Don Sancho Navarro

JAJAJAJA, Muy bueno!!!

What do you mean? You are not a real person? Anonymous threats, or threats made under a pseudonym are not threats? I see that you have already started hunting the people on your blacklist in Spanish waters. Hope to see you around, Hydra.

Dear Jorge: Stop crying about being banned from the TS. Especially you. After threatening Lobogris with a beating on the Spanish forum, I personally think you should have been banned form the forums and from the game, and your own post about spies speaks of your paranoia... Anyone knows that threatening and intimidating another person by any written means is a punishable offence. Under the Spanish penal code, article 169.1, posting threats is punishable with 1 to 5 years imprisonment (delito de amenazas). The total absence of any moderation in the Spanish forum has allowed you and others to insult and intimidate other players with total impunity. I believe that the few examples below show how you and others have been violating virtually every rule of this forum and game. You should be thankful Lobogris did not reported you to the Guardia Civil. And you should be thankful the Administrators and Devs do not speak Spanish, because an individual like you should have been kicked out of the game a long time ago. You wonder why the atmosphere inside the faction was toxic? For illustration, here is a translation of the post you made, and the article on intimidation of the Spanish penal code. I will let the readers of this fascinating thread judge: After Lobogris received a broadside and lost a mast from Jorge in one of those fake port battles (green on green), another player posted a video showing the whole incident (the video has now been deleted by Lobo). During the ensuing discussion in the forum, Jorge threatened Lobogris with physical assault: "Lobo, it is a shame this (the forum) is anonymous... because you would receive a rain of beatings". And here is Deltonos, in the same thread, threatening another player: "You shut up, because you are second in line for a visit to the hospital..." and then continues insulting other players: "One question, which other asshole is missing from the list? We have the scabby goat, the Flanders-Fan, and now this traitor." And here is Deltonos again, in the same thread, showing his quality in a reply to another player: "Because it would be like removing a rib so you can suck your own dick, unless you are a canine.... which are able to do it ;-)". You often complain that the rest of the clans did not cooperate with you on your efforts to defend Spain. Has it occurred to you that maybe we were not cooperating with you because of your behaviour on the forums, on the TS and on the game? You were given a little bit of authority in this little pixel world and you used it to abuse and bully other players, and treat all that were not like you with contempt. I remember when, after a heated argument in the forums you challenged me to a duel, like if sinking me was going to demonstrate you were right. Typical bully thinking, you are stronger, or better at something, therefore you are always right. Abraham Lincoln said once " “Nearly all men can stand adversity. But if you want to test a man’s character, give him power.” By antagonizing virtually every non Ultra player in the Spanish faction and then abandoning it because you were not receiving the respect and submission you thought you were entitled to, you have shown your character: a petty bully in a virtual world.

Dear Frog: Yes, it's all a pity. But the insults and threats of Jorge, Deltonos and others cannot be erased them from our minds. If I had posted only 1% of the things they have posted against other players and other clans I would have been immediately expelled from my clan. The majority of Ultras are decent people and excellent captains, like you. But the rotten apples inside your clan poisoned the whole faction. You know who they are. I personally appreciate you and all the efforts you have made for the Spanish faction. I'm very sorry to see you go. Sancho

It is your choice to lie to other Spanish Captains. It is your choice to abandon them afterwards in the midst of battle. It's someone elses's choice to enter lineship battles with frigates (reply to them). It is my choice to be in my clan with my friends. It is also my choice not to cooperate with people that mock, bully, make threats and insult other players in the forums. There is my main choice.

Dear Grudgemunkey. Here is another example of the abuse Spanish players have had to endure from a few ULTRA players. The Spanish forum is full of insults and demeaning comments like this, directed at non Ultra players. The departure of Ultra may have weakened us beyond remedy, but having Deltonos, Jorge, Pitxagorri and Pablo Frias leave Spain will be certainly a relief. At least we will not be embarrassed any more with posts like this. Now this individual is someone else's problem. I have tried to explain the situation here, but the posts of our former faction mates speak for themselves: Here is another jewel recently posted by Deltonos demeaning a Portuguese player and calling him a "towel trader". I assure you that not all Spanish are like this, and probably, the divisions inside Spain are caused by the incompatibility of most of us with individuals like him. At the same time, I want to state that the majority of Vltra players are great people, and excellent captains. I'm sorry to see them go, and hope some day will raise proudly our beautiful flag in their ships, against the British, the pirates and other enemies of our Catholic King. And, by the way, it was a pleasure to talk with you the other day. Sancho

Dear Pablo. Trust on the goodwill of ULTRA and your generous offers to participate in port battles was lost after the infamous battle of Remedios, which was supposed to be a fake defensive battle agreed between the astute and illustrious head of VLTRA, and the popular and reliable leader of SORRY, and proved to be a death-trap where SORRY arrived with a full fleet of Bellonas, and crushed the few small clans that refused to flee the battle (curiously, the same few small clans that have stayed behind in Spain). All this, according to you was a "misunderstanding", but we lost trust on your diplomatic negotiations with SORRY. My clan fought those bellonas with surprises and trincos, and lost four ships on that battle. Now forgive us for not participating in the fantastic battles you generously set up. Saying we don't care about RVR is ridiculous, when your clan established the mandatory list system to control who enters battles, have attacked with friendly fire the Spanish players that entered battles without your consent (see this beautiful video here http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/20866-desde-cuando-se-atacan-a-los-compañeros-de-una-misma-faccion/) and have called "beggars" in different occasions those that asked for Conquest marks in exchange of screening fleets. (EDIT: Now I see that the video (and all of the videos in his youtube channel) was removed by Lobogris, the player that was attacked, because Deltonos used some frames of another video in which Lobo's his desktop could be seen to mock him in the Spanish Forum, violating his privacy rights). Don't try to say we don't care. You and a few others on your clan are the ones that have treated the rest of the faction with arrogance, contempt and bad manners. You just want to look good in the forums in front of the other factions in the game, especially the Danes, and justify the unjustifiable saying you left because of the horrible atmosphere, when your actions and words were the main causes of this horrible atmosphere. At a certain moment, some of use refused to accept your trolling in the forums any more and then is when this division stated. Your arrogance could not bear that we answered with arguments to your insults, that we did not show the respect you thought you were entitled to because you had a fleet of L'Oceans while we were struggling to build a miserable Constitution... I think it's fair your new mates know what kind of people are joining their faction. Being a good player in Naval Action does not automatically make you a good person. I'm personally quite happy to see you go, the same as when you joined Sweden before the wipe. You have been one of the most toxic, umpleasant and disruptive persons in Spain, for a very long time. This is a game, but your actions and words have consequences. Sancho.

Dear Deltonos. Cainite indeed. The actions and threats of you and some other members of Ultra show how cainite Spaniards can get. The good thing is that, since ULTRA had all the conquest marks, we have become accustomed to operating with small ships, and guerrilla warfare, so we will survive and have fun. The only thing standing right now in the way of a complete wipe of the Spanish faction is the goodwill of other factions, especially the British Council who, I would like to say it publicly, has shown that they care for the game, and not covering themselves with glory and conquest marks. You can be as dismissive as you want about those of us who remain faithful to the Spanish faction, probably we will be reduced to one port, and probably we will be left as a faction of scavengers and marauders. I don't know what the future will bring to us. What I know is that Rome does not pay traitors. I mean that you will never be trusted again either in Spain nor in any other faction, you may have killed the Spanish faction, but that will be a stain in your reputation that will stay forever. I'm not sure how many Ultras will follow you to Denmark, I have doubts that many of them, who are great, honourable, skilful players will do it. You have freely taken the decision that has turned Ultra into a pariah, don't blame others for your own decisions. I recognize there were tensions inside the faction (read my previous post where I explain some of them) and I recognize that some players took action against Ultra, I even understand the justifications you have published. Ultimately, this is just a game, and we Spanish like to have our good dose of drama. I hope to see you again in Habana, with the Spanish Flag, Danish flag or any other flag. Sancho

Sure, most of the post are people insulting us becouse we are leaving spain and people from VLTRA insulting back, the only decent post are the OP and the explanation of @Jorge and @Pablo Frias And they banned all the VLTRA players with no spanish caracter from the ts lol (alts accounts are not allowed) Edited 18 hours ago by Pitxagorri Dear Pitxagorri: The post I published was not to insult you, if you think so, please quote those insults. I just quoted Lord Vicious who was making announcements about ULTRA (with some inaccuracies) and asked you to clarify. As for the ban from the Spanish TS, it is not strange, since some of you have announced that, now that you are Danes, you will return to Habana to seek revenge against some players in your blacklist. Additionally, I heard that you used tour TS privileges to troll an ULTRA player who refused to follow you to Denmark. As you can understand, the few of us left in the Spanish faction cannot have a crowd of Spanish speaking Danish players listening to our discussions, and seeing who is connected, which battle groups are forming, and accessing other information. Additionally, an ULTRA representative interrupted a discussion between clans to tell us, quite unceremoniously how bad we were at the game, and how inexperienced in diplomacy we are. After the public threats of retribution made by some ULTRA players (a few exceptions, the majority of ULTRA are excellent persons), the new TS admins thought it was a good idea to ban you, and I agree with them. Hell, you where even shooting against your own in port battles because you had not authorized them to enter the battle. http://forum.game-labs.net/index.php?/topic/20866-desde-cuando-se-atacan-a-los-compañeros-de-una-misma-faccion/ (EDIT: Now I see that the video (and all of the videos in his youtube channel) was removed by Lobogris, the player that was attacked, because Deltonos used some frames of another video in which Lobo's his desktop could be seen to mock him in the Spanish Forum, violating his privacy rights). You should not try to present yourselves as victims. Your attitude in the forums and in the game has been aggressive, arrogant, and sometimes outright insulting and unpolite. I am one of the persons that decided to confront you in the forums, because a member of your Clan posted videos mocking us and insulting the head of our Clan. I'm not saying all the fault is ULTRA, but your attitude both in the forums and the game has brought all of us to the sorry situation in which we are right now. To illustrate my point, here is but an example, of Jorge, threatening Lobogris with physical assault, I will translate "Lobo, it is a shame this (the forum) is anonymous because you would receive broadsides of beatings". And here is Deltonos threatening another player: "You shut up, because you are second in line for a visit to the hospital..." You guys have great players that we all appreciate and like, Frog, Trajanus, Clearco, and many others with whom we have played, enjoyed and laughed a lot. But the fact that you were the largest clan in Spain, fought and won the main PBs, and had the biggest fleets and biggest ships does not mean that you could ridicule smaller clans and treat its members with contempt and disrespect. Anyone who doubts this, can visit the Spanish forum and enjoy the posts that you and others have published against Lobogris, the Santa Hermandad and other clans and players. Recently an entire thread full of insults and personal references was deleted from the Spanish forum, and several of us had to ask the admins to moderate. You guys made it personal, and you threatened to come back to Habana with a revenge, so it's natural that we are taking basic preventive measures. Take care and enjoy life in Denmark. Sancho

1. Reduce the number of hours work necessary to generate money/resources, the game has now become a permanent obligation and secondary job, without being so rewarding as it used to be. Suggestions: Reduce the price of extracting resources. Make resources more spread, abundant and easier to get. Increase the amount of money received as rewards for PVP and PVE. Allow for ship tows and shipping goods. 2. Remove factors that are shutting players out of parts of the game: Especially conquest marks have created a first class / third class citizens. In Spain this has even created a civil war within the faction. With the current number of perks/books/mods it's impossible to know what you are fighting, and player ability is not as important as the modding of the ships. Ships should be more standardized to increase certainty and reward the skills (sailing, arming your ship, aiming your cannons, etc). Remove country specific perks. 3. Return to the flag system for conquering ports, limiting the number of daily battles by nation, and forbidding two simultaneous battles against the same nation. The system should be predictable giving time to a nation to mobilize and prepare. Introduce the port raid option, a quick attack that is announced nationwide but with a limited window of time to join the port battle, not conquering but plundering all resources and warehouses on the port. 4. Limit or remove the repair option (if necessary reduce the overall damage done by cannons, so battles are longer and more fun), but infinite repairs are giving way to long, boring, frustrating chases, where players just keep repairing sails or crew until everyone is fed up. Again, not rewarding ability, but the amount of resources and modding of the ships in question. In general, the game should be aimed to who is a better player, not who has the most sophisticated ship or more rum on the cargo hold. 5. Introduce a balancing system for nations. For example, increase the cost of flags launched against other nations, depending on the number of ports they hold, the more ports, the cheaper, the less ports the more expensive, until it increases exponentially and it is no longer viable to zerg a nation. 6. Introduce a system of nationwide rewards that promote cooperation between clans, based on number of combats and wins carried out by each nation, something like a salary, depending on rank. The more PVP and sinks of a nation, the better the salary for everyone. General principles: Player skills should prime over ship quality/perks/mods/repairs. Player should be encouraged to fight other players, vs grinding/trading/crafting and other administrative and menial tasks. Nations should have a certain degree of stability and a minimum operational threshold that could not be lost vs current possibility of reducing a nation to one port (the game loses players). Players should not be scared of losing their ships in combat, The number of hours of work and gaming per ship should be reduced from current levels. Being a decent Naval Action player should not require hours of study and lab testing of every little perk and wood type. Again, reward good sailing skills, manoeuvre and aiming. The learning curve is too steep even for veteran players.

Alvar, gracias por tu ironía, muy fina, muy fina. Sólo queremos saber si lo que dice es cierto o no, porque los Vltra, tan activos antes en el foro, no dicen ni pío. Nosotros ya estamos haciendo planes para lo peor, no te preocupes por los que nos quedamos en España que ya veremos cómo hacemos para divertirnos.

Para que se sepa lo que hablan de nosotros, traduzco el contenido de este post del infame y temido Lord Vicious, gran amigo de algunos jugadores Españoles, donde expone en tres palabras nuestra situación actual: i doubt since ultra is joining danes and they are 80% of spain (100+ man clan with 25 ocean and 90% of spain marks production, wich will remain their even if they change side) that make de facto spain a dead nation, so there is 4 nations with a firstrate fleet, danes brit sweden and sorry and 3 of this are all against one, You not where about challenge and fair fights? you see how your words are pure horseshit my friend? Dice el señor Vicious: ... Ultra está uniéndose a los daneses, y ellos son el 80% de España (un clan con más de cien jugadores, 25 L'Ocean y el 90% de la producción de marcas, que seguirán siendo suyas incluso cuando cambien de bando). Esto convierte a España de facto en una nación muerta, por lo que ahora hay cuatro naciones con una flota de primeras, daneses, británicos, suecos y Sorry, y tres de estas van contra una de ellas... (sigue con alguna que otra grosería). Me pregunto si lo que dice es cierto, y qué tienen que decir los señores de Ultra.

I'm not saying any of this is stupid, but Captain Goldman himself complained about the sheer number of British alts in the Gulf of Mexico. Or was it your alt that complained?

No, Britain has not already won, but they may very well do so. The Spanish player base virtually disappears every summer, and is reduced to 10% of already small numbers in July and August. We leave our ships in Havana, and move to the real beaches to enjoy the sun, sangría, fiesta and siesta. Additional to that, there are rumours that the only big Spanish clan is splitting up and most of its veteran members moving to other nations. Some of them are even making threats to come back to Habana and seek payback for the perceived transgressions of the small clans that will stay in the Spanish faction. Of course, when this clan declared total war against Britain, without consulting the rest of the Spanish faction, committed all of us to a war we could not win. And we cannot win this war because this big clan, which is now splitting and whose players are now deserting to other nations and threatening the rest of the Spanish players with retaliation, has been allowed by the game mechanics (and devs inaction) to monopolize and accumulate conquest marks, earned through legitimate and phoney port battles. As a result, the remaining clans have only a handful of respectable battleships, which they do not want to sacrifice in battles of 3 vs 25. So, the melting of this big clan has opened the gates for Britain to roll over Spain. Its not the fault of Vltra, they did a terrific job organizing and building their 1st and 4rt rate fleets; or Britain which is simply doing its part. It's the fault of the developers, who failed to understand the impact of the dreadful conquest mark system, and refuse to recognize its failure. Now all nations are faking battles with alts, or other friendly nations to obtain conquest marks. Only those big clans with enough might to warm up an area can access the battles, shutting smaller clans and casual players from obtaining conquest marks. As a result, the small Spanish clans that tried to defend Selam did so with a handful of frigates and Constitutions against 25 Agamemnons and another 25 screening fleet. A hopeless battle. We did not bring Agamemnons to the battle not because our fear of losing them, but because we do not have them, because we never had the conquest marks to craft them. When we lose the few ports that are generating CM for the few small clans that were lucky enough to be allowed to participate in one of those fake PBs, then bye bye Spain. Someone posted a screenshot of the battle... this is what you can expect from Spain from now on, free meal. https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/835831966953327982/D01DEC5EC2285DD2B169ADFCEA1E340D7C88E1C4/ The current dynamics of the game are widening the gap between casual players and small clans and hardcore gamers integrated in big organized clans. If you add to this recipe the fact that resources and even 5-6 rate ships are so difficult to craft, money so scarce and painstaking to earn, then you end up having the Spanish nation reduced to a bunch of marauders in fast, cheap ships. Of course, the frustration of many players like me will grow, and we will end up abandoning the game that has become boring, complicated and frustrating. This is my personal opinion, please, do not start telling me how well you are doing or how many millions you are making crafting and selling frame parts, or sailing for hours to sell Chinese almonds in some obscure port, i know all that. Some players like the current state of the game, some others don't. What cannot be argued is that the Conquest Mark mechanics and the proliferation of alt accounts are creating first rate and third rate players, unbalancing the game and mounting the frustration of many. These mechanics are shutting many players out of the RvR part of the game, which i think should be a legitimate aspiration of anyone that has paid for it. With my greetings to all. Don Sancho Navarro

Gaizka, me sorprende que te sorprendas. Recuerdo que una de las primeras cosas que me chocó desagradablemente al entrar en estos foros fue el linchamiento público al que algunos sometían a otras personas, con insultos y acusaciones personales. Si mal no recuerdo tú fuiste el objeto de muchos de esos ataques hace algunos años. En este foro hay algunos personajes, sólo dos o tres, que se han dedicado desde hace tiempo a acosar a Lobogris, menospreciándolo, insultándolo de manera bastante cruel y directa. Afortunadamente, Lobogris tiene la jeta de acero, y creo que disfruta provocando a estos individuos que, además, aplican el mismo tono de menosprecio, y falta de respeto a todo aquel que osa contradecirlos en los foros. Esto me hace preguntarme dónde se encuentra la moderación del foro Spanish Language, y a qué se dedica. Hasta que alguien tome cartas en el asunto, nos tocará seguir soportando la mala educación e intolerancia de estos personajes. Un saludo. Sancho

I agree. Im so surprised by the level of civility in this thread. Where have all the trolls gone?

Exactly. I want to have fun. I used to have a lot of fun, and I am not having fun any more. And it seems I'm not the only one.

I'm sorry, but you chose a very bad example which has nothing to do with what I'm saying. Let's continue with your analogy. If I get enrolled on a gym and I have a couple of hours to do some exercise, I don't want the gym to grill me with a daily health check up, including a digital rectal examination, plus filling forms for every machine I use, watching health and safety videos, or have a chat with a psychologist to find out the reasons for my chubbiness. If I go to a gym is not to get a CR7 body, whatever that is. I go to the gym to do some exercise and stay healthy. If the gym takes too much time from the exercise for other non related activities, then I will en toll in another gym, or practice more sex to stay fit. Do you understand it now?

Even when the population was so low I continued playing because the game was so fun. Now I'm seriously weighing the option of leaving, the game is not so fun any more, because of boring repetitive ways of obtaining scarce resources.

Dear Mr Red Duke. Please, do not deviate from the main issue. I'm not complaining about the location of Habana, I'm complaining about the unbalance between time invested and fun in the game. This game is no longer fun for me because I have to spend too much time farming money and resources. And I offered a simple way of fixing this.

And it's going to lose the remaining 1000 if the game does not become less demanding and more fun.

Thanks Redii