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Ahoy. I was bored so I messed around with excel. Introduction: There is a lot of information out there regarding this game. Much of it is outdated since we are in a constant process of tweaking and testing. I have been playing for a couple weeks, and have just finished grinding myself up to 50 craft. I wanted to see if I did it efficiently (I didn't), or if there were better ways. What I intend to demonstrate with this study is a data-backed guide to grinding a new player to max crafting level as quickly, and as cheaply, as possible. Methods: Data compiled for this study was: Ship resource requirements (fir/crew space - reason below) Ship Xp gained from crafting Labor Hours for crafting the ship Total Labor Hour Wallet size of the ship crafter Total number of ships crafter can craft with a full wallet (Ships/Day) Real cost of producing resources necessary to max Ships/Day Labor cost of producing resources necessary to max Ships/Day Data was compiled in excel. Results: These figures are based on ship crafter having perks: Light Ship Shipmaster, Royal Shipbuilder, and Overseer Ship Requirements and XP Ship Oak Fir Hemp Iron Lig Stone Coal Prov Hours XP TCutter 14 35 9 3 1 2 3 20 43 202 TLynx 14 35 9 3 1 2 3 20 29 362 Pickle 16 41 11 4 1 2 3 55 48 598 Priv 42 8 10 3 1 2 3 60 39 480 Tsnow 26 65 13 6 2 3 4 65 125 944 Brig 33 84 22 7 2 4 6 110 66 826 Tbrig 33 84 25 7 2 4 6 60 66 826 Resource Real and Labor Cost Resource: Real/1 unit Oak 10 Fir 4 Hemp 58 Iron 62 Lig 36 Stone 14 Coal 4 Prov 15 Labor for all resource production is approx 0.8 hours if producing at least 10. Under 10 and the unit:labor appears to be 1:1 Fir/Crew used because Fir costs much less than oak. Then we find the total number of ships one can produce/day based on their wallet size and the hours required for the construction. This number is not constant, so I'm not including the figures. For this example, assume a wallet size of 1240 hours. From this, we figure the amount of each resource needed to make n number of ships/day and sum the cost of all the resources, the labor hours/day required to produce the resources, and the amount of xp/day. We can then figure the Real/Xp, or the real cost for 1 xp. Ships/Day = crafterWalletSize/shipLaborCost Real/Day = sum(nResource/ship*costResource*Ships/Day) Labor/Day = sum(nResource/Ship*0.8*Ships/Day) Xp/Day = xp/Ship*Ships/Day Real/Xp = (Real/Day)/(Xp/Day) * this figure is = (costResouces/ship)/(xp/ship) -> A constant, regardless of wallet size Ship Ships/Day Real/Day Labor/Day Xp/Day Real/Xp 1/Log(Real/Xp) Cutter 29 39334 2007 5825 6.75 1.21 Lynx 43 58323 2976 15479 3.77 1.74 Pickle 26 54534 2749 15448 3.53 1.83 Priv 32 69758 3281 15262 4.57 1.52 Tsnow 10 27290 1460 9364 2.91 2.15 Brig 19 78496 4028 15519 5.06 1.42 Tbrig 19 67674 3322 15519 4.36 1.56 LGV ? 31470 1753 5399 5.83 1.31 * Note the Labor/Day refers to labour needed to produce the resources, not the labor required to craft the ship. These are all based off the labor hours wallet of 1240. LGV was included to see how crafting a ship outside of the 6-7 rank worked. I removed some of the data when I realized it was not efficient in grinding XP. Then I realized that some people might want to see. I included the inverse log because I think it makes it slightly easier to visualize the relationship: X-axis refers only to the name of the ship, and not to a quantitative value. The Trader Snow has the best Real/XP with the Pickle as a close second. *Greater inverse log = less real cost per 1 xp* For a visualization of XP vs Cost, an additional chart. Again, the xp/day and cost/day is assuming you craft the maximum amount of ships you can afford with your ship crafter's labor wallet size. For example, with a wallet of 1240 one can make ~43 Trader Lynx or ~26 Pickles. Conclusion: From the data provided, it would appear that grinding Trader Snows a day is the most cost-efficient way to grind crafting to the max. At the lower craft levels you are capped by the surprisingly high labor hour cost for the ship construction. I'm not sure if this is deliberate, as all ships had labor hour costs reduced recently, and it seems odd that a Trader Snow takes more hours to craft than a Trader Brig. If cost is slightly less of an issue and gaining XP quicker is more of a concern then it would appear that the Pickle or Trader Lynx is the way to go (unless the resale value is higher on the lynx I would probably grind pickles because clicking all the prompts 43 times would be annoying.) I have done some ballpark figures with higher ranked ships, but the trend of Real/XP increase occurs. Additionally, even with large labor wallets, the number of ships decreases significantly - so even with the higher XP/ship you end up making less XP/day. This makes sense, as the higher ranked ships are more useable. Personally, grinding Trader Snows has been somewhat useful. You have an increased chance of crafting high end TSnows with speed perks, which make a useful addition to your fleet. I would grind TSnows until you have a good amount of fast trader vessels and then switch to something more XP/Day efficient. An additional note, crafting trading vessels is usually cheaper because they use less provisions than the non-trader version. All data on ships that have a trader version (tCutter, tSnow, tLynx, tBrig) are the data from the trader version. How can you use this data? I think this information can be useful for clans wanting to train new people or also for solo players that want to sponsor or shadow a newcomer. If you are using alts, this is helpful information as well, although limiting factors will be access to all resources necessary. As the crafter's wallet increases these costs will change, but the rates will not. The Real/XP is a constant, as these divide down to a per ship basis. Same with the inverse log, as this is just another way to assess the Real/XP figure. Next: The next obvious step is to craft one of each and sell them (with the perk that give +15% profit) and then figure which offsets the cost best. I have a feeling that making 43 Trader Lynxes would generate more income than 26 Pickles, but I haven't tested that yet. I do know that selling Trader Brigs nets ~1700/ship, for a total of ~31K if crafting the max number of TBrigs. That nearly cuts the cost of resources in half. I assume the same will go for all of the ships in this study - but I haven't tested it yet. To the team: Game-labs, are the labor hours for Trader Snows how they should be or did they get missed in the patch? Thanks everyone. Edit: If you want to know how many resources/reals/hours are needed to go from 0-50 crafting nothing but Pickles (208 of them) 0-50 Amount Reals Labor Oak 3328 33280 2662 Fir 8528 34112 6822 Hemp 5588 324104 4470 Iron 832 51584 665 Lig 208 7488 166 Stone 1016 14224 812 Coal 624 2496 499 Prov 11440 171600 9152 Totals 638888 25248 Or you could craft 505 Trader Snows over two weeks and pay~363,000 reals instead.
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Combat mark and more have been introduce ingame in the way to decrease the number of larges ships ingame and to put diversity into port battle fleet. But Since combat mark appears, port battle have still the same number and same quality of ship than before. So combat mark are just decreasing the ability for a defeated fleet to fight again meaning more time will be needed to be able to fight back what decrease the aciton ingame what make peoiple boring and left the game. So COmbat mark should be use for skill, paint and this kind of stuff and be out of permit in the way to authorize people to still be able to play and enjoy. We can accept that open sea ship may be valuable in mark as endemyin but the port battle ship,n the one deciding the rvr should be not concern with this thing as everyone will use the bet ship for pb and there is no way to bring surprises in an aga fleet. At least a decent rataed ship need to be CM free per rank. One good 4th rate for pb (aga), one good 1th rate for PB (victo) TY
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I've heard that the safest place for building a craft building or ship yard is in a Free Town. Any advice out there? What about nation capitals? -
I've always liked crafting and enjoy the idea of building all of your own items. Though one thing that has always irked me is how unfriendly the crafting system is in Naval Action. You need to separately log down how many items you need of a various resource, then go to that resource and determine how many of those you need (Cordage and Oakum), and even further subcombines in several cases (Tar). A more fluid system would simply allow you to craft the final sub-component before final assembly of your ship. Do you want to make 3 mid grade notes? Move the slider over to the three, and click craft and it begins smelting ingots, then coins, and finally the notes. One click and no back and forth counting and clicking. If you do a ton of crafting, writing this all down when all of this can be streamlined with no loss of game play value. I can't imagine anyone likes counting up coal and iron for ingots, then for fittings, then for carriages. There are a variety of games that currently do it this way, Empyrion which is arguably a craft heavy game, allows you simple select your finished sub-component and it will make all of the lesser sub-combines without pushing the tedious burden on the player. I know Naval Action Craft exists and it helps to a degree, but it would make life easier and overall better in the game if this tool were not necessary, at no loss of game play value. I know it would take development time, but it would be well worth it.
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I still can not craft the Rattlesnake or Niagara despite being max craft level and no permit or BP available for it in admiralty store/ pirate den. As you can't buy the Rattlesnake from the NPC in ports either, this is getting mildly annoying... Please fix this. Thank you.
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At start after the wipe, French pirates and Spanish will have Gold and Silver and Neither Danemark, sweden, us, dutch and english will have any. It mean all this 5 nation are unable to craft any ship needed furnishing exept if they farm as pig to get them from admiralty. The question: Is it fair? What may happend if a nation is gold/silverless? I've seen many players leaving the game because teir eco port were taken and they were unable to craft ships. Maybe it has to be solved before Suggestion : Stone craft give you 10% of silver and 10% or iron for 100 stone extract. It's a slow work and people will have to farm stone like pig to get enough silver and gold Coal and iron mines give you 2% silver and 2% gold for 100 ressources extract.
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I noticed that there are several basic ships not craftable on the testbed server and was wondering if they were simply missed or if this is intentional. Basic ships that currently aren't craftable on testserver are Rattlesnake and Niagara as well as LGV and Indiaman. I guess the LGV and Indiaman might become available for "Trading Manifest" tokens but for the missing shallow water ships i have no explanation whatsoever. Can anybody enlighten me, please? Thanks in advance.
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On naval action today i asked a question: Wen can i craft The Wapen Von Hamburg? Only one person gave anwser. He said that you couldnt ever make it probably. He was not 100% sure... but it still made me afraid. I would really like to craft The Wapen Von Hamburg after the ship wipe... so... can i or not?- 4 replies
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From the album: Jean Ribault
Building craft window -
Current system tweak maybe ? In relation to the drop rate, Why not make this a visible % the crafter can see on his screen, and increase the % chance a little every time he crafts a triggering vessel without it dropping. Future system maybe ? Target BP research points for specific BP is known and public knowledge. Every ship crafted adds a value to a research pool held for the player and visible on his crafting screen. The pool is held for each rate. (Advanced versions crafted may add extra points especially if maxed out on upgrade slots.) Player can utilize other rate research points at reduced effect when researching a new BP. (Greater the rate difference - smaller the value) Minimum research points from a particular rate for each BP is known and public knowledge. (avoids crafting 6th rates all your career then eventually qualifying to craft a 1st rate) Practice So the player has a list of research points he's acquired for each rate of ship. The player knows how many research points he needs for a particular BP The player knows the minimum research points he needs from a specific research pool. The player selects his new target BP Minimal research points from a specific rate are allocated and the player chooses which research points he will use to complete the total either same rate or a combination of same and other rate pools. (Slider system from differing rate tally's) Player unlocks the new BP permanently Trade-able BP ? Once researched the player can produce additional Trade-able/sell-able BP that will construct 1 vessel. Seller must craft these using research points (x amount) and coins. Receiving crafter must expend suitable rate research points to use the BP for a 1 off build, but does not gain the BP unlock.(Smaller research tally required) Minimal research points from a specific rate are allocated and the player chooses which research points he will use to complete the total. (Slider system from differing rate tally's) Player crafts a 1 off ship.
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Currently, every tier of quality requires one additional note to produce. Is there a reason for this? The value of quality is not linear, would anybody chose not to put an extra note on to make a mastercraft upgrade instead of a exceptional? This seems to have created an economy where middle tier of upgrades are completely ignored as nobody will waste notes on them. and any kind of upgrade is extremely difficult to obtain for players who don't have a clan working for them. Imo we should be aiming for an economy where common and fine upgrades are much easier to obtain. I think one way to accomplish this would be to have the note requirement be far less linear and more exponential. Common upgrades should be almost free and just be a bonus for player building. whereas exceptional upgrades should be very hard to obtain and be prized. I think have upgrades be so cheap will mean that higher level crafters won't feel prevented from just putting a couple of notes into lower level upgrades if the demand was high. We could also make lower upgrades requires lower notes so new crafters can make money from them. I also hope this means that mastercraft and fine would become a cheaper option to exceptional and a viable choice to replace losses in day to day fighting. My aims with this would be: Decrease the amount of exceptional quality items, making them... exceptional items. Increase the availability of common, fine and masterwork items. Decrease the gap between pub players with no access to upgrades and clan outfitted ships with full gold meeting in OW. (so clans use masterwork or fine and pub players use common or fine in day to day fighting) Have there been discussions on this before and what are peoples thoughts?
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Some people in my nation's chat were talking about crafting hours becoming a commodity to trade, or purchase from ports. Maybe each port could even supply a certain amount of labor hours per day.
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I'd just like to say that I personally think the prices of AI ships should be a bit more in ports so crafters can more easily compete with them. I can't be objective here since I am spanish and we currently have a lack of resources, but even so, then at least in our nation the prices should be lower. Does anyone agree or disagree? Cheers.
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Hey, I crafted a snow today and included 2 CN in it. I obtained only a green snow (common). Is this normal ? In Willemstad at around 12:45. Rgds, Nico
