Ampen

Overhaul of War & Peace mechanics and national relations, pirate role and national alliances. Long overdue, and it will also give more reason chasing around the OS and as such give a meaning to the dull sailing. Not to mention pirate role could really make this game truly unique and interesting.

I really can't see the issue with not having this. Not only was different aids available, sailors of this time had a complete different understanding of sailing wich we can't even use for an aid in this game, such as currents, winds etc. I do think it's beneficial especially for the new players, whatever promotes people to get out there on the OS is good, what limits them limits their experience. For that reason at least make it optional or available as long as you are able to hire fleets. As for the "navigation" as such in the game, there's really no achievement to it, so not implementing it due to "realistic" or whatever reason doesn't really cut it. The only thing it does is increase the time you have to spend on the OS for some travels as I see it. For those who still want the immersion it could be optional in that case, and if they consider it to be a disadvantage to not use that option, they can value it against the immersion or the feel of "achievement" of managing to hit a port from the other side of the caribbean.

I think you missed his point. For myself as an example, I'm mainly here because I'm interested in the PvP, and as such, the idea of risk-free hauling is a non-issue, really, I'm not out to catch traders. It's not what I expect from PvP, what I expect is fighting other fighting vessels. On top of that, as a player interested in mainly PvP I also support your argument if I understand it correct, that the game should tweaked in some way to increase the chances of PvP, instead of as it is now, where it's basically down to attacking where one expects empty waters and no opposition. If I understand you correct the Open World as it is doesn't promote combat enough? If so, I'm totally with you, but I'd also like to hear if you have some ideas about it. As for the subject at hand, I do think that strict econ players might be more willing to endure long OS travel for the sake of hauling, let's face it, it's an integral part of their play: they amass the resources needed and they use those to build products and ships. For me that's looking for PvP on the other hand, OS travel and the limit of teleporting once every 4th hour is really something that limits opportunities. Considering the vast reaches of the map and the few amount of players, one bad call could really wreck your entire evening. I would also like to state that as a personal opinion, as a PvP'er I wouldn't mind taking the long OS trip as an escort for an eco player hiring me to do so. That on the other hand would probably require for me to sometimes be able to teleport a bit more often. To sum it up, I do think there's merit to disallow teleporting with cargo completely (part of eco players gameplay) while on the other hand allow teleportation without cargo completely (promotes PvP, and will as well reduce the strain of empty cargo hauls for econ players). Of course, some RvR fanatic will claim this destroys/disrupts/removes RvR, but really, I would say this game would benefit from the more actual PvP that the RvR contains, instead of vice versa. edit: clarifications and typos

Look, if some players want more PvP (since that's from where I see this coming, I doubt it's out of concern of people not doing PvP to "miss out" on something spectacular) the solution would be finding ways so that more players tried this game in my opinion. Trying to implement mechanics that will in effect cap your progress unless you PvP might make more players prone to PvP in the future, but I'm pretty damn certain it will make others drop out. As such it's a horrible idea in my opinion, since it's my firm belief it will reduce player retention. Player retention should be the main focus, since that's what will make or break this game as I see it considering it's a niche game.

His suggestion actually says "requires one-on-one PVP battles at each rank.", so it would be a mandatory thing to level up.

From what I've experienced, PvP gives more XP and as such is a quicker way to level for those who like it. I think that's a pretty good way going about this.

Welcome back Carel!

What I wish for is for as many of the new players in this game to stay in this game. As I said, most of us here are seasoned, so this doesn't really concern us that much since we've learnt to handle it. The issue as I see it is what effect it will have on new players. Will they consider it immersive, or will they consider it confusing? One option of course is to have it as optional and then those who want the immersive experience can turn it off, but then the reply always is "others shouldn't have that advantage" (wich is sort of an odd reply though, since someone who claims to be able to navigate shouldn't be at a disadvantage then anyway), but this brings me to my conclusion: In the same way as the early levels can hire henchmen NPC captains that follow you on missions, the very same early levels could also include navigational pointers, rulers, or whatever aid deemed necessary. All to get them into the game.

This is very true, and I agree that alot of games "spoonfeed" their players these days. Now, this game has another issue, and that is that it's gigantic. If it's going to be dynamic there need to be more players or travel need to be compressed in some way, otherwise the result will be a pretty empty open sea most of the time. While that might have its charm, I do belive one thing this game need to survive is an active OS. That said, considering the huge map, I would figure some kind of more leanient approach would be needed to increase the amount of players that stick around. It's not an easy subject, that's for sure. But bottom line is this is a niche game, and as such it will attract less players to begin with, tedious tasks on top of that will make it more difficult. Of course the hardcore games have that charm with them that it's the hardcore players that will stick around, but how many will that be? Enough for this map? edit: typos

I'm sorry if it came out the wrong way, did see it as a support for the argument and assumed nothing other than that.

Thank you very much! Expect us!..... to be afk.

I don't understand it as an issue where people want to transport stuff without risk, it's merely a fact that it sometimes require alot of time to haul stuff. As ObiQuiet says, if there would sometime develop trader chains I'm pretty certain not many haulers would argue about it. Now, this interacts with the risk, I belive. I'd wager that haulers have less or no problem with the risk of losing their cargo if the haul is 20 minutes. If they do a haul of 2 hours and lose their cargo, my guess it's not the risk that will break their spirit, but the prospect of another 2 hour haul, wich might end up the same way.

Well, people do drop out from the game. If it's because of something like this or something else might be up for debate, I do however belive that tedious stuff will make people drop out to a higher degree than challenging stuff. And in fairness, grinding once you reach a certain level and OS travel can be considered tedious.

I think this approach raises problems, really. Although you of course are entitled to your opinion, most of us are seasoned in this game. An approach to this issue is to envision what new players think of it, and how they will react. If new players drop out due to experiencing OS travel as unnecessary difficult to grasp to a start, that's really not beneficial. Topics like this wouldn't occur unless this was an issue. This as well I think supports my arguments. This map would'nt exist otherwise.

Good idea, actually. All for it.

I can't see the issue. The chain shots aren't really a marvel of accuracy, for me at least they spread pretty damn good.

Mhmm....well, people pick missions to gain XP, since there's actually quite the grind to gain levels. This is something I suppose some want to do in peace, learning the game at the same time. I really do not see the benefit of making this part harsh. What would benefit us all would be more players. In that sense, I don't think the choice of potbs to make it safer for new players was what made it bad, it was players that demanded to be granted the ability to club them. And I say that because I belive that thinned out the population. What that game in the end lacked, and what this game so far need, is more players. With that in mind, resorting to "go pve", "go fish" or "go play something else" just doesn't add up. You want an empty sea? By all means, make it survival of the fittest. You want a crowded sea? Give players at least some slack. edit: This game, as was potbs, is a niche game. We have to keep in mind it will not attract the same number of players as alot of other online games.

That is very good feedback, and I do agree with most of it. Think this will be more helpful for new players, although it might make others more inclined in longer journeys as well. It could just as well be enough with a spyglass available on the OS to make it easier to spot landmarks.

Although I do like your effort for the map, I belive you have a post about it in the map section of this forum. While your idea might be for it to be implemented or not, my suggestion is for some sort of implementation in the game, and for that sake it does feel like you're highjacking this thread. Feel free to comment on the suggestion made in the OP.

Difference between nations and pirates would be that nations could have massed up the infrastructure to actually make bigger ships in the caribbean if they'd wanted to do that. So realistically, nationals could do it, while the pirates never was even close. Now, about ships though, if the pirates were confined to certain ships or certain crew levels, the difference in ships between them and nationals would still be a non-issue. If pirates would be in frigates, I fail to see nationals would use 2nd- or 1st-rates to hunt them down. Out of necessity they would use frigates themselves mainly. Rates on the other hand would be used for clashes over ports and other major conflicts between nations. Now, this would mean the pirates would add for a new dimension, since if they could use neutral ports f.x., they would be a hazzle to say the least for traders. There would be a definite risk pirates was around. This in turn would create the need for the nation to either leave the pirates be and accept a toll on trade etc from pirates, or create forces to police them, wich would merit strike forces made up of small and mid-range ships. On top of that there would also be the evil foreigners of other nations that needed to be handled, so the need for a organized large force of high-range ships would be needed as well.

To me this sounds interesting. Could be connected to currents (wich is a part of sailing) that would increase the open sea speed. Would be very interesting for traders to haul quicker that way, as well as it would invite to PvP/escort actions.

Yeah, sure. Problem is players, or at the moment, lack of them. You can plan and coordinate, but there's not the amount of players that are available in EVE online. I'm saying the distance and the lack of players create a need for speedier transports if we want an active game in terms of RvR, and players interested in RvR or PvP will be limited to areas where other players are. Moving across the map is a strain on this, and once this game go public, there will be an influx of new players. Now, if a majority of those players consider this to be a strain my guess is a majority of them will drop out, and we will still be sitting with the same problem: too few players and too large a map.

Exactly my point. You need to focus on a specific part of the map. Meaning, if you want a valid RvR going, you have to focus players from all nations to a certain area. And if people come here for naval action, how long do you figure they'll stay if they're confined to a certain area?

The problem is players, and that there's not enough of us to fill the map, and won't be for ages. So it's either mainly sailing, or there's mainly PvP. Arcady or not.

Really? I figured it was an 18th century naval combat game.