Jump to content
Game-Labs Forum
JollyRoger1516

Yesterday upon the stair (Ganking Fleets)

Recommended Posts

Yesterday upon the stair(Port Morant - Carlisle)

I met a man(French, Danes) who wasn't there(hiding in battle results/logging off)

He wasn't there again today(randomly people from yesterday log in and pop out around the port)

I wish, I wish he'd go away(or start playing an actual PvP game instead of using this exploit)

 

The British nation would appreciate if the ganker fleets in the area of Carlisle would not use the battle result hiding exploits to end the night of PvP after a single attack. If you're short on time Jamaica is the wrong place for an attack and if you're afraid to lose your ship the same applies. Especially a fleet of 22 should not be afraid to actually go for a genuine fight which could've provided everyone with a lot of fun. Personally I see no fun/challenge in ganking but if you do it please be ready to face all repercussions that may come upon you instead of wasting everybody's time and fun after jumping a little clanless cerberus with 22 ships.

As far as I and those I can vouch for are concerned we will not be backing away from a fight that we brought on our own and will now be attacking your homeports with fair fights. Please consider doing the same in the interest of a fun game for all.

 

A little further warning:

It has come to our attention that some smaller ganking fleets now actively search for an ai ship close to KPR to create such battle result screen situation. WIth the intention of this being the last action of the night they apparently log off so they can have an invisible fleet ready to attack in the early afternoon near our homeports.

This goes beyond merely trying to save one's hide and is in my/our eyes an unacceptable misuse of the mechanic.

We've started to collect evidence on this and should this behaviour not rapidly disappear I will launch a tribunal about this!

 

To the devs:

Please consider reworking the battle result screen asap as it currently proofs to be an exploited hassle for all fair playing folk around the isle and surely in other places as well.

 

P.S.: I used the words 'the British nation' as a lot of people are seriously unhappy about this. Should you however take offense to me representing you here just substitue this for my own persona.

Also this is a somewhat serious topic - have fun discussing it but serious forum pvp as some practice it is not desired here! Keep it civil everybody!

 

For those who liked the poem:

 

Antigonish - William Hughes Mearns

 

Yesterday upon the stair

I met a man who wasn't there

He wasn't there again today

I wish, I wish he'd go away

 

When I came home last night at three

The man was waiting there for me

But when I looked around the hall

I couldn't see him there at all!

Go away, go away, don't you come back anymore!

Go away, go away, and please don't slam the door

 

Last night I saw upon the stair

A little man who wasn't there

He wasn't there again today

Oh, how I wish he'd go away

  • Like 10

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Absolutely +1. All those battle results exploits are a top priority issue to be addressed in my opinion.

Edited by Red Jack Walker
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

happened again in front of Roseau yesterday with British captains.

 

yet I agree i'm not fond of hiding in battle screen. But instead of creating a topic in national news, or threatening with a tribunal post, maybe you should have made a neutral post discussing the mechanism. This thread will achieve nothing other than pointing finger and throwing empty accusations.

Edited by Tenakha Kan
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

happened again in front of Roseau yesterday with British captains.

 

yet I agree i'm not fond of hiding in battle screen. But instead of creating a topic in national news, or threatening with a tribunal post, maybe you should have made a neutral post discussing the mechanism. This thread will achieve nothing other than pointing finger and throwing empty accusations.

Compared to almost all the other so called "mechanics discussion" threads that have been created over the last month, I find this one to be rather nicely worded and creative.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. Please keep the letter's size at a readable level - had to bloody lean in for that ;)

2. The tribunal evidence collection is simply informing you of our ongoing activities - if you're not involved this should come as no threat and can be supported with evidence against players of any nation that resolve to such a low tactic - I wish for this to be gone no matter who does it!

3.This is written from a British perspective hence it would be hard to achieve any neutrality - we've been effected by this by players of the aforementioned nations. Others may have different opponents with which they had this problem. This is therefore also a national declaration of asking everyone to stop this behaviour - a change to the mechanic has only been a small sidenote to the devs into which nothing else should be read!

4. I don't have a solution other then the proposed gentlemen's behaviour - therefore this is not a mechanic discussion post!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

this just gets shouted down because "people gotta be able to pee after a fight"

they shall do, but not half an hour or more...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^^ that, and who wants to renter OW when there are 10 ships waiting at the crossed swords.

if you do not dare fight a fleet then sitting next to the capital is the wrong place for you - there is a reason many privateers attempted to search for fights near the coast of Ireland and in the Carribean as the reaction time from the Chatham Docks would've meant certain death to them. As a privateer you need to know what fights to pick and not rely on magical mechanics.

 

10mins is enough time to pee - otherwise i'd advise you to go visit a doctor ;)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Imo, if you couldn't see the battle location when it started, you should not be able to see the crossed swords. That and get rid of one of the map ordinates (was it longitude that was hard to calculate?).

Edited by Anne Wildcat

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This seems to be a popular topic.

 

BR screen, is good to have.  I have posted multiple times about this even myself.

 

Shorty again....

 

A gank team hits a target.  Target uses Team Speak and National chat to rally his friends to the location.  His friends teleport to the nearest outpost and sail to the location, to wait the gank fleet.  So this whole scenario is stupid, and unrealistic.  BR Screen is a very good thing to have, it is protecting from teleport gank.

 

And indeed, teleport gank is even worse exploit than waiting in BR screen.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Imo, if you couldn't see the battle location when it started, you should not be able to see the crossed swords. That and get rid of one of the map ordinates (was it longitude that was hard to calculate?).

floating debris of wooden planks or such being shot of marked ongoing battles or former battles for days - while it was rather hard/near impossible to call for immediate help due to the day long chases ships could be alert to enemy presence in the region long after a fight had ended or moved far further out!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sometimes battles are so long that when the battle is over there is rl stuff to do. Without the possibility to logoff in the resultscreen people will get caught in ow and forced to stay in-game.

It will be so easy to harass people, because you know where and when they going to leave the battle.You wouldn't actually need to fight. The guy with more spare time will win, because

the only way to escape this harass chain is surrendering.

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This seems to be a popular topic.

 

BR screen, is good to have.  I have posted multiple times about this even myself.

 

Shorty again....

 

A gank team hits a target.  Target uses Team Speak and National chat to rally his friends to the location.  His friends teleport to the nearest outpost and sail to the location, to wait the gank fleet.  So this whole scenario is stupid, and unrealistic.  BR Screen is a very good thing to have, it is protecting from teleport gank.

 

And indeed, teleport gank is even worse exploit than waiting in BR screen.

A in my humble opinion useless analogy - the gank team has to teleport to ile a vache itself to get the quickest hit on KPR - half of the response on the other hand is already there though I understand their reaction time is rather quick - that close to the land word would rapidly reach the warships in port

 

Anyway - considering we effectively have a double on the teleport here(either side teleports to the combat scenario) and those replace the higher player numbers who would putt more ships into each region this counters itself and would not paly a major role.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sometimes battles are so long that when the battle is over there is rl stuff to do. Without the possibility to logoff in the resultscreen people will get caught in ow and forced to stay in-game.

It will be so easy to harass people, because you know where and when they going to leave the battle.You wouldn't actually need to fight. The guy with more spare time will win, because

the only way to escape this harass chain is surrendering.

We're not talking about a far away gank at Puertobello here - that close to land means a strong reaction force will leave the harbour whether you like it or not! - If you do not have the time for a major operation near the capital of your enemy that area is simply too dangerous and time consuming - plan ahead and plan your engagements with the time you ahve available! - if you only have 60-90mins then i suggest you hunt traders somewhere near our Cuban port where a reaction of us would be far less severe! Failure to calculate your time management and force strength means the reason for defeat lies entirely with you!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I genuinely belive the fault here actually lies with the palyers involved and not with the game mechanics - plan ahead and avoid being trapped after an engagement - if you fail to do so it is your own fault and no magical invisibility should grant you indefinite invisibility/invulnerability (until you leave the screen finally. This screen is not being used to go for a pee. It's being used to play the game without punishment for reckless and plain stupid tactical decisions! You already ahve 5 lives on your ships why are you so afraid to learn from your mistakes you are merely reduced to 4 duras. Should you end up with 0 it means you were incapable of learning even after 5 failures!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Calling a revenge fleet to wait out a battle that's going on is the completely unrealistic thing. Ships had neither telephone (Teamspeak) nor GPS at the time. By the time friendly forces would come upon wreckage and debris, the participants of a battle would be long gone.

There is nothing exploitative about waiting in battle results screen when the battle is over if you know that a huge revenge fleet is waiting outside. If you wanted to improve on the current system a mechanic should be added that participants in a battle would not reenter open world from an instance in the exact spot the instance started, and anyone outside an instance should have no way of predicting exactly where an enemy would reenter open world.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We hunt KPR and Carlisle are regularly.  We often end our night in a battle screen because A. we know we will be ganked upon leaving or B. it is a long boring sail to the nearest friendly port and it is late.  That is a product of the open world size.  Believe me, I would love to port up every night but if a battle goes overlong and we are sure we are being camped there is no way we are going to pop out.

 

Someone put this to bed once and for all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We're not talking about a far away gank at Puertobello here - that close to land means a strong reaction force will leave the harbour whether you like it or not! - If you do not have the time for a major operation near the capital of your enemy that area is simply too dangerous and time consuming - plan ahead and plan your engagements with the time you ahve available! - if you only have 60-90mins then i suggest you hunt traders somewhere near our Cuban port where a reaction of us would be far less severe! Failure to calculate your time management and force strength means the reason for defeat lies entirely with you!

 

First of all:  I dont hunt brits. So dont be so angry about me.

Secondly: You cant plan how long a fight will last when you fight players

Thirdly: Maybe your captial waters arent safe and your nation should start patrolling in groups to make it a safe place? Instead of waiting for them to leave a battle engage them in the first place. Problem solved

 

 

Calling a revenge fleet to wait out a battle that's going on is the completely unrealistic thing. Ships had neither telephone (Teamspeak) nor GPS at the time. By the time friendly forces would come upon wreckage and debris, the participants of a battle would be long gone.

There is nothing exploitative about waiting in battle results screen when the battle is over if you know that a huge revenge fleet is waiting outside. If you wanted to improve on the current system a mechanic should be added that participants in a battle would not reenter open world from an instance in the exact spot the instance started, and anyone outside an instance should have no way of predicting exactly where an enemy would reenter open world.

 

Thats the point.

Edited by z4ys

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First of all:  I dont hunt brits. So dont be so angry about me.

Secondly: You cant plan how long a fight will last when you fight players

Thirdly: Maybe your captial waters arent safe and your nation should start patrolling in groups to make it a safe place? Instead of waiting for them to leave a battle engage them in the first place. Problem solved

 

 

 

Thats the point.

1. Nothing in this post is personal - no personal hate ;)

2.90mins - maybe another 90mins should you be intercepted afterwards - this is a rather sound number i would say

3. There is nothing anybody can do about players tagging ai to hide themselves! in addition patrolling currently wont award more then a bit of travel xp so the first attack is and probably rightfully should be a surprise - you should be fast and leg it out afterwards - far away waters are better for it. No nation in this game would currently be able to patrol their own waters which is clearly visible by the ganking every capital faces. - and you can patrol all day if the fleet is invisible yet right in front of you nothing will be achieved!

4.The abttle I was talking about was in sight of carlisle - a rider would easily alarm the entire island and all of its ports if you actually want to go into such historical accuracy!

Like I said it is your job to be fast not invisible - there were historically several engagements near real life KPR and many of those ended with ships hastily leaving port and the attacker having to abandon chase or ending up dead. Unless you want the reenter instance to mvoe with your ship in abttle youre actually ehre askign to make it even easier to you by teleporting you to another palce - why not jsut give you a free teleport to the next free town with no dura loss? ;) (sarcasm) - i stand by what i said - if you wish to inflict ahrm so close to our capital then have the guts and decency to face the repercussions or show us how good a sailor you are by against the odds escaping us - invisibility may be in the game as a mechanic but it is no measure of skill or honour and so far these fleets seem to lack both!

Edited by JollyRoger1516

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A warship that cannot gaurentee either with its own guns or fleet a safe entry and exit from an area like this has clearly no business near a capital or frequently used port - failure to calculate this is due to a lack of skill and brain on the captains side and will lead to his defeat in battle. There should be no debate about this statement!

Again i think the mechanic would never even get into question if people would adhere to this maxim and not be in need of the invisibility - I aim to change attitudes here not the mechanic!

 

As an example - I stick to this maxim and have for 4 months only lost 2 ships even though you will find me in revenge fleets, patrols, port battles, and on raids into enemy waters. I do not gank as in a 5vs1 scenario - I look for a 1vs1 which I can handle either by ship superiority or by skill. Capitals I only graze with fast ships or with fleet support - no result screen hiding has ever been required and still I have not died much (1xganked a few weeks ago, 1x loss in port battle). You will not find me asking anything of you guys that I wouldn't adhere to myself!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. Nothing in this post is personal - no personal hate ;)

2.90mins - maybe another 90mins should you be intercepted afterwards - this is a rather sound number i would say

3. There is nothing anybody can do about players tagging ai to hide themselves! in addition patrolling currently wont award more then a bit of travel xp so the first attack is and probably rightfully should be a surprise - you should be fast and leg it out afterwards - far away waters are better for it. No nation in this game would currently be able to patrol their own waters which is clearly visible by the ganking every capital faces. - and you can patrol all day if the fleet is invisible yet right in front of you nothing will be achieved!

4.The abttle I was talking about was in sight of carlisle - a rider would easily alarm the entire island and all of its ports if you actually want to go into such historical accuracy!

2. That's 3 hours, plus the time it takes to sail to and from. And unlike every other nation it takes a lot of time to sail to the vicinity of Kingston, because there is no free town close to Jamaica.

3. I know of several clans where one of their collaborative objectives is patrolling around their nations' capitals. It can successfully make ganking in the area more difficult.

4. The equivalent of this is that any captain sighting an enemy ganking fleet in open waters, or being targeted by such a fleet, can call out on Teamspeak or in nation chat. And ships that are already ready to set sail, or sailing within visible range can come to his aid. Spending 20-or indeed 90-minutes gathering a revenge fleet to wait out at the GPS-coordinates has absolutely nothing to do with it. By the time these ships are gathered, the battling ships will have chased each other far away from the spot where the battle were initiated, and usually the battle would be over and the privateers long gone. However due to the instance system revenge fleets are possible, but then again so is waiting in battle result screen.

 

It's nations' fault (including my own) not being organised enough to reach the spot of a battle before the battle closing. Sail together or die alone!

Edited by Anolytic
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well it's funny the brits are whining over an issue they use themselves in enemy waters.

 

Anyway, should the option of hiding in the battle screen be removed, then it should be allowed to sail a certain distance away from the center of the battle in any direction, this while your still the initial battle, so when you finally exit the battle, you won't exit just on top of an antiganking fleet but somewhere else e.g.new location, still relatively close to where you started the battle, but now with a real option of getting away. this would mean that the information you get in nation chat / TS wouldn't be so accurate anymore, and would resemble how things where in the 17th century, when information wasn't received in a second, but sometimes delayed for days or weeks meaning it sometimes was useless.

 

Given the option of leaving a battle at a distance would add a new dimension to the game, and make it a lot more fun for everyone. Since the antiganking fleet (counterfleet) now have to monitor a larger area, instead of the current mechanics, where you can just park SOL all around the crossed swords and then annihilate the ganking fleet when they exit.

 

Actually I would suggest this option to be added no matter the current exploit of staying in battlescreen.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2.10-15mins in addition per way then - after 3 hours that wouldnt amtter anymore and thats max time frame - if you cant afford that time you picked the wrong activity - go for afk trading or single missions which take less time to complete - capitals will take time to attack around - this is not a mistery and failing to take that into account won't be an arguement to make your life amgically easier - it is very simple to avoid such complications and failure to do so leis entirely with those who are affected by it!

3.I know of no such clan actively patrolling in any nation - screening and reacting to threats yes but not actively wasting time running circles around their capital - I suppose if tehre could be a reward system worked out this would be nice to ahve but invisible fleets from yesterday would still render half of that useless/force it into reaction instead of interception.

4. It is true on the open seas this is a rather unnecessarily hazardous endevaour for the gankers but close to land it cannot be expected that no one gives a shit to be frank.

--> it remains however that a fleet of 22 french ships cant claim to not be able to fight their way out of anything - claiming to desire PvP and then avoiding all PvP that inherits any kind of risk is a mere laughing matter at this point and shows the lack of integrety of French captains.

 

I fail to see any of you bringing forward any argument (outside of high seas reinforcements/revenge fleet being weird I will acknowledge that) that would speak in favour of allowing such a mechanic/tactic. All the problems you have named can be avoided easily with a little bit of planning and time management.

It seems to me that you merely desire an easymode with no punishment for yourself. If you'd think beyond claiming only your own advantage in every scenario you'd probably change your behaviour - sadly this seems to not occur and therefore I guess the topic will to some degree become the devs job to fix as players don't seem to have the decency not to misuse the system every chance they get.

 

I can merely ask that you not use this exploit whether you consider it as such or not so we can all have a good time actually playing instead of wasting our mutual time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Given the option of leaving a battle at a distance would add a new dimension to the game, and make it a lot more fun for everyone. Since the antiganking fleet (counterfleet) now have to monitor a larger area, instead of the current mechanics, where you can just park SOL all around the crossed swords and then annihilate the ganking fleet when they exit.

While I wouldn't mind the idea of the battle's exit being where you actually are in battle I'd also like to remind you that for 30secs a tag cannot be initiated and another 20 secs are added to actually start the fight - that gives you 50 secs to spread out or close formation as much as possible.

 

I personally ahve never used this mechanic and those taht I regularly spend my tiem with ingame don't either especially not to such a massive extent. Again we don't object a good fight even in home waters but waiting for a fleet that has no intention of fighting anything (even the 22 vs 25 scenario where a good chance would be had) can only be considered cowardice and a misuse of the system.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...