Dan Dare

I do strongly support the idea of a bank of desings, really i hate some dumb compute-desing ships, they are inmersion breakers...for example the diferent sizes of funnels, incredible...diference on diameter is understandable, but hight?, well some British BC's and someothers destroyers had the foremost funnel higher than the others but who on hell will put the largest funnel in the middle or the aftermost position???!!!, nope.... Being said that...well...somehow.. I found quite radical that "AI ship design should be removed entirely...", we need options so give me options, .... and also what i will appreciate is that auto desing is being improved or documented from real life...,come on guys chek the Conway's All the World's Fighting Ships series of books (or Jane's)...do some googling...you sure will found them...I guess they are quite cheap nowadays I do like the game...please make me love it (btw...having a point of view from the bridge wings or the weather deck on top would be much appreciated...I want to roll with my ships!!!!)

Don't forget to add a drydock to the layout, just in case...

Pretty sure variety will arrive...be patiente...zzzzz

When vessels are in line, the 2nd and rest of then are all the time correcting their bearing, so they look like vibrating...

IMHO nbr of reload torps is not the issue but the time it takes to reload them. For me it is somehow strange not just cause of the rigging and movement that the standar reload procedure should involve on an exposed deck of a surface vessel (mainly a DD or a CL) but if it is sailing at some 27 up to 36 knts under fire and manoubring sharply, i can't see this happening on the short time the game shows nowadays...add to it some sea state... Tradicional DD torp attack doctrine of the dates the game depicts is using salvos (all out) in order to force an aproaching attacking fleet to withdraw (or suffer the consecuences) and the countermessure against such an attack is to send your CLs an DDs against the enemy DDs To cut down the nbr of reloads even more will bring your fleet protecting DDs unefective on their role after just an engagemet on a campaing scenario, I should said that while it is correct some WW2 japanesse DD get few reloads, those are "long lances" on vessel that could launch 12 or even 20 at the same time at an efective distance of 20 Km (allies torps were 10 Km and with smaler warheads), if you just have a 5 tubes launcher of an smaler torp it would mean you might have more reloads on the same vessel displacement...so IMHO its a matter of vessels weight and speed that could make your/ai desing to select a reduced load....for me the actual nbrs of reloads as the standar load is a good compromise Depth of a torpedo on the dates the game simulate and in a combatant surface vessel against combatant surface vessel should be something around 5 mtrs, no more.. it is true that Germany in ww2 had the magnetic piston that made a torpedo under the keel catastrofic but they shoot it from U-boats,with a totally different attack doctrine, at closer distances than in a surface action from a much slower platform against a slow target and also they had two torpedo crysis so they were firing their torpedos switched to impact mode and shallow depth up to 1941 IIRC Spreed angle management sounds as a micromanagenent, but i could be happy having it even holding a position of admiral ( that i guess the game is giving me) but a compromise could be that it is fixed with some variations depending on the nbr of tubes the launcher had...so you put the same amount of torps per longitudinal distance at the expected impact zone ( i.e.- one torpedo each 50 mtrs of the target bearing line at the expected impact position or something like that) it is just my opinion

well the line was blur even in the 1916 where armour of the SMS BCs were identical to some HMS BBs and the other way around cause late HMS BBs had a speed 2 or 3 knots less than early HMS BCs. Those Fisher babies where as intended compared with same build year BBs but as the fleet was not built at the same technological step, and things where coming up rapidly on those years any step further made things quite strange and unconsistent...and as said above.. by late 20s BC concept was obsolete and if some still where classified as BC was because "cheap BB" was not an agreed clasification

Conways' "all the worlds figthing ships" series of books may be of help for your pourposes...

Don´t know and I don´t care...this time they have hit my heart...Navarra and Canarias!!!

totally agree with your point of view, in fact the curve you show is quite significant cause Hp/Speed curve of a ship use to act exactly identical (looks as if power/time is linear). Based on the relation of Hp/Knts i will dare to say that the relation Speed/time could be better represented as logaritm...which one..well then we are complicating things...;)

maybe its is just me but, in cunstom battles, i think AI is doing something wrong with the funnels when creating vessels...one tall, then one short, then another even taller and so on...never seen that (even i go and check all Conway's great books to verify that it never happens that way) ... i don´t know why but its giving me a bad mood when i saw this almost always...i could live with the last one being smaller as a kind of compromise but...

yeah, please let us do that and also more that one ship/type on either side...pleassseeee

Since a lot of people have more reading time than usual right now, Osprey is giving away 5 free eBooks a week for the next 4 weeks, although this is week 2, sorry I noticed late. Anyhow, this week comes with US Heavy Crusiers 1943-1975 that some of you might find interesting even if out of the period of the game...https://ospreypublishing.com/blog/Free_eBooks_week_2/

well...so then the option to capture a vessel should be in...if not there will be no purpouse on scuttling the ship...

sorry, not my intention to be pretencious or condescending, i even dont know how to do it, and if you are offended i do sincerelly apologice...just stating a reality i live and i do work with sailors... i guess i dont know much more than you know, even i guess you know more than me...but i thought by the way you stated that you were giving then this function as inherent to they, which is uttely incorrect... In fact using cocks and valves is a sloooow way of selfsinking the ship with the high risk of being salvaged before it happens. (u505?) I'm sure we are not discussing on seavalves, cause what you reallly want is the option to scuttle the vessels you are commanding, but, please, because I do not agree with you dont mean i bear anything against you or even think on showing any disrespect to you. In fact this is my second "sorry to tell you", the first one being about drydocks...and in both cases the porpouse is the same...I know you know, so i try to respectfully convey it to you... with no fortune at all as i can see .

then you deserve a Scapa Flow,😁

I didnt deny there were scuttled ships, which i denny is that you should have scuttling as an option... Scuttling by a Navy had only happened in the following situations: a) to block a port entrance (rarely suscessfull if ever) b) avoid a ship/wreck being capture by the enemy. (toulon and scapa are good examples, but yorktown at midway is even better) c) speed up the "inevitable "sinking of a ship. ( and it usually had happned just because of fear it wouldnt finally sunk ...so then situation "b" will apply...Lutzow at Jutland is a good example ) d) Graff Spee at River Plate (the rarest, where a captian not willing to make his crew pay for his own mistakes decide to scuttle his ship and commit suicide). "a"...I doubt we will be able to block enemy ports... "d" will not pay the cost of coding to make it get any similarity with the real situation... "b" and "c" could only have any sense if "capturing an enemy ship/wreck" is also possible...afaik there were just some few suscessfull cases of minor ships in the period the game decipts and all before 1900...but maybe I'm wrong...but if there is not a possiblity of your ship being captured and you scuttle the vessel you should be courtmartialed and dishonored... If you tell me that the game will have the option of capturing enemy ships (that really i think is weird), then i will fully support scuttling as an option, if it will not be there then there is no sense at all on having that option.....but, and I repeat myself, just on response to the capture threath. Ah!!, I almost forgot... I´m sorry to tell you that, contrary to what most of the people think, sea cocks and flood valves are not intended for scuttling the ship...that by means of manipulating them you could do that is another matter...

Shaftoe and Cptbarney, On my decence i could only say that I was trying to be too much polite while dissagreeing strongly...without taking into acount that it could be interpreted the other way around... thanks a lot, will try on future, you know old dogs... And with regard of quoting...will make my post even longer...but also agree it will make sb get easily lost. As I said; thank you for pinpoiting my fault.

Dear Steeltrap, with fully dissagree what I´m trying to convey is that inmho no option to scuttle must be implemented at all...that you, by chance of a scrapping option (that should be in otherwise it is going to be a mess) could be happy and that's fine to you... then nice and great... after some serius hought i belive that scuttle a vessel must not be an option, unless we could block enemy ports (that I do really doubt we will be able to do)...,from my point of view scuttling of a navy vessel is a result of the imposibility of rescuing her, so similar to being sunk that why we have to difference both. Imagine after a battle you have won you have an impaired BB, just giving 5 knts and all mains out of action; 60% crew casualties. you take your fleet back to base but enemy forces are chasing you so you think on sinking the BB and run away to fight another day...detach the damed BB from the fleet and you will have the same result...you lost a BB and save the fleet. Agree that you could argue "but i could save the crew"...but are you certain than that will affect the game?.... great you care for the pixel sailors and their families but they are willing to sacrifice their lives for a Greater Good of trying to save your vessel...you have a Navy of lets say 300.000 personnel, keeping 300 guys highly shocked and with a PTSS really would made the things better?...it is not that I dont have any feelings but...as Stalin said..." 1 death is a tragedy, 1000 are statistics"...they will be always worth expended trying to save your vessel if there is a chance (and remenber, hope was the demon that doesn't scape fom pandora's box). Another thing will be if you told me that you would like to have the game implementing a random posiblity so a damaged vessel could sunk in "the return to base" voayage (by weather or uncontrollabe damage)...there I will agree with you that would be great to have it in the game. Exactly, Gessineau is a good example of how a Navy must act...you dont scuttle (on purpose or as an option) ships while at war...dont even scrap them...you try whatever is needed to have then back in operation...or to make your enemy belive she is operational again (there is the return to all the cost, cause you are doing your enemy to pay dearly to countermessure)...and, sorry to tell you but if you dont have drydocks then you dont have a Navy... Rio de la plata action is the only example that made me doubt of my view about the scuttling thing...sumarizing..your captian made a mistake and escapes to a neutral port, your admiral (that's our position in the game i guess) told you to go outside and fight the odds (ala Cervera at Santiago Cuba), but your captian taking the full responsability scuttled the vessel... and to avoid being dishonored took his own bullet...well, this circuntance, as human as it is, is too weir to waste the coding to be implemented...cause the result for you as Admiral if they fought incredible odds or scuttle the vessel is the same... no vessel and no crew. Dear Reaper Jack, I strongly doubt the IJN get that of "at least we save the crews" in mind when they told the crews to abandone death AIRCRAFT CARRIERS( I writte it in capitals to remenber to add later that they were sinking without any enemy vessel around shoothing at them, if not for sure they would have ended ala Bismark), i guess it was something like "shit, the ship is lost, we get out of here or we will burn ourself with she"... with the Akagi they fought like crazy to savage her but they had to finally desist an was abandoned too... (interesting enough that the Admiral Yamaguchi, "in all the bets sucessor to Yamamoto" and the best aircraft carrier operational officer in the IJN, decided to stay onboard the Hiryu and go to the deeps with her)...imho, yorktown is the real example of why a navy decided to scuttled a vessel, not because the crew or the cost or whatever...but could you imagine the yorktown under the IJN flag? Dear the rest of you that want a morale and tiring modelation...unless we could have mutinies on our vessels it will be broken...now seriously...i could understand training (experiance/efficiency) cause on the long run of a war is something that will be downgrading fast with casualties and losses (and no way it could be minimaized by rescuing the crew belive me, think it twice please...)...but tiring ??about what? being at sea?, If i recall well, Nelson fleet was one year and a half without stop at any port before Trafagar, that is what sailors do... sorry but tire will be some other personnel that use to live near the port when my guys arrive after a year at sea...morale...yeah that was the thing that put an end to russia and the whole WW1... but it is arguable that if that was due of being 2 years at port and then ordered to go an fight againts a giant enemy fleet or by the political movements that were spreading at that time ( I think was the inactivity) any how...from the point of view of this poor fellow ( that is me) we will almost have the same result if inactivity affects experience (without an intermediete little thing like "moral" on between),... but, if we going to have mutinies then it will be ok to have moral. Dear developers, where is the update..it is in quarenteen...tell us something please!!!

dear Steeltrap...fully dissagree with your view of scuttling a vessel...afaik, the scuttling by the crew of a navy vessel had only happened if there was a danger of she being captured or to speed up the inevitable if you are being pursued by enemy forces. If not, she "must" come back home ...apart from that matter of honor and prestige of a navy (you know, those crazy navy guys have a tendency to sunk with their ships) there is also the ecomomics that you mentioned...here i do also dissagree with your point of view, if feasible (a thing that you only know when she is in the drydock), repairing a vessel is much shorter in time than building a new one, and even more in the period this game is focused ...even if the cost of repair vs build is the same it will bring you a vessel back in line in a shorter period... the dock space and time, belive me is not that much...you give her flotability and lay her on a pier for repairs... the scuttling thing from my point of view is as if it is already implemented on the enemy side...you only have to think that when she sunks is cause their crew scuttled her and that's all...on the friend side, if I´m the admiral and somebody scuttle one of my ship in the middle of a battle, there will be no martial court...just a bullet in the front of the b*?t*rd's head....if you want to scuttle her afterwards...well...i guess the game has to have something that helps you in that matter, like a scrapping option or similar, if not we will end up with some 1890s BB in the 40s, and thats beyond any modernization capabillity... unless you use them as monitors. IMHO, the problem we face in the game is not to scuttle or not to scuttle but enemy ships that we have almost sunk and are shooting at us as if there is no damage on them at all...is not that they shall not fire at all...they should fire ala chester in jutland...but.. they are firing with all guns and reloading as brend new!!! (of course the same happens on the friend side) so basis on the above, is how damage is modeled what matters here and maybe the game should introduce things that downgrade the quantity of guns a massively damaged vessel could operate. so maybe will be good if the game introduce things like: a) flooding colateral effect: guns should not be able to shoot (at least sideways) when the listing of the vessel pass certain angle...so no more firing stbd with a 45º port listing...not only cause of the depression of the gun, if it was not enough, but the cranes and elements to feed the gun shouldn't work quite well...if they recover great...so, then it comes counterflooding, that thing that if you do in some cases will sunk your ship...or impair your capability of suffering additional damage... b) fire collateral effect: a fire that affects the supossed area of the magazines could only bring two things...a big BOOOM, or the flooding of the magazine by the crew if they care for their lives, both cases (supposing it survives the explosion) should render the affected gun/s inoperative c) crew casualties: at some high % the vessel should turn somehow ineffective, focus should be given to sailing away and firefight/repair teams. Cookers could help on firing guns but then it should affect their efectiveness...and so and so just some ideas..

it would be wonderful if we can have a pool of vessel (made by us) shorted by nation so the AI have to select them by defect when playing custom battles or the campaing. I know it could be used by some one as a gamey thing, so, as a solution, it should only affect the "cosmetics"...caliber of guns, armor and techs to be handle by the AI...just an idea that pops up while waiting...GIVE US THE UPDATE!!!!

yes please...bring it to us...i was one inch for getting into this nonsense discussion!!!💀

or the view from any other place where "I", as an admiral, would be... Cause I will love to be rolling with my ships while enjoying the view of the battle (the feeling of being Beatty at Jutland, "..there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today"