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"Such is a lord" - Simple politics and alliances part 1 - HEAVILY MODERATED

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  • Lord protector is a person who earned most victory points in the port battle (port assault flag will be abandoned)

 

Are the mechanics worked out for this? Is it simply "he who does the most damage" in the port battle?

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That answers my questions, thank you.

 

To rephrase you just need to select yes on several important questions and change them once a week. Once votes reach certain % threshhold decisions are signed automatically. It = proposing a vote. You can ignore things you dont want to cast vote on.

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Just few words, this is awesome guys. I am glad you are looking into a much larger picture and approaching it from a different perspective. Do I feel like provisions, crew management and forts will be somehow chained to all this? All together it will make a one hell of a game. Bravo.  

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Why is that contribution only measured in attendance of port battles? Why is there no other means of contributing to national wars? I personally consider myself a frigate captain and sail in screening fleets rather than port battle fleets - a port-battle-only merit system will mean that my useful service will not translate in to having a say in political matters... And don't forget that only 25 people can ever be in a port battle, while many more than those 25 people are involved in the national war effort. IF the same 25 people (such as the dedicated [RUS] clan in Denmark on PvP1, for example) always fight in port battles, does that mean they automatically have more power over the entire Danish nation by doing so? And other clans need to wage even more war just to try to compete?

 

 

This is our last last warning. Captains 

 

Lord nelson was a 1st Duke of Bronte

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronte,_Sicily

 

He got this for military achievements.

We said in the first post that

  • If you don’t own land you can exhibit heroic feats – then you can become a lord and get land by lets say winning a lot in PVP

As this is a very important topic captains who cannot read properly will be removed from forums in a friendly manner for 7 days (by withdrawing positng), because their feedback becomes useless if they cant understand what is being discussed.  This topic is very important and we don't want people who cant read giving us feedback. We apologize in advance but we want to only focus on things that are relevant in this discussion

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I really like where you're going with this.

I think it should create battle fronts helping solve the "where is the pvp problems". I think it will bring up national unity as well.

My general suggestions...

Tie the votes to clans that own land. This way if one person goes on extended holiday or disappears he can name a guild mate to take over the duties.

The clans votes should further be weighted by member numbers that gave participated in land acquisitions. This would encourage clans to acquire new players and bring them into port battles.

If you make to much emphasis on the actual Lord Protector players will start fighting over who gets to pull flags. A good compromise would be to have the credit goto the clan of the flag puller. Still competition but maybe not as much. It'll also promote clan loyalty over some cross teaming alt with a lot of money gaining a lot of say in an enemy nations politics by just constantly pulling flags.

May want to think of ways to bring the economy game into this. Maybe have rebellions, which you will need to have a mechanic for, be promoted by the rebel faction supplying free goods to the colonists.

Edited by Bach
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Don't let us join each other's port battles. Alt trolling will be rampant. 

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This looks like a good simple system but may I ask what do PVE get? it would be nice for us to have something similar too that allows us to have more cross nation support especially as we are a slightly smaller server.

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Sounds good, but I suggest changing the titles in the Netherlands to:

Number of estates owned determines your court rank. Your court rank might give you additional points.

  • Person with most estates will become (a ruler) [Raadpensionaris/Grand Pensionary]
  • Top 50 (or maybe more) estate owners become (parliament) [members of the Staten Generaal]
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Short inspirational guide on the differences between lords

The baron wears a cap with 6 pearls. The Viscount wears a coronet of which the pearls are without number. The Earl the coronet with the pears upon points mingled with strawberry leaves. The Marquis one with pearls and leaves. The Duke, one with strawberry leaves – no pearls. The Royal Duke, a circlet of crosses and fleurs de lys. The Prince, crown like that of the King but unclosed.

 

The Duke is his Grace; the other Peers their Lordshps. Most honorable is higher than right honorable. Lords who are peers are lords in their own right. Lords who are not peers are lords by courtesy. There are no real lords excepting such as are peers.

 

This might be mostly a matter of semantics, but the United States Constitution, Article 1, Section 9 strictly forbids the granting of titles of nobility. I like akd's suggestion of modifying the titles slightly for at least the US faction of the game to somewhat of a less noble-sounding variety, albeit with exactly the same functionality. The same could be done for other nations into more faction-appropriate titles, but again, this is merely a minor quibble.

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Read what devs posted few more times please. Everything is there.

 

Not quite sure what you're saying, I just went through the OP and the replies and unless I missed something, there's nothing about Port Battles besides the statement that allies will be able to join each other's port battles.

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This is our last last warning. Captains 

 

Lord nelson was a 1st Duke of Bronte

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronte,_Sicily

 

He got this for military achievements.

We said in the first post that

  • If you don’t own land you can exhibit heroic feats – then you can become a lord and get land by lets say winning a lot in PVP
As this is a very important topic captains who cannot read properly will be removed from forums in a friendly manner for 7 days (by withdrawing positng), because their feedback becomes useless if they cant understand what is being discussed.  This topic is very important and we don't want people who cant read giving us feedback. We apologize in advance but we want to only focus on things that are relevant in this discussion

I don't have a lot to add as far as discussion goes- I quite like what you all have presented, especially the multiple avenues for "having a say," as it were. My big question though is this- do you all have a timeline for implementation? I suspect that actually seeing it laid out would go a long way to finding any consequences and side-effects of this implementation. Just food for thought.

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I think people are getting so caught up in the port battle component of lordship that they are losing sight of the other methods you reference, eg heroic feats.

 

Could you perhaps give some examples of what you are thinking there?   How will PvP victories contribute?  How will being a level 50 crafter contribute?  How will supplying your nation with mods gain status points?

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I like where this is going, and like with everything else, it can be build upon. 

In the next few days many good questions will be asked. 

 

I myself have just one simple question, the title says "part 1".

Does this mean we will see more information about this political system in the near future?

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  • Person with most estates will become a ruler
  • Top 50 (or maybe more) estate owners become parliament
  • They get a separate parliament chat for private political discussions

 

 May I suggest that the parliament elects a ruler for a set amount of days? Rather than it being based off of only estates.

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Any honest opinion, feel free to remove it if you don't like it.

This is a thoroughly complex solution that has been solved by much simpler alternatives. It is a good start, but needs streamlining. Keep it up!  :)

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 May I suggest that the parliament elects a ruler for a set amount of days? Rather than it being based off of only estates.

 

Like one amongst themselves ?

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If you make to much emphasis on the actual Lord Protector players will start fighting over who gets to pull flags. A good compromise would be to have the credit goto the clan of the flag puller. Still competition but maybe not as much. It'll also promote clan loyalty over some cross teaming alt with a lot of money gaining a lot of say in an enemy nations politics by just constantly pulling flags.

May want to think of ways to bring the economy game into this. Maybe have rebellions, which you will need to have a mechanic for, be promoted by the rebel faction supplying free goods to the colonists.

 

 

Bach please read the post again.

 

"

  • Lord protector is a person who earned most victory points in the port battle (port assault flag will be abandoned)

"

 

Again

 

"National decisions are enforced by design.

If captains don't like national policies - capture more ports and change the decision. Maybe a large guild in opposition to a government should get an option to become a rebel, starting a civil war allowing them to capture ports from existing owners getting votes to change national decision deposing a current ruler. Foreign nations can incite civil wars and pay rebels to weaken enemy nations"

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This is our last last warning. Captains 

 

Lord nelson was a 1st Duke of Bronte

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronte,_Sicily

 

He got this for military achievements.

We said in the first post that

  • If you don’t own land you can exhibit heroic feats – then you can become a lord and get land by lets say winning a lot in PVP

As this is a very important topic captains who cannot read properly will be removed from forums in a friendly manner for 7 days (by withdrawing positng), because their feedback becomes useless if they cant understand what is being discussed.  This topic is very important and we don't want people who cant read giving us feedback. We apologize in advance but we want to only focus on things that are relevant in this discussion

 

I completely understand your point here Admin. MY argument respectfully however, is by implementing this system it seems that guild will suffer a political disaster when the players gain more power + influence than their leaders.  Whilst that makes for an interesting piece of drama, I fear guilds will suffer a nightmare through disorganised + challenged hierarchy. 

 

Guilds currently play a huge part in Naval Politics [which this seems to address for the most part] organised battles, Military tactics, training and most importantly...Economic strategic success.  It's a beautiful sandbox game which allows for organised playermade economy even with the most basic features.  In certain nations alone you have production companies consisting of 20+ guys dedicating their labour hours to certain materials, working side by side with their crafters.  In this annoucement, and I may be getting the wrong end of the stick here, but it seems like guilds are undervalued + underestimated, and are soon to be heavily impacted by these changes for the worse.

 

Could the achievements of the players perhaps increase the reputational standing of guilds allowing them certain powers in the political system rather than give significant power to a group of certain individuals? 

Edited by Monkey Bullet
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You could use a status point system for voting.  Land owners/ Lord protectors earn status points.  Status points are awarded for port battles by diving the BR sunk/ captured by the number of participants ( 10000 Br sunk / 25 =400 Status points ) calculated for both sides.  In open world Br sunk ( +/ - Br difference )( 100 sinks 50 = zero ) ( 200 sinks 500 = 500 + 300= 800 )  Etx.

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So does this mean that somebody like my self with almost 500 hours and rear admiral rank will not be able to vote because i always take part in the screening fleet rather than fighting in the actual port battles?

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Ok initial Thoughts on each topic:

 

Alliances

I actually like everything here. It looks to be pretty well thought out.

 

The rulers/parliament initiate the proposal.

Looks good here

 

Who can vote:

Looks pretty good here too.

 

I'd love to hear a more in depth description of "heroic feats" and marriage into lordship. I'd also like to know how "victory points" will work and how to obtain them.

 

National decisions are enforced by design.

good

 

Making ports valuable.

more people? Will this have more to do with Crew for ships? I think this will be one interesting way to slow down 1st rate creep, will have to see the numbers.

 

 

I like where this is going. I know it's off topic, but will we have some buildings come in to use the crew for modules soon?

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  • Increase crew regeneration – because crew has to be hired and fed and rehired in case of full loss of the ship

 

I have a question, if I may... So is it a final decision - we will need to hire crew, buy food etc, rehire sailors?  Will we have to do it after every battle - or is it a one-time thing, when you get a new ship?

 

  • Every port grants from 25 to X estates depending on port size
  • After you won the port battle you are allocated estates based on your rank
  • If there are less winners than 25 lord protector gets the difference

 

Will it be possible to buy/sell the estate at all? (I see the mentioning of "special item", I meant real trade, by the owner, like we buy/sell items in game shops - ships etc.) Or is it more like XP - once you have it yours forever?  What happens if enemy takes the port where your estate is? (imagine you loose it 'cause 25-ish is a set number, or the same port can give endless amount of estates to, say, 2 nations constantly fighting for it)  What happens to your "noble" rank then? 

Edited by Inigo Balboa aka Ronda

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These are fantastic additions admin, keep up the good work, I really like the direction of this.

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So does this mean that somebody like my self with almost 500 hours and rear admiral rank will not be able to vote because i always take part in the screening fleet rather than fighting in the actual port battles?

 

Its plain to see in the original post, that you will have the ability to become a lord for open world pvp, not just port battles, or by more or less buying the title. 

1. Free diplomacy create opportunity to use Megazerg: England, USA, Pirates makes alliance and own everything. Diplomacy in game shouldn't be free. Period. It must roll or had to being restricted for abuse of ethernal empire domination.

This alliance is as likely as an Axis, Soviet and the Allies alliance to take out Burkina Faso 

2. Binding labour hours and crew regen to winners you rise zerg even more, besides promoting Megazerg-alliance idea for get more money, lh etc. Weak side in war MUST get something for counter their fails, or you will see billion pirates and 10 man swerige. Promoting winners two times as much - bad idea.

I may have misunderstood it, so correct me if im wrong, but your idea is that the side that looses should be rewarded and the one that wins should get a malus ? Yes small nations will most likely not be able to stay neutral and will have to ally themselves to one of the larger nation, in witch i see no problem what so ever.   

3. Minor clans worth nothing and must obey.

They posted that everyone from clans who will do port battles, to solo pvp'ers to guys like me that prefer to win wars by buying out the enemy will be able to acquire voting power

4. Nation control trough fast-cap + fast-farm + fast-PB-pvp. What I see, there is lot of possibilities to take full control over nation by one large clan, making a race for it. Bought lord title is on of ways. PVP win is second, since doing PB faster than others, you will get land, money and kills. Members of one clan could be lords in everything. If I remember correct, devs said that PB won't flow so often. In other words, when I keep in mind that ability of allies to enter PB and that "not so often", one little question appears in my head: Who exactly will partipiciate in PB? I feel there is chance to get "golden" PB slots and "golden" boys.

Again theres more ways to get voting power than just port battles, and before you doom-say maybe lets wait for the devs to announce how the actual port battles will work in the first place.

5. OS pvp worth nothing. Time-reward-influence relation seems very imbalanced to PB side. What if I'm not intrested in PB?

6. Potential Alts abuse with buying lord titles of smaller nations.

If someone can abuse a nations vote by buying a few alts, i doubt that nation is important enough for anyone to abuse in the first place 

7. What if "all loves Oscar" happens? France, Danemark, Swerige, Spain want to be friend with Britain and voted for it. Britain have limits of friends. And... What? Same question could be attached to wars declaration. What if all hate smallest nation in game to get easy win?

8. Rebels could blow up whole nations collaborating with enemy or leave to another. More hate coming. In fact, any viable option of revolution will harm nation to the death. This mechanism will not be used ever, or kill nation in case when rebels rly will have potential, or will be used to collaborate opposite side. All options is bad. 

My suggestion is to use rolling alliances or something around ideas told in Diplomacy&Loyalty thread. Here http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/12798-diplomacy-and-loyalty/?hl=loyalty.

And do not boost winners with labour hours and crew, please, for sake of good gameplay for all.

 

 

Edit:

 

Removed insulting part, dont structure your post as insults. - Moderator team

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