 and 18 pounders an come back with numbers. She is a really fast sailer but her turnrate is just awful... :D

 

Not to mention the guy said FIR ship.   To me that is a glass cannon ship and will get shredded by most things it might fight against .   The Endy turn rate and speed angles are it's down side that you can easily use against it in a fight.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here the numbers with 24/9/9/9 armaments. Thats a LOT of crew on gunnery!  As long as you can maintain your speed its fine and happy, but the moment you drop bellow 5kn and just think about tacking you will wish that you would had wear the ship instead. :) I will probably end up using her with 18 pounders especially, because the speed difference on the one I have capped (Bermuda Cedar, French Refit) is 0,03kn between 18 and 12 pounders. It is a very nice ship when it comes to run down someone downwind, she has a very decent armament ( can be fitted with 32pounder carronades on both decks )  and she is really beautifully done.

7ec8911e687e427e85439896a80f0d1d.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Turn upwind and say goodbye!

 

Learn the strength of your ship and use it to your adventage. If you running downwind you will never going to get away it's one of the fastest if not the fastest downwind sailer in the game at the moment and compared with an LGV she is really bad upwind. I was in a fight where we were chasing an LGV with a Surprise and an Endymion in our fleet, but this guy sailed ridiculously close to the wind, and the Endymion was miles behind the whole time. There is no easier situation in an LGV then running from a solo Renomee/Endymion/Trincomalee. Especially if you invest into a gold staysails. The ship is not broken, it has a few downsides so it is well balanced imo. It has a very bad turnrate, only 340 crew for her heavy armament so running 24 pounders on her can be quite tricky. 

 

Did you even read what I said?  I was chasing a player Endymion in my LGV that was decked for speed.  He tagged me and pulled in an entire fleet, so I was hitting his sails to slow him down so the NPC ships could catch up, but he just pulled away with no chance of gaining on him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Did you even read what I said?  I was chasing a player Endymion in my LGV that was decked for speed.  He tagged me and pulled in an entire fleet, so I was hitting his sails to slow him down so the NPC ships could catch up, but he just pulled away with no chance of gaining on him.

Oh yes, you're right please accept my apologies English is not my main language  I have been confused by the term "chased me down", I thought he was chasing you and you could not get away. I have an LGV myself but I prefer to use her sailing abilities close hauled, not many ship can follow her there. It has gold staysails, and copper and its a sweet sailing vessel. I have found the speed of Rattlesnakes and Renomees quite dangerous to her so I have decided to further strengthen her already exceptional upwind capabilities. She is quite fast downwind but I do not think she would be a match for the Endymion/Renomee/Rattlesnake so im not surprised the Endymion was faster since she is the fastest ship in the game as far as I know. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I used to think that the Endymion would make the Trinco and the Renomee obsolete but the Endymion is terrible at turning.  I might use one as a fleet ship but I sure wouldn't want to be doing anything other than chasing in it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The real life Endymion was broken OP too.

Endymion was never replicated, her sister ships had no legendary air of being fast and the French original designs didn't do anything other Frigates couldn't do either.

 

I propose to rename the ship to HMS Severn, and put the nerfbat to it.

No need to change her model to make her look like an actual Pomone that way, and she can still be a fast and a very useful 24pd frigate, but because the mythical Endymion name is out of the way she can be balanced.

 

Endymion should never have been in the game.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Endymion is fine IF she is historical.

 

 

The game needs to take a two-tiered approach to balancing historical vessels.

 

 

  1. General 'classes' of vessels, or ships for which documentation is scarce
  2. Vessels with 'personalities' or superlative qualities, with well-documented characteristics

Let us take the Category 1 vessels and slap all sorts of mods on them, and do whatever the sandbox allows.

 

But Category 2 vessels need their performance capped. No matter your perks and mods, Endymion should never exceed 14.4 kts with 18-pounders. Same goes for the likes of Constitution and Renommee. No more of this performance inflation bullshit on the basis of compound interest buffs that are either too easy to get or make the game gear-based instead of skill-based.

 

 

There is a fragile balance by which many vessels are viable on the OW. Know your points of sail and manage your weather gage, and you can escape. Perks and mods can destroy this balance entirely.

  • Like 13

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, what is in effect a "0 slot ship" could work too.

 

But I'd rather have no 14+ knot ships in the game right now at all. Every new ship they add will feel underwhelming because of the unrealistic baseline expectations now.

I don't think this is a winning combination - literally every single Frigate is going to be 'worse' than Endymion going forward.

Why trigger a a moment of disappointment with every new ship.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Endymion feels rather balanced imo. While it's super fast tagging ships aren't that useful anymore after the changes to RoE. 

 

Furthermore the Endymion is weaker than the Trincomalee. It turns like a whale as well. It bleeds speed like crazy too. It's only overly fast at it's very best angle of sail.

 

Pro's: 

- Very fast at best angle. 

- 24 Pd longs usefull at longer ranges. (And can demast any ship in the game). 

 

Con's: 

- 1 Dura (For now atleast). 

- Bleeds speed like crazy.

- Turns like a whale. 

- Very Fragile compared to most other 5th rates. 

- Tacks like a Santissima.

 

All in all i feel like this is well balanced.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the issue is not so much with the Endymion as with the module and bonus stacking. Maybe it is not the ship that is OP rather it is the Pirate refit + Copper + Speed trim + fast wood type that is OP.

 

The one I have is Bermuda Cedar and goes 14.6 with a 18/32/9 loadout. This is certainly close to the historical recorded max speed with no other mods/perks added.

 

Maybe a ship should have a slower base speed to compensate for all the potential mods, something like WT where you have to research and unlock better modules to bring the vehicle up to historical potential.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, and there is a 5% speed buff in some of the regional bonuses.

 

Percentage speed buffs need to be killed with fire, or you get monster Endymions.

 

 

 

For the fourteen-billionth goddamn time, speed buffs should really apply to only one point of sail. Heck, let is be random each time.

  • Like 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The trapdoor with Endymion is that while she may be balanced now because she's flimsy you look a bit daft when you add the French Pomone (a very reasonable choice for a French Frigate btw) and the French ship is slower but has more hp.

 

You end up with the British clone being the lightly built version of the French original. That is back to front, really. :)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The nerf was a bit extreme imo. 

 

My Pre Patch OW Trincomalee (Teak) can now catch my Endymion. 

 

Basically, the 1 good thing about the Endymion have been taken away.

It was straight up bad or mediocre at everything other than going fast.

 

I understand that some people like history and realism. Personally i'm more of a gameplay guy, i want things to be balanced and different items (In this case ships) need to be good at atleast 1 thing. Or just be an "all rounder". 

Right now, Endymion isn't an all rounder and the thing it was good at has just been nerfed like crazy. 

 

Combine this with the fact that she is 1 dura only ship. Well, i doubt you'll see many Endymions now.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Endymion was very fast upwind IRL, and there's no historical reason to make her weak.

 

So she can be an all rounder.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I tried to chase LGV today with Endymion that had 14.94 speed before nerf, including mastercrafted Extra Staysails. Let's just say the trader moved on 60 degrees (links with sailing profiles below) so he outrunned me....

 

And i must say it's crap now. Not worth effort, especially with 1 Dura.

 

http://www.navalactionwiki.com/index.php?title=Endymion
http://www.navalactionwiki.com/index.php?title=Le_Gros_Ventre

Edited by Darayavahus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Could Endymion ever catch LGV at 60 degrees? Its sailing profile is crap (the real one did 11 knots closehauled, like Trinc).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bermuda cedar Endymion with yellow copper plating and medium 24pdrs / 32pdr carronades = 13.67kn, before application of additional bonuses including potential regional speed bonuses, speed perks, speed trim and studding sails.

 

historical speed with 24pdrs = 13.6kn

 

 


And maybe Indefatigable will give us an opportunity to fix the thickness stats. If her hull is thicker than Constitution's, I will be vexed.

 

It is 5cm thicker. (Effective thickness even greater due slab-sided 3D model of Constitution.) Also nearly 0.8kn faster than Constitution.  And can carry 42pdr carronades on gundeck. And is a 5th rate, not a 4th rate. :wacko:

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cut the Endy's speed to 13.5 kts and give her a wider sailing profile. With that she will be a fast all rounder just as her real counterpart was it.

 

Btw, the Trinc definitely needs a speed boost (to say 13 kts?), not to mention a drastic reduction to that damn heel of hers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...