Add 1 Crafting Note to pick speed/stiffness.

[Captain]

I dont know if it would work, but it would be nice if you could pick speed/stiffness when you made a ship by adding one more crafting note.

 

Like a drop down would have [random] which was +0 notes and [speed] or [stiffness], which added +1 notes to the build. 

 

Would be cool!

[Richard Dryfus]

pls no. High Grade Crafting Notes are already over priced;-;

Edited April 3, 2016 by Edge_of_Insanity

[Porpoise]

They are overpriced because too few people have 35 crafting level.  I do not mind to have such option. You can go random perk or chose sure outcame at the expanse of 1 crafting note. Makes sense to me.

[Kei Esper]

Yeah i don't enjoy the 2nd upgrade being rng based right now, makes it a gamble if i want max possible speed on my ship.

[Jan van Santen]

pls no. High Grade Crafting Notes are already over priced;-;

 

The 4 notes you wasted on the ship with stifnes are 4x over priced.....

 

I like the idea of the OP.

[Captain]

pls no. High Grade Crafting Notes are already over priced;-;

 

well, this would make them less overpriced wouldn't it?

 

Instead of having to spend 8 or even 12 notes gambling on Speed, you'd just spend 5 and be done with it. 

[Ronald Speirs]

I prefer the idea that you can build it exactly how you want the only catch is how many slots it has is determined by our notes, so you can build 3/5 slot you just need to have 8 notes, if you have 6 notes then you can chose either to have 3/3 or 2/4 or 1/5, all that needs to happen is the crafting notes need a slight tone down in hours and this idea would be great

[Captain]

Would still totally spend an extra note to pick speed!

[delaine]

how to make them drop price wise drop the crafting level to 25 for them and i do support ops idea because i would like to have my ingerm thats goin to be done tomrrow have speed insted of stiffness

[vonKrimm]

must say "no" to the idea; otherwise the ships are going to become pretty much the same: speed + BS for ganking ships and planking + BS for PB ships.  If the devs must bend the knee to the OP's idea, then double the number of notes for your guaranteed build (i.e. 8 notes for that exceptional speed + BS ganker boat) or what they'll likely do: micro transaction for a guaranteed outcome 9which is pretty much a pay-to-win scenario).

[jodgi]

Hah! I've been doing this since I hit lvl 50, just clicking ships to get speed. Even 8 notes to get what I want would be dirt cheap compared to what I have now.

It is a grand design thing. Are ships to be magical (which simply leads to very frustrating RNG clicking) or should we be able to design them?

This whole frustration can also be fixed by taking out speed (and strength) entirely or making even built-ins side grades.

At this point I don't care what option is picked as long as perfect ships aren't subject to RNG or just brute grinding.

I don't want the best ships to be reserved for the select few. I want casuals to be able to afford perfect PVP ships. I'm a bit worried about big clan and lvl 50 crafter royalty class.

Consider this, a perfect trinco or connie has consumed more resources than several santis in my shipyard. Perfect ships shouldn't be at the end of the rainbow, it leads to pain and silliness.

[Quineloe]

 planking + BS for PB ships. 

 

That's not even possible. Planking and Build Strength are both the Trim you can choose. You can't have both.

The problem with the random second trim is that stiffness is the absolute worst trim in the game. It does not do anything. I can't tell the difference between my Speed Trinco and my Golden Stiffness Trinco. Both heel so much that you have to depower and neutralize sails when sailing on any angle but Running before the wind. And I can't tell the difference between my Stiffness and my Speed Pavels either. Both roll so little, I don't have to touch the sails unless it's exactly beam reach, in which case the Stiffness Pavel also heels too much. It might as well not be there.

 

Golden Speed however is an insane +3.6% speed. Yes that's right, golden speed matters more than making your ship out of Fir. Yes, it's better to have two upgrade slots and Speed than three upgrade slots and Stiffness, because that random Speed is better than Copper Plating. And it's free! If you get speed on a Frigate, you are considerably faster than an equal frigate with stiffness, and you will easily get away (or catch it) in a fight.

If you get Speed on your ship of the line, you can throw on a fine Extra Planking on the ship and you're still faster than the Stiffness ships in the line. It's basically free 8% armor + leak reduction.

 

So either nerf +speed so it's not the best speed modifier in the entire game anymore and not as mandatory as it is now for OW PVP, or replace Stiffness with something else that actually improves the ship in some way so we don't feel like we just wasted materials and labour hours on a junk ship.

 

 

And your pay to win allegations just come out of nowhere.

[AKPyrate]

No thanks.  I enjoy that part of the crafting is random.  If you can pick every aspect of them, especially with regard to speed/stiffness, then pretty soon the ships will all be the same for each class with no randomness to them.  Shipbuilding in the day did have some degree of random luck as well as skill.  Keeping this randomness helps to keep the ships all slightly different.  

[jodgi]

Are you a competitive player, AK?

Also, Quin. You positive about 3.6%?

[Quineloe]

No thanks.  I enjoy that part of the crafting is random.  If you can pick every aspect of them, especially with regard to speed/stiffness, then pretty soon the ships will all be the same for each class with no randomness to them.  Shipbuilding in the day did have some degree of random luck as well as skill.  Keeping this randomness helps to keep the ships all slightly different.  

 

Upgrade randomness already makes up for this. If you roll a 2/4, you have to pass on your least important upgrades. Rolling stiffness however takes  away the _strongest_ modifier possible.

 

And if given the choice, every ship built will be built with speed despite being 1 note more expensive, then there's something wrong with stiffness, right?

[AKPyrate]

Are you a competitive player, AK?

Also, Quin. You positive about 3.6%?

 

Yes, though also somewhat casual and not in a guild.  That said, I also like the historical aspect of this game.  When building a ship, even to the same design, there are plenty of variables that can affect speed, strength, resistance to rot, etc. I like seeing some randomness to what comes out.  If  you want that perfect boat, you have to work a bit harder to get it, whether it's crafting 2-3 vessels (and then either selling them for profit or breaking them up in hopes of a blueprint), or just working a bit harder to gain victory with a slightly slower, less powerful boat.

 

Upgrade randomness already makes up for this. If you roll a 2/4, you have to pass on your least important upgrades. Rolling stiffness however takes  away the _strongest_ modifier possible.

 

And if given the choice, every ship built will be built with speed despite being 1 note more expensive, then there's something wrong with stiffness, right?

 

Upgrades are different, as you can choose what you put in them.  The nice thing is that they can either help make up for a deficit in original boat construction or capitalize on its strengths.  The point here is that there should be some inherent difference in the boats, and sometimes it works to your favor and sometimes not.  Historically, USS Constitution was not known to be one of the faster vessels of her sister ships.  However, she was still quite effective due to handling and circumstances.  And that's the point, if you have a vessel, learn how to best use her and use tactics and shiphandling to come out with a win.  I would rather not have all the (any class ship) identical because of some magic 'best configuration' that everyone builds if they're able.  Then the differences just don't matter and we might as well have them all come out the same anyway.

[Quineloe]

Are you a competitive player, AK?

Also, Quin. You positive about 3.6%?

http://navalaction.wikia.com/wiki/Crafting

 

all the way at the bottom.

 

And that's the point, if you have a vessel, learn how to best use her

Of course this advice only works if you deliberately ignore that stiffness doesn't do anything.

Edited May 15, 2016 by Quineloe

[jodgi]

The point here is that there should be some inherent difference in the boats, and sometimes it works to your favor and sometimes not...  And that's the point, if you have a vessel, learn how to best use her and use tactics and shiphandling to come out with a win.  I would rather not have all the (any class ship) identical because of some magic 'best configuration' that everyone builds if they're able.  Then the differences just don't matter and we might as well have them all come out the same anyway.

This makes perfect sense on paper I also have no argument with the historical aspect. However, this and many other threads like it suggests that many players get frustrated with the countless "fail-clicks" in the RNG hunt for a good click.

 

I've seen suggestions that ships get individual speed profiles; One ship get a speed bump at 100 deg where another gets a debuff at 45 but a bump at 150 deg... stuff like that. That could be cool, and would fix the issue with "fail-clicks" as far as speed is concerned. I'm not sure it's doable on a technical level. The server would have to create a speed profile for every crafted ship, or a buff/debuff layer for every crafted ship, this sounds WAY more complicated that one speed profile per ship type with "uniform" multipliers. If it can be done then great but I'm not expecting something like this.

 

The way things are now there is such a thing as a perfect build (or two) for each ship type and we're here to cast our vote that we don't think it's fun that we're kept away from perfect builds by a mechanic of chance. I understand the intention but it's frustrating, no fun and therefore not worth it in my opinion.

 

Allow me to repeat myself; It keeps the best ships off the open marked and away from players that don't craft themselves. The intention was to make some ships special and more expensive. Such ships are so special they are never sold openly.

 

This game is already perfectly suitable for competitive play, that's why I'm here: Skill based and competitive gameplay. Special ships not on the marked at any price is a problem for competitive play available to anyone.

[DazednConfused]

You know sometimes i wonder if it would be better if we bin all these crappy modules and make it a skill game - but who wants that.

[Quineloe]

Maybe just remove Speed from the random trim and replace it with something else that also does nothing.

If people want fast ships, they should build Fir ships - not rely on RNG to provide them a ship that is even faster than Fir.

[Kawa Ahangar]

+1

 

That's not even possible. Planking and Build Strength are both the Trim you can choose. You can't have both.

The problem with the random second trim is that stiffness is the absolute worst trim in the game. It does not do anything. I can't tell the difference between my Speed Trinco and my Golden Stiffness Trinco. Both heel so much that you have to depower and neutralize sails when sailing on any angle but Running before the wind. And I can't tell the difference between my Stiffness and my Speed Pavels either. Both roll so little, I don't have to touch the sails unless it's exactly beam reach, in which case the Stiffness Pavel also heels too much. It might as well not be there.

 

Golden Speed however is an insane +3.6% speed. Yes that's right, golden speed matters more than making your ship out of Fir. Yes, it's better to have two upgrade slots and Speed than three upgrade slots and Stiffness, because that random Speed is better than Copper Plating. And it's free! If you get speed on a Frigate, you are considerably faster than an equal frigate with stiffness, and you will easily get away (or catch it) in a fight.

If you get Speed on your ship of the line, you can throw on a fine Extra Planking on the ship and you're still faster than the Stiffness ships in the line. It's basically free 8% armor + leak reduction.

 

So either nerf +speed so it's not the best speed modifier in the entire game anymore and not as mandatory as it is now for OW PVP, or replace Stiffness with something else that actually improves the ship in some way so we don't feel like we just wasted materials and labour hours on a junk ship.

 

 

And your pay to win allegations just come out of nowhere.

[Pagan Pete]

Nah. -3 Pagan Pete says.

 

We do need a more in depth system where speed or stiffness is based on the structure of the Keel and Ribs.

[Ronald Speirs]

RnG should be removed all together plus speed and stiffness, the upgrades should be where you gain your permanate features to add to the ship, ships are basically vanilla then you chose your wood type which give your desired traits, then your ship has 6 permanate upgrade slots, 2 x sails slot, 2 x gunnery slots and 2 x hull slots.

Reinforced masts, lightweight ropes and block etc are put into sail perma slots, hull can be copper plating, extra planking etc, then guns pellews, magazine access.

Then you can have 3 general/ regular slots like Pumps, Toolbox, Powder monkeys, Marines, that way you can craft the ships you require without the use of notes to gain a better advantage, notes can be used on modules for the size of the ship which scales in proformance

1 low note used to create a low grade module for shallow ships

1 mid grade note for medium port ship modules

1 high grade note for regional capital ship modules

The higher tier ship the lower the percentage increase from the modules to scale them better

Much prefer this method to crafting rather then what we have atm, we need more control of what we are making.