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Pirate Mechanics suggestions collection thread

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There has been much talk elsewhere on these forums about the state of Pirate mechanics and a desire expressed for somewhere to collect all existing ideas in one place for everyone (including the devs) to see. Given that for many the current state seems to be game-breaking, I have decided to set up this thread to do this.

 

To the developers I ask you to be as active as possible here, especially in giving feedback over what ideas are viable or not and where you feel we may be heading on to the right track.

 

To the players I say that this is NOT a thread for discussion of national politics, vendettas, gloating, insults, toxicity etc. This IS a place for presenting constructive ideas and polite, constructive criticism of those ideas.

 

Keep it positive!

 

I suppose I better kick off with some thoughts of my own...please discuss! 

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My overall vision for the Pirates is that they should provide a completely unique game experience within Naval Action. They should have a special and different attraction that caters to a different kind of player. As such they should have a unique set of both advantages and disadvantages.

 

Here goes!:

 

-Pirates should not be able to conquer other nations ports.

-Pirates should be able to raid other nations, gaining lots of goodies for themselves whilst causing material loss to those nations (enough that it would be a priority to defend a nation's ports).

-Pirates should have a small number of their own, unconquerable ports spread equally throughout the map (not concentrated in one place). These should be hidden from national players (not showing on maps or in-game).

-Pirates should not be able to build bigger ships than frigates.

-Pirates should have unique bonuses to boarding and even their own, dedicated boarding ships to make capturing ships easier for them.

-Pirates should be the only nation able to capture other player's SOLs (not sure about this idea myself) but not able to capture AI SOLs.

-Pirates should not be the only nation you can switch to in-game. It should be possible to switch national allegiances without creating a new character. This should come with heavier penalties in all cases so that all gold, resources and ships are automatically lost (except the ship being sailed on) with no workaround for this. The idea is that you are fleeing from one faction to another with 'only the shirt on your back.'

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There also needs to be a mechanic to let nationals switch to other nations, not just pirates. Let's say they enter Pitts town, the neutral port, and can choose a different nation with a 30day cooldown timer, so nation hopping for Intel isn't possible. They of course lose all outposts in national ports.

But the biggest problem isn't pirates, it's port battle mechanics.

Edited by Anne Wildcat
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There also needs to be a mechanic to let nationals switch to other nations, not just pirates. Let's say they enter Pitts town, the neutral port, and can choose a different nation with a 30day cooldown timer, so nation hopping for Intel isn't possible. They of course lose all outposts in national ports.

But the biggest problem isn't pirates, it's port battle mechanics.

Thanks for your reply!

 

As you saw, I was thinking along similar lines about nation-switching.

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perhaps switching to pirate should cost players half their xp and all their gold to encourage more raiding?

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1. Limited crafting/ Refitting, so like 5th rates or maybe only some 5th rates then the ability to refit them and maybe put bigger guns on some ships or slightly over crew

2.) False flagging and once discovered by 1 player in the area they show they are pirate to others in close proximity

3.) Smuggling

4.) Pardon for all their assets as payment to the nation as reconciliation bar the ship they command

5.) Take command of a PvP captured ship with a cool down maybe like a 48 hours or a week

6.) Raiding Ports for refit materials and repairs and outfits for ships, maybe 2 or 3 day nation lockout while they harvest the resources

7.) Reputation, Bounties and Morale (Visits to wenches, Wins and points towards buying modules, crew, cheap repairs, etc)

8.) No Capture havens for their safety (They operated in Bahamas quite a bit due to the landscape for ambush and the ability to avoid heavy berth ships pursuing)

9.) Pirate Clan vs Pirate clan for control of materials and pirate havens possible unless its going to be to hard for them with the new mechanics then no need.

10.) Captures of the same type of ship type example: Trincomalee captured 2 times creates 1 durability

11.) Rate captures, they can sail them but due to the massive crew requirements they under crew and have morale difficulties and debuffs

12.) 450 max crew they can successfully command, debuffs and issues above that.

13.) Cant start as pirate in character creation, they must start in a nation and get to level 4 before they can defect and they take only their ship, modules equipped and gold to pirate faction. (have a disclaimer about pirate mechanics in startup)

14.) Can sell themselves as guns for hire/ Privateers for better reputation with the nations they are employed by, if doing multiple activities for them they can get discounted pardons, enter their ports etc

15.) The worse their reputation the more the AI try to target them

16.) Having to pay the crew to maintain the morale and reduce mutiny chances, Mutiny as it is would lose your ship and having to go back to a previous ship stored in docks.

17.) TBC

Edited by Ronald Speirs
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For the pirates I had some suggestions in mind:

 

  • Pirates get a bonus to morale and boarding, combined with a penalty to gunnery (reload + acc)
  • 15% over-crewing is allowed for pirates.
  • Pirates can sail under a fake nation flag in OW

          Required for this is that no-one can see a clan tag until the 1 min. visual marker. (2 min. is max view range)

          Pirates can portray another nation in OW, 'masks' disappears when at 1 min. marker.

          Notorious pirates will be spottable via their name alone. For example, Lord vicious sailing an US or dutch flag should make you suspicious.

  • Shipyard restriction to level 2

          (This does not mean that they can't cap/sail SOL's, they just cant craft them)

  • No conquest Pb’s for pirates -> they can raid ports however!

 

          Aimed at the crew hire:

  • When pirates raid a port, they can raid crew stack as well (press ganged)

 

My pirate vision:

Harder lifestyle than other nations, aimed at raiding, pvp, and general disruption. A threat to a player, an annoyance to a nation, but not a threat to a nation.

 

 

Maybe very far-fetched (is yet to be worked out/thought through):

As in, a sort of pirate outpost which you can build x distance from any port, and it will create a village/hide-out.

Example:

TTYrkWM.png

 

This would make them flexible, allow only your friends to know the location, and have fun with it until a nation finds it and decides to contest/destroy it.

One could even go as far and establish themselves somewhere with the permission of a nation, for example near Canalete and operate as dutch-friendly/brit-hostile pirates.

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1. Limited crafting/ Refitting, so like 5th rates or maybe only some 5th rates then the ability to refit them and maybe put bigger guns on some ships or slightly over crew

2.) False flagging and once discovered by 1 player in the area they show they are pirate to others in close proximity

3.) Smuggling

4.) Pardon for all their assets as payment to the nation as reconciliation bar the ship they command

5.) Take command of a PvP captured ship with a cool down maybe like a 48 hours or a week

6.) Raiding Ports for refit materials and repairs and outfits for ships, maybe 2 or 3 day nation lockout while they harvest the resources

7.) Reputation, Bounties and Morale (Visits to wenches, Wins and points towards buying modules, crew, cheap repairs, etc)

8.) No Capture havens for their safety (They operated in Bahamas quite a bit due to the landscape for ambush and the ability to avoid heavy berth ships pursuing)

9.) Pirate Clan vs Pirate clan for control of materials and pirate havens possible unless its going to be to hard for them with the new mechanics then no need.

10.) Captures of the same type of ship type example: Trincomalee captured 2 times creates 1 durability

11.) Rate captures, they can sail them but due to the massive crew requirements they under crew and have morale difficulties and debuffs

12.) 450 max crew they can successfully command, debuffs and issues above that.

13.) Cant start as pirate in character creation, they must start in a nation and get to level 4 before they can defect and they take only their ship, modules equipped and gold to pirate faction. (have a disclaimer about pirate mechanics in startup)

14.) Can sell themselves as guns for hire/ Privateers for better reputation with the nations they are employed by, if doing multiple activities for them they can get discounted pardons, enter their ports etc

15.) The worse their reputation the more the AI try to target them

16.) TBC

 

1) Agreed although I think only up to 5th rates may be too much of a handicap.

2) Like this idea very much.

3) Again I like this alot.

4) Another good idea - or we could work on the lines of a 'letter of marque' system.

5) Think this would defeat the point of being pirates which should be all about capping ships.

6) Don't agree with raiding to repair your ship - makes it too difficult. Perhaps a cooldown on them raiding a particular port would be good - allows the port to rebuild. Penalties for the owning nation in that cooldown too.

7) Love it.

8) Do you mean a no-combat zone around their ports? If so it makes sense.

9) Interesting.

10) Not sure about this - getting too complicated now.

11) I think if we allow them to capture SOLs we cannot penalise them too much. Maybe make it harder but not impossible to get crew.

12) See above.

13) Disagree strongly. Should be able to start as pirate.

14) Totally agree.

15) Great idea.

 

Thanks for contributing - lots of great ideas there I think.

 

For the pirates I had some suggestions in mind:

 

  • Pirates get a bonus to morale and boarding, combined with a penalty to gunnery (reload + acc)
  • 15% over-crewing is allowed for pirates.
  • Pirates can sail under a fake nation flag in OW

          Required for this is that no-one can see a clan tag until the 1 min. visual marker. (2 min. is max view range)

          Pirates can portray another nation in OW, 'masks' disappears when at 1 min. marker.

          Notorious pirates will be spottable via their name alone. For example, Lord vicious sailing an US or dutch flag should make you suspicious.

  • Shipyard restriction to level 2

          (This does not mean that they can't cap/sail SOL's, they just cant craft them)

  • No conquest Pb’s for pirates -> they can raid ports however!

 

          Aimed at the crew hire:

  • When pirates raid a port, they can raid crew stack as well (press ganged)

 

My pirate vision:

Harder lifestyle than other nations, aimed at raiding, pvp, and general disruption. A threat to a player, an annoyance to a nation, but not a threat to a nation.

 

 

Maybe very far-fetched (is yet to be worked out/thought through):

As in, a sort of pirate outpost which you can build x distance from any port, and it will create a village/hide-out.

Example:

TTYrkWM.png

 

This would make them flexible, allow only your friends to know the location, and have fun with it until a nation finds it and decides to contest/destroy it.

One could even go as far and establish themselves somewhere with the permission of a nation, for example near Canalete and operate as dutch-friendly/brit-hostile pirates.

 

Love everything you have suggested - especially the hideout idea!

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^^ Why a cooldown on sailing PVP captured ships?

It was a mechanic from another game, its to slow the rate at which they can capture their way up to bigger ships to quickly.

All famous pirates started in the navies, it what gave them such an advantage as they knew how and where they operated, as for the crew rates and SOL they would of had a hard time to maintain the morale and command of that many men on 1 ship let alone paying them a share of the takings, if you had to pay the crew to maintain morale and by capturing rates and selling them as more of a value to them then sailing them then we are going in the right direction.

Steel i like that idea of building the havens, that sounds like great fun, the only way they could be discovered would be a nation hiring privateers to hunt and investigate, they would need the letter from a nation and they get a rough idea like merchant ships reported lost in the bahamas and they only get a set period of time to hunt and discover it before they need to reinvest to have another go at finding it, you can share the mission with 6 players all searching or something might be another thing to add.

Edited by Ronald Speirs

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There is quite a bit that can/should be done with pirates. However, overall National diplomacy I believe needs to come first in order to address how any nation will interact with any faction, not just pirates. Things like peace and war will indirectly make pirates unique as pirates will/should never be at peace with anyone. This said, there are direct changes that can be made to pirates, however I believe what first needs to happen is that we need to discern and separate pirate goals from national goals, which will allow pirates to operate independent from all the "drama" of conquest. Very early on, I outlined the possible concept of overall pirate mindset here: An Approach to Piracy

 

Here are also a few of my other pirate related suggestions.

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<p>

There is quite a bit that can/should be done with pirates. However, overall National diplomacy I believe needs to come first in order to address how any nation will interact with any faction, not just pirates. Things like peace and war will indirectly make pirates unique as pirates will/should never be at peace with anyone. This said, there are direct changes that can be made to pirates, however I believe what first needs to happen is that we need to discern and separate pirate goals from national goals, which will allow pirates to operate independent from all the "drama" of conquest. Very early on, I outlined the possible concept of overall pirate mindset here: An Approach to Piracy

Here are also a few of my other pirate related suggestions.

Like it all except not sure about the pirates entering into national conflicts. Could mean that they are still effectively capturing ports or unbalancing nations/causing the map to go all one colour...

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In short a rep system, each player maintains with each individual nation.

 

No pirate "faction".   Instead pirate players. And privateer players.  And freetraders. And smugglers.  And Naval Officers

Not a career just a title you earn that comes with some minor benefits.  Can be tied to Diplomacy changes once allies and war make an appearance by increasing or decreasing rep gains in relation to allied and at war nations.

 

3 rep bars each player maintains with each faction.  Rep starts at zero and moves up or down depending on actions

 

Some very rough examples from the perspective of a US player. US is allied with France and at War with Espana:

 

Plunder: (Privateer or pirate)

  • You attack a US NPC/Player Trader (-10 US, -5 France, +5 Espana)
  • You attack a Brit NPC/Player Trader (-10 UK, + 10 US, +5 France, -5 Espana)

Career: (Freeman or Naval Officer)

  • You attack a Brit NPC/Player Warship (+ 10 US, -10 UK, + 5 France, - 5 Espana)

Trade: (Freetrader or Smuggler)

  • Sell or buy goods from another Nation (+ 10 with that nation)
  • Sell or buy goods to Ally nation (+15 with ally)
  • Sell or buy goods from a Nation you are at war with (+ 15 from that nation, - 10 from Allied nations)

 

 

Benefits from your choices:

 

Privateer:

  • 5% increased plunder from Trader ships of Enemy Nations
  • Can join Allied nation open world fights

Pirate:

  • 5% Increased plunder from Trader ships of any Nation considering you pirate
  • Can join any Open world fight involving a Nation that considers you a pirate against that nation

Naval Officer: 

  • 5% increased plunder from Port Battles and enemy nation warships
  • Can join allied nation open world fights
  • Can join Allied Nation Port Battles

Freeman:

  • 5% increased plunder from warships
  • Can Join any open world fight

Freetrader:

  • No tax on trade transactions in foreign nation ports
  • Can dock in any neutral or allied nations ports when in trading vessel
  • Labeled as Freetrader on OS when selected in trading ship
  • Cannot be attacked by allied nations in a Traders vessel

Smuggler:

  • No tax on trade transactions in Waring nation ports
  • Can enter any Enemy Nation ports when in a trading vessel
  • Labeled as a Smuggler on OS when selected in traders ship, by own Nation and Nation considering you a smuggler, Freetrader to all other nations
  • Can be attacked by own nation and nation allies when in trade ship with no penalty
  • Cannot be attacked by Nations considering you a smuggler when in trade ship.

 

 

Could be drastically expanded.  But the idea is simple.   No pirate faction.   Instead pirate professions.

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I would much prefer nation on nation action primarily and have pirates be mainly raiders...able to take shallow water ports and raid commerce but not sail warships and SOLS.  Much more historical and realistic...

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1. Limited crafting/ Refitting, so like 5th rates or maybe only some 5th rates then the ability to refit them and maybe put bigger guns on some ships or slightly over crew

2.) False flagging and once discovered by 1 player in the area they show they are pirate to others in close proximity

3.) Smuggling

4.) Pardon for all their assets as payment to the nation as reconciliation bar the ship they command

5.) Take command of a PvP captured ship with a cool down maybe like a 48 hours or a week

6.) Raiding Ports for refit materials and repairs and outfits for ships, maybe 2 or 3 day nation lockout while they harvest the resources

7.) Reputation, Bounties and Morale (Visits to wenches, Wins and points towards buying modules, crew, cheap repairs, etc)

8.) No Capture havens for their safety (They operated in Bahamas quite a bit due to the landscape for ambush and the ability to avoid heavy berth ships pursuing)

9.) Pirate Clan vs Pirate clan for control of materials and pirate havens possible unless its going to be to hard for them with the new mechanics then no need.

10.) Captures of the same type of ship type example: Trincomalee captured 2 times creates 1 durability

11.) Rate captures, they can sail them but due to the massive crew requirements they under crew and have morale difficulties and debuffs

12.) 450 max crew they can successfully command, debuffs and issues above that.

13.) Cant start as pirate in character creation, they must start in a nation and get to level 4 before they can defect and they take only their ship, modules equipped and gold to pirate faction. (have a disclaimer about pirate mechanics in startup)

14.) Can sell themselves as guns for hire/ Privateers for better reputation with the nations they are employed by, if doing multiple activities for them they can get discounted pardons, enter their ports etc

15.) The worse their reputation the more the AI try to target them

16.) Having to pay the crew to maintain the morale and reduce mutiny chances, Mutiny as it is would lose your ship and having to go back to a previous ship stored in docks.

17.) TBC

Well said sir!!!

Great ideas!!

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I agree with the idea that pirates should raid not capture, however just placing permanent 'freetowns' for them to operate from around the map would just make them pvp zones - unfriendly nations would simply camp the towns waiting for pirates. Pirate havens sounds good on paper, but if they are temporary or able to be captured or destroyed, how will they handle players that are offline at the time? What about those that may only play for a few hours at the weekend? Having to constantly flee your hovel every time you login because during the week <insert nation here> found your hideout from spies and raised it to the ground, will annoy and turn away casual gamers.

 

I'm all for a better pirate mechanic, even for reduced ship access, but lets not castrate what will be a popular 'faction' or playstyle simply because they hold a lot of power currently.

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For the pirates I had some suggestions in mind:

 

  • Pirates get a bonus to morale and boarding, combined with a penalty to gunnery (reload + acc)
  • 15% over-crewing is allowed for pirates.
  • Pirates can sail under a fake nation flag in OW

          Required for this is that no-one can see a clan tag until the 1 min. visual marker. (2 min. is max view range)

          Pirates can portray another nation in OW, 'masks' disappears when at 1 min. marker.

          Notorious pirates will be spottable via their name alone. For example, Lord vicious sailing an US or dutch flag should make you suspicious.

  • Shipyard restriction to level 2

          (This does not mean that they can't cap/sail SOL's, they just cant craft them)

  • No conquest Pb’s for pirates -> they can raid ports however!

 

          Aimed at the crew hire:

  • When pirates raid a port, they can raid crew stack as well (press ganged)

 

My pirate vision:

Harder lifestyle than other nations, aimed at raiding, pvp, and general disruption. A threat to a player, an annoyance to a nation, but not a threat to a nation.

 

 

Maybe very far-fetched (is yet to be worked out/thought through):

As in, a sort of pirate outpost which you can build x distance from any port, and it will create a village/hide-out.

Example:

TTYrkWM.png

 

This would make them flexible, allow only your friends to know the location, and have fun with it until a nation finds it and decides to contest/destroy it.

One could even go as far and establish themselves somewhere with the permission of a nation, for example near Canalete and operate as dutch-friendly/brit-hostile pirates.

 

In terms of the Hideout area idea i think if we give the pirates x amount of ports around the map - say 5 ports would be a decent amount, then allow (only clans) to set up one Hideout anywhere in the map (think of it like the clan warehouse as such). This can be placed/established in any inlet deep or shallow on a coast line however must be x distance from a port.

 

Hideouts also act like a free town port, where players of that clan can set up outposts/warehouses/shipyards for ship building.

Possibly allow them also to create resources of the two closest ports to the hideout. Say take for example from the map you linked if the hideout was located between Truxillo and Morro Chico then the hideout can produce Hemp, Iron, Coal, Compass wood, etc. Basically produce the same as both ports combined.

Does however not need to construct produce buildings as the pirates would techically be basically raiding the ai/player buildings in the two ports close by., 5% chance that hideouts are automatically detected as nations ai officials investigate raids on farms in the area.

 

However if placed on a isolated island that is surrounded by water, hideout will not be able to produce resources as to do so the Port must be connected via land to the area of the hideout.

 

Nations can search and destroy these in which there is say 1% chance that they can gain a dura from one players ship that is stored in that hideout. 15% chance that players ships will gain a random x amount of damage.  30% chance that x% amount of total stored resources are lost(player warehouses and Clan warehouse amount combined).

 

Other Pirate clans can destroy or Capture the hideout if they don't have there own built elsewhere. If destroyed it would be the same as above, if captured the ship capture chance would be about 10% chance that 1 ship dura is lost, 30% chance that damage occurs, and say 80% chance that resources are lost.

 

If a Hideout is captured/destroyed the clan can resettle elsewhere for a small/medium gold fee (i say small/medium but lets say 50 - 100k for example),

Everything that was in the last hideout is available, outposts/warehouses are automatically there as they were built in the hideout. 

 

Hideouts automatically show on the map for members of the clan. Exp can be gained (more than exploration but less than combat for discovering hideouts, a decent size xp for destroying one).

Hideouts automatically show on the map for members of a nation(or clan if another pirate finds a hideout belonging to another clan).

Hideouts act like ports in terms of when they can be attacked (Port timer). Defense of a hideout (not sure maybe use the same mechanic as ports, maybe something new?).

 

To detect hideouts you must say have a upgrade/module fitted for nations or happen to sail right on top of it.   get a mission from the town near by. (Unique mission from towns that are suffering land raids (pirates gaining resources at hideouts). For other pirates, simply sailing by the coast line will have say x% chance of detecting the hideout.

 

may expand on this when i thought a bit more about it, as well as a few other things from the other ideas placed here already.

 

edited: as i read a post above me i had a thought about once a hideout is detected.

So as i said that Hideouts act like ports in which they have a port timer, to give them a bit of a fair chance/a advantage, once a hideout is detected they have 24 hours before a flag(lets say a Destroy flag basically like a port battle flag except for the name and possibly cost (maybe depends on how much raiding in the area was done?)) can be brought.

If after 4 days(includes 24 hour wait period, so 3 days since a flag can be brought) a flag has not been purchased to destroy the hideout. A AI fleet will spawn 1 hour after the port timer opens.

This fleet will have the best quality ships for the type of hideout. eg. If the hideout is in deep water then the best ships will be 1st/2nd rates. If it is in shallows then it will be Rattlesnakes/Mercs? (sorry not sure on the best ships for shallow water battles these days).

The Fleet will be of 25 ships so a full port battle will occur.

 

Once a hideout is also detected the clan who owns it has the ability to pick up and relocate for a small gold fee (say 25-50k) and a small % of lost resources from all warehouses in the hideout.

 

Jags

Edited by Jager
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Thought 1 - Reputation Based

 

Each faction would have reputation standings. By doing missions (aka questing), attacking certain ships/players, completing world events, smuggling, bribing ports or selling/trading unique resources, or perhaps by fulfilling port resource demands a player's reputation standings can vary.

 

Each of the factions has a standing or "opinion" of that player based on how that player treats that nation. 

 

Good/Positive Standings could reward players in specific ways. Some ideas may include:

  • NPC ships won't attack you (Bad standings may mean "kill on sight"
  • Unique access to faction specific modules, loot, consumables, ship blueprints
  • Trade bonus when trading to a port of that nation
  • Unique missions near that nation's territory?
  • Open dock access to ports that lord protectors enable access to foreign nations based on reputation standings and/or by nation (Could be a purchased upgrade in the port, 24 hours to take effect?)
  • Reduced costs to repair at a foreign port (Again going off the host nation's choice to enable or disable this ability)
  • An ability to "rent" an outpost in a foreign port for a limited number of days (Rent for 7 days, etc.. resets if port is captured.)
  • Reduced taxes when buying/selling in a foreign port

Players of a minimum level of positive standings could be eligible to be "Privateers". Players wishing to play as a Privateer on behalf of another nation could buy a commission from a neutral port which enables them to fight and act on behalf of another nation. A Privateer commission will be a cool-down so that a player can't stay in that mode indefinitely. While commissioned as a privateer the player will be identified as "British Privateer" or "French Privateer" or whatever above their name in battle as well as when you click on them. Below that their original faction will be shown. While privateering that player cannot attack any ship of the nation he is working for. By privateer players will more quickly raise (or lower) their reputation with the different nations.

 

 

Bad/Negative Standings could also effect players. Some ideas may include:

 

  • Percent chance that NPC ships will attempt to attack players in bad or hostile standings (The worse the standings the higher the chance the NPC'S will attack)
  • Cannot obtain faction-specific modules, consumables, blueprints from good standings, but instead other, unique and different items from bad standings.
  • Gold & Exp bonus for completing a mission or PVP in the hated area of influence (Similar to the reinforcement zones but larger) It's more dangerous for them to be there.
  • Can not dock in ports with bad standings unless only under contraband status.
  • Can not rent an outpost in ports of poor standings
  • Increased quantity of contraband could be smuggled out of ports with bad standings (npc makes up the difference?)
  • Can only repair trader ships in ports of bad standings
  • No tax privileges

Thought 2 - Toggle with cooldown

 

Another idea is to make it an option for a player to enable or disable the ability to be a pirate much like a player can flag themselves as a smuggler or not. The major catch being it can only be enabled in a neutral port and whilst in that mode the player can not dock or teleport to any port of any nation except other neutral ports. Another idea could be that once a player turns on Pirate mode or puts on the Pirate Flag he/she cannot take it off for a predetermined time such as maybe 30mins or an hour to prevent exploiting.

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As i have quoted multiple peoples suggestions for my replies i am going to put each quote and my answer/question about it below.

 

Captain Underpants

 

My overall vision for the Pirates is that they should provide a completely unique game experience within Naval Action. They should have a special and different attraction that caters to a different kind of player. As such they should have a unique set of both advantages and disadvantages.

 

Here goes!:

 

1 Pirates should not be able to conquer other nations ports.

2 Pirates should be able to raid other nations, gaining lots of goodies for themselves whilst causing material loss to those nations (enough that it would be a priority to defend a nation's ports).

3 Pirates should have a small number of their own, unconquerable ports spread equally throughout the map (not concentrated in one place). These should be hidden from national players (not showing on maps or in-game).

4 Pirates should not be able to build bigger ships than frigates.

5 Pirates should have unique bonuses to boarding and even their own, dedicated boarding ships to make capturing ships easier for them.

6 Pirates should be the only nation able to capture other player's SOLs (not sure about this idea myself) but not able to capture AI SOLs.

7 Pirates should not be the only nation you can switch to in-game. It should be possible to switch national allegiances without creating a new character. This should come with heavier penalties in all cases so that all gold, resources and ships are automatically lost (except the ship being sailed on) with no workaround for this. The idea is that you are fleeing from one faction to another with 'only the shirt on your back.'

 

I agree with most of these except 4 and 6. (Numbered you points so you know which ones i mean)

 

4. I say give them to Rate 4 ships so that they can still have Connie's, trincs and ingermans as these will allow pirates to be a bit more competitive against nations.

6 Not sure if i agree or not on this as nations used to sometimes capture other nations SOL's during battles. While i don't want as a gamer to see anyone disadvantaged to much in this game, in real life how many pirates captured or even engaged a SOL? To simply not allow nations to capture other nations SOL's seems to be a bit pointless.

 

 

Ronald Speirs

 

 

1. Limited crafting/ Refitting, so like 5th rates or maybe only some 5th rates then the ability to refit them and maybe put bigger guns on some ships or slightly over crew
2.) False flagging and once discovered by 1 player in the area they show they are pirate to others in close proximity
3.) Smuggling
4.) Pardon for all their assets as payment to the nation as reconciliation bar the ship they command
5.) Take command of a PvP captured ship with a cool down maybe like a 48 hours or a week
6.) Raiding Ports for refit materials and repairs and outfits for ships, maybe 2 or 3 day nation lockout while they harvest the resources
7.) Reputation, Bounties and Morale (Visits to wenches, Wins and points towards buying modules, crew, cheap repairs, etc)
8.) No Capture havens for their safety (They operated in Bahamas quite a bit due to the landscape for ambush and the ability to avoid heavy berth ships pursuing)
9.) Pirate Clan vs Pirate clan for control of materials and pirate havens possible unless its going to be to hard for them with the new mechanics then no need.
10.) Captures of the same type of ship type example: Trincomalee captured 2 times creates 1 durability
11.) Rate captures, they can sail them but due to the massive crew requirements they under crew and have morale difficulties and debuffs
12.) 450 max crew they can successfully command, debuffs and issues above that.
13.) Cant start as pirate in character creation, they must start in a nation and get to level 4 before they can defect and they take only their ship, modules equipped and gold to pirate faction. (have a disclaimer about pirate mechanics in startup)
14.) Can sell themselves as guns for hire/ Privateers for better reputation with the nations they are employed by, if doing multiple activities for them they can get discounted pardons, enter their ports etc
15.) The worse their reputation the more the AI try to target them
16.) Having to pay the crew to maintain the morale and reduce mutiny chances, Mutiny as it is would lose your ship and having to go back to a previous ship stored in docks.
17.) TBC

 

1 i think limiting crafting ships to a certain rate is fine, but limiting fitting them out would not be fair.

2. like this idea

3. How would this be different to the current smuggling that we have now?

4. I like this idea but i think it could be done for all nations the same way as this, with a cooldown of x amount of days. Also if you went from pirate to a nation you couldn't go back to being a pirate for x amount of days would also work.

5. I did read your other reply on this and i am still on the fence of weather to agree or not, i would agree with the cooldown for possibly captured SOL's, but not for ships of the rates that they can build and sail.

6. I like this idea except for the refit part.

7. Think this would be great

8. Could you possibly expand more on this? Do you mean no ports or that they can't create a hideout of sorts? Or is it something totally different you mean?

9.Love the idea, and sorta had that in my post expanding on the pirate hideout suggestion that steel made.

10. Not sure about this, do you mean that if they say are using/have that ship and then they capture 2 ships of that ship they gain a extra dura for there ship or is it a completely different thing you mean?

11. Not sure if i like this or not as again limiting pirates may become to unfair for them.

12. see above.

13 I agree with this tbh, as someone did say, pirates captains all came from a nations navy originally in which they were usually previously a LT or Captain, those that were happened to be born into piracy and became pirates usually didn't become a captain straight away but worked long and hard, earned respect amongst the crew, learned how to sail, fight and lead under a captain and either challenged their mentor, broke away to start a new crew or took over when their mentor died in battle or from sickness. So by not allowing players to start as pirates seem fair, only thing is to implement this may require a xp wipe which wouldn't go down well.

14 and 15 i both agree and like.

16. Might be a bit hard to implement and might be a bit unfair if its only limited to pirates having to pay for crew. If it was all nations captains who had to pay for crew i could understand but if it was limited to pirates only it would be quite unfair.

 

 

SteelSandwich

 

For the pirates I had some suggestions in mind:

 

  • Pirates get a bonus to morale and boarding, combined with a penalty to gunnery (reload + acc)
  • 15% over-crewing is allowed for pirates.
  • Pirates can sail under a fake nation flag in OW

          Required for this is that no-one can see a clan tag until the 1 min. visual marker. (2 min. is max view range)

          Pirates can portray another nation in OW, 'masks' disappears when at 1 min. marker.

          Notorious pirates will be spottable via their name alone. For example, Lord vicious sailing an US or dutch flag should make you suspicious.

  • Shipyard restriction to level 2

          (This does not mean that they can't cap/sail SOL's, they just cant craft them)

  • No conquest Pb’s for pirates -> they can raid ports however!

 

          Aimed at the crew hire:

  • When pirates raid a port, they can raid crew stack as well (press ganged)

 

My pirate vision:

Harder lifestyle than other nations, aimed at raiding, pvp, and general disruption. A threat to a player, an annoyance to a nation, but not a threat to a nation.

 

 

Maybe very far-fetched (is yet to be worked out/thought through):

As in, a sort of pirate outpost which you can build x distance from any port, and it will create a village/hide-out.

Example:

TTYrkWM.png

 

This would make them flexible, allow only your friends to know the location, and have fun with it until a nation finds it and decides to contest/destroy it.

One could even go as far and establish themselves somewhere with the permission of a nation, for example near Canalete and operate as dutch-friendly/brit-hostile pirates.

 

I like all of your suggestions/ideas only one that i am a bit wary of is about crew hire, if the game started limiting things like crew expenses etc to pirates only in which they had a limited amount of crew, have to pay for it etc etc where nations had all this for free and a unlimited supply, i would see many people finding this quite unfair.

 

I also expanded as you prob can see from my other post on your hideout idea :)

 

 

William the Drake

 

 

There is quite a bit that can/should be done with pirates. However, overall National diplomacy I believe needs to come first in order to address how any nation will interact with any faction, not just pirates. Things like peace and war will indirectly make pirates unique as pirates will/should never be at peace with anyone. This said, there are direct changes that can be made to pirates, however I believe what first needs to happen is that we need to discern and separate pirate goals from national goals, which will allow pirates to operate independent from all the "drama" of conquest. Very early on, I outlined the possible concept of overall pirate mindset here: An Approach to Piracy

 

Here are also a few of my other pirate related suggestions.

 

 

As said in one of the other spoilers i do like the idea of pirates having to start as a nation, also love the idea of notoriety, infamy etc. As mentioned also i like the idea of having the ability to create havens as such for pirates, raiding etc. Not sure if i like 3 sided conflicts but then again pirates/anyone for that matter can do that anyway except they are limited currently to choosing a side.  I like but also dislike aspects of the captured ships part, the capturing of ships i do think should not be limited to pirates only but rather maybe if they put in your idea of this theres a x% chance that because they are pirate the ship quality is reduced, and for nations it is y% chance. (Y% is lower than x% or Y's% is higher than X%).

 

Like the idea of Marques and about being able to return to the nation, again as stated in another spoiler i think having a decent size cooldown on the ability to switch to any nation would be the best way to handle this, but for pirates switching to a nation they have to use marques first before being offered the chance to join a nation.

 

Babble

 

 

In short a rep system, each player maintains with each individual nation.

 

No pirate "faction".   Instead pirate players. And privateer players.  And freetraders. And smugglers.  And Naval Officers

Not a career just a title you earn that comes with some minor benefits.  Can be tied to Diplomacy changes once allies and war make an appearance by increasing or decreasing rep gains in relation to allied and at war nations.

 

3 rep bars each player maintains with each faction.  Rep starts at zero and moves up or down depending on actions

 

 

Some very rough examples from the perspective of a US player. US is allied with France and at War with Espana:

 

Plunder: (Privateer or pirate)

  • You attack a US NPC/Player Trader (-10 US, -5 France, +5 Espana)
  • You attack a Brit NPC/Player Trader (-10 UK, + 10 US, +5 France, -5 Espana)

Career: (Freeman or Naval Officer)

  • You attack a Brit NPC/Player Warship (+ 10 US, -10 UK, + 5 France, - 5 Espana)

Trade: (Freetrader or Smuggler)

  • Sell or buy goods from another Nation (+ 10 with that nation)
  • Sell or buy goods to Ally nation (+15 with ally)
  • Sell or buy goods from a Nation you are at war with (+ 15 from that nation, - 10 from Allied nations)

 

 

Benefits from your choices:

 

Privateer:

  • 5% increased plunder from Trader ships of Enemy Nations
  • Can join Allied nation open world fights

Pirate:

  • 5% Increased plunder from Trader ships of any Nation considering you pirate
  • Can join any Open world fight involving a Nation that considers you a pirate against that nation

Naval Officer: 

  • 5% increased plunder from Port Battles and enemy nation warships
  • Can join allied nation open world fights
  • Can join Allied Nation Port Battles

Freeman:

  • 5% increased plunder from warships
  • Can Join any open world fight

Freetrader:

  • No tax on trade transactions in foreign nation ports
  • Can dock in any neutral or allied nations ports when in trading vessel
  • Labeled as Freetrader on OS when selected in trading ship
  • Cannot be attacked by allied nations in a Traders vessel

Smuggler:

  • No tax on trade transactions in Waring nation ports
  • Can enter any Enemy Nation ports when in a trading vessel
  • Labeled as a Smuggler on OS when selected in traders ship, by own Nation and Nation considering you a smuggler, Freetrader to all other nations
  • Can be attacked by own nation and nation allies when in trade ship with no penalty
  • Cannot be attacked by Nations considering you a smuggler when in trade ship.

 

 

Could be drastically expanded.  But the idea is simple.   No pirate faction.   Instead pirate professions.

 

I think while the idea seems simple it would be quite a dramatic change to the game that would take quite a bit of work to implement. Overall though i do like the idea but i do see the devs thinking this may be to hard to implement into the game whereas changing the pirate faction a bit would take work but be easier and not affect the overall game as much.

 

 

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I agree with the idea that pirates should raid not capture, however just placing permanent 'freetowns' for them to operate from around the map would just make them pvp zones - unfriendly nations would simply camp the towns waiting for pirates. Pirate havens sounds good on paper, but if they are temporary or able to be captured or destroyed, how will they handle players that are offline at the time? What about those that may only play for a few hours at the weekend? Having to constantly flee your hovel every time you login because during the week <insert nation here> found your hideout from spies and raised it to the ground, will annoy and turn away casual gamers.

I'm all for a better pirate mechanic, even for reduced ship access, but lets not castrate what will be a popular 'faction' or playstyle simply because they hold a lot of power currently.

What would be your alternative ideas?

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Jager,

With regard to point 4 on my initial post; I actually meant to allow them to build 4th rates! I was simply meaning that pirates should not be able to build SOLs. So we agree on this.

Regarding point 6 (which I was unsure about myself), I think you are right and it was a bad idea (one I had only just thought of that moment!).

Overall I think there are some great ideas coming here which I hope the Devs are seeing.

I am especially loving the hideouts ideas and the player reputation ideas which I think would both be awesome and so much fun!

Edited by Captain Underpants

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I had my idea posted elsewhere on this forum:

 

Instead of the XP used to rank pirates need to use gold (currency) to level up, so they would need to transfer in game currency to their "Treasure", this gold is forever locked in there and counts towards your rank. So you could click your money say transfer X to treasure, it deducts from your currency and you add the gold to your treasure, which counts towards your rank. So essentialy the more money you have the more people will want to sail with you, the more reputation you get.

 

The port capping will be left only to nations, and the pirates can use freetowns to run as their HQ. This will essentialy make pirates concentrate on what they concentrated on historicaly, getting rich.

Like nations have a constant goal (capping as many ports as possible) pirates should have an equal goal amongst them in the forms of whoever has the most money. Like a ranking system, some sort of way of showing of how good they are. So there is a constant drive to get more money and become wealthier.

 

So the goals between nations and pirates are different, but they use the same OW to succeed in their efforts, so they will be influencing eachothers progress, they will not be influencing eachother up to the point the pirates will decide the outcome of a nations succes.

 

When it comes to ships, in this situation its probably preferable they don't sail SoL above 3rd rates. The pirates would need to have some additional content, or some other features, like being able to raid ports, so its sufficiëntly attractive for pirates to play. I don't like taking away pirate features and giving nothing in return. Give them some pirate only ships like the pirate frig.

 

The pirates could be very opportunistic, with the no cooldown TP between outposts, they can be fighting across the map wherever the biggest catches can be done. Give them the opportunity to be more sneaky, do more ambushes, give the pirates the optiont to demand a ransome to let the oponent go in return. More of these piraty things.

 

This suggestions is probably full of loopholes and possible exploits, but I think the core of it would benefit both the real pirate players and the nations. As it doesn't nerf them up to the point there is no fun in playing pirates.

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I had my idea posted elsewhere on this forum:

Instead of the XP used to rank pirates need to use gold (currency) to level up, so they would need to transfer in game currency to their "Treasure", this gold is forever locked in there and counts towards your rank. So you could click your money say transfer X to treasure, it deducts from your currency and you add the gold to your treasure, which counts towards your rank. So essentialy the more money you have the more people will want to sail with you, the more reputation you get.

The port capping will be left only to nations, and the pirates can use freetowns to run as their HQ. This will essentialy make pirates concentrate on what they concentrated on historicaly, getting rich.

Like nations have a constant goal (capping as many ports as possible) pirates should have an equal goal amongst them in the forms of whoever has the most money. Like a ranking system, some sort of way of showing of how good they are. So there is a constant drive to get more money and become wealthier.

So the goals between nations and pirates are different, but they use the same OW to succeed in their efforts, so they will be influencing eachothers progress, they will not be influencing eachother up to the point the pirates will decide the outcome of a nations succes.

When it comes to ships, in this situation its probably preferable they don't sail SoL above 3rd rates. The pirates would need to have some additional content, or some other features, like being able to raid ports, so its sufficiëntly attractive for pirates to play. I don't like taking away pirate features and giving nothing in return. Give them some pirate only ships like the pirate frig.

The pirates could be very opportunistic, with the no cooldown TP between outposts, they can be fighting across the map wherever the biggest catches can be done. Give them the opportunity to be more sneaky, do more ambushes, give the pirates the optiont to demand a ransome to let the oponent go in return. More of these piraty things.

This suggestions is probably full of loopholes and possible exploits, but I think the core of it would benefit both the real pirate players and the nations. As it doesn't nerf them up to the point there is no fun in playing pirates.

Your ideas about pirates ranking through gold are interesting - as long as it was balanced well.

Like your thoughts about pirates being ranked (maybe pirate clans too?) with gold (or similar?) to give that competitive edge.

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