Terminus

Yea, the problem with alot of the pre-chapman designs is they seem to little to no design documentation left or if it is around i havent found it. On another note, theres a few reasons sweden moved away from large flag ships anyway, they sat to low in the water. The coastal territorys of sweden are covered in islands fjords and shoals all of which make it very hard to manuever something that this large under normal conditions, nevermind while ur getting shot at. At the end of the day Stora Kronan would have been better just being a ship of symbolism rather then actual war. Also, nice thread necro.

I'm still holding out hope that we can get ahold of a 1st or 2nd rate, they have some options. But I can't find the drafting papers for them.

The problem I'm having with most swedish ships, is the lack of drafting papers, they seem to be missing atleast in the line of 3rd - 1st rates.

Yea, nothing really stand out about her, I mean shes not got anything hugely unique about her either.

Konung Karl built in 1694 built by Charles Sheldon at the Karlskrona shipyard. named after King Carl, She was 54m (177ft) in length at the waterline and weighed in at 2,730 tons. she was armed with 108 cannons and complemented a crew of 850. She remained in service for a suprising 77 years before being broken up do to decay. She served as the flagship for Hans Wachtmeister who served under Charles XI and Charles XII. She would be later up-gunned to 120 in 1714 and then rebuilt to 100 in 1723-4 although its suggested sometime later on she was again reduced to either 96 or 90. Armarment: 10 36-pounders 22 24-pounders 30 18-pounders 28 8-pounders 14 4-pounders +4 unlisted chasers Broadside Weight: 854 Pounds \ A painting giving the Port, Stern and Bow view of the ship Fixed the Model Picture I couldent find any blueprints, but I havent done a Huge ammount of digging for them yet. the Swedish Maratime Museum has thousands of documents that arnt listed online, so its alteast worth investigating. Refrence: http://threedecks.org/index.php?display_type=show_ship&id=10844 http://www.sjohistoriska.se/en/Collections/Archives/ http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Konung_Karl_%281694%29

They also dident bother to close the bottem gun ports during the turn apparently.

Well when you put it that way, yes your right. I thought you where under the assumption that that even if your going at full sail, and cut into the wind nothing would happen. But yes, you dont just roll a ship over because you turned to hard (unless you do it improperly "see the kronan").

We really need a ton of 3rd and 4th rates, as they where the meat and potatos of the fleets they sailed in, I maintain the idea that 2nd and 1st rates should be incredibly exspensive and risky to use much like the titans and supercarriers of Eve.

Tell that to the Kronan, unlike many other nations. Sweden loved their shallow draft warships, hence they have a rather troubling history anytime you start looking at a swedish ship with more then 2 decks. On that note, I'd love to see the world famous Vasa in game, even if she was only a parade ship.

You can find a crude blueprint here, however its not port or starboard shot and has no sail plan. http://www2.kalmarlansmuseum.se/1/1.0.1.0/423/1/?item=art_art-s1/1641 I've done plenty of research on the dedicated thread here. http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/2482-regalskeppet-kronan/ My research has mostely concluded that this ships Blueprints no longer exist. (Atleast outside what the museum is showing us, i've contacted them a month ago and heard nothing back) Tho, there is enough info floating around that you might be able to draft some blueprints if you where a good artist. I was able to get this image of her stern tho, she has a rather pretty rear end if I do say so.

The USAs main power was in her Frigates, the US navy new they couldent win a slug fest with a naval power like British, they built small fast vessals for hit and run tactics, obv theres a few acceptions to this rule but if anything you could hope to see the USS America in game flying the Red White and Blue, stuff like the Pennsylvania just isent in the timeline. Also don't forget, I don't think you will see any SOL outside large fleet battles. They will probibly be like Titans in Eve, Expensive as all hell.

Still keeping an eye out for any sort of Info for this ship, and I happened to stumble across this, It is aparently a re-creation of what the stern decoration of the Kronan looked like as shown by period work from Claus Moinichen, It was originally depicted as just the starboard side, as it was being compared to SotS. But I was able to Crop and mirrior it to create a image. To note: That center pillar on the on the railing, is just a large lantern. But it was drawn diffrently then the other two and hence looks a little wierd, but its a lantern.

I'm hopeing we can just name our ships. instead of having 40 Constitutions (Obviously we will need a filter for people who have the urge to give their ships foul names). However I think it would be best to get as many ships into the game with their original design as possible, and hopefully allow heavy modification to the ship to fill the role you desire it to.

the Swedish designed many of their boats in the 17th century in this manner, you might find some more reading on flat bottems there, They liked them because it made it easier to navigate within the Baltic Sea, and many of her small islands aswell as allowing them to be used in a supporting role in battles around the coastline. Tho, they proved very unstable in rough weather.

Well actually that might be helpful, A good impression of exactly what ornimination she has would be great for getting a solid design down. I'm not exactly sure how to use this website effeciently however, It seems to just loop me around in circles. Is there something I need to do in order for it too display pictures?

Would certianly be a more unique ship, Tho I fear she would end up as a fat loot pinata with what seems like such a small armorment and givin her girth, she looks mighty slow. Maby good with an escourt however, depends if its proffitable I suppose.

I see no problem with her, Other then shes a little old.

I've searched quite exstensively on the ship, however it seems if anyone knew anything additional on this ship it would be the Kalmar County Museum or the Riksarkivet (National Archives) however using/contacting either seems to be a bit difficult seeing as I'm not Swedish.

Wind, I linked the same pictures above aswell, however I havent been able to get an awnser from the museum on if that model is actualy 2 scale of the real ship :/

Some more digging (Had to search the Swedish version of the museums website) and I was able to find this. Seems to be some actual documents for the ships construction. Unforutunatly The picture is a bit grainy and I have contacted the museum to see if they had a better one available and have yet to hear back. I've been paying special attention to the Rib layout on the right, if somone could scale the length at the waterline of the actual ship. you could technically get dimensions for the rest of the ship from it, however Im not that good at math.

You know, I think I'll just exsperiment with what works in Open Sea release and later in full release. If i can only use a Sloop or Brig to pirate my weasly black guts out with, so be it, if its a frigate I'll do it. Heck if its viable to go Pirating in the HMS Victory, I would do it (tho that would be rather unlikely). Anyway your all arguing about exactly what pirate ships where, and to be honnest no ship was the same, the "famous" pirates you read about, all had diffrent ships with wildly diffrent layouts. Realistically I think pirate vessals will be anything from the starting sloop to the point where speed and manuverability are traded for firepower and armor. This games idea of pirate vessals should be based off whats viable, not whats allowed. Besides that, no pirates ever built a ship, they stole them. The game should function the same, steal a galleon if you want. Just dont exspect to catch anything with it.

Well, As far as a Pirate "Faction" you could have the Pirates Republic, Based out of Nassau "New Providence" (Assuming you want to say the british never regained control of it) and Tortuga (Assuming again you wanted to bend the timeline a litte) really the problem is that the age of piracy was over by about 1730.

My vote on the name would be Ringaren it loosly translates to The Hunchback or The Bell Ringer, I pulled its name from an actual mid 1500s ship which while far to early for NA its seems like a common merchant ship name overall.

Well, the Wasa is a good mid-sized fit for a swedish navy, svärdet is a nice ship aswell, and we would probibly benfit from having all 3. On the otherhand I really hope we see the Götheborg in game so i can do a bit of pirating in it.

The only problem I have with that, is I have no idea when that picture was painted. Is it in 1676-1700? If it was a recent re-creation at that point it becomes intierly the artists interpritation. The only picture I was able to find that was anything close to the time the ship existed in is Which is claimed to be painted by Danish artist Claus Möinichen in 1686. However there are two problems with this aswell. First the painter is Danish and when a major victory happens (like this) the common practice of the time was to spruise up the paintings and works that where created to document it, for instance look at the size of Kronan she was a big vessel, but those 2 ships surrounding Svärdet are supposibly the Dutch and Danish flag ships Christianus Quintus (76 Guns) and Churprindsen (80 Guns) Theres no way she could be that much bigger then those two ships. Unfortunatly I can't find out much els about these two vessals as it seems they have been lost in the analogs of history. She was likely sized up to appear as more of a threat and to make it seem like the allies had achieved something greater then it may have actually been (sense they really had no part in her sinking). Second the painting is somewhat inaccurate? While it states that it took nearly 2 hours for Svärdet to surrender, Kronan sunk in a matter of minutes from the exsplosion that ripped a hole in her hull, however Svärdet still seems to be in combat at the time of the painting, and it was recorded that she was forced to cut around the hull of Kronan to avoid a collision which is how she got seperated from the rest of the swedish fleet and surrounded. So its possible thats somewhat accurate, however its unlikely that it was anywhere near that close in reality. While it would take a little strech of the imagination to decide exactly what dimensions she should have, that model and the diagrams givin are undoubtly the best resource for the diameters of the ship, as they are based on what was found of her remains. I've also contacted the Museum to see if they have any helpful drawings or diagrams that they might be able to share (I'd try to do some 3D modeling but im not great at it)