praefect

Nice to see you back in action guys and all the best. A very decent clan with skilled and likable gents!

1. We had an absolute neutral opinion of the spanish nation and tried to have some proper contacts with you by listening to your needs and finding mutual solutions for all that issues with your neighbors. That failed greatly and led to disrespectful actions and comments from the spanish side, also against the dutch. Something we as dutch have strong problems with. 2. Attacking PB-Fleets is part of RvR and should be based on proper war declaration. If you considered to be at war with us anyway, why your diplo stated the spanish nation would be neutral to us and why you guys flamed against the dutch for their flag against spain? 3. Maybe, maybe not, I don´t know, spain is far away from us and we don´t have contacts with each other. 4. A player, as every diplo is,"must" nothing than to have fun out of this game. We don´t have fun from flame wars or disrespectful behavior from other nations. In that case you can demand as much respect as you want but wont get it as long you are not willing to give that too. If both sides can´t agree on mutual respect there simply wont be any further diplo contacts with each other, cos it would be wasted time and efforts, what we already had in the past once and do not want to experience again. Our contacts with your neighbors work much better so far. Also pls don´t forget that people are different. One might be elegant with his words, someone else might be more straight and honest. We have different communicators in our diplo corps and foreign diplos can choose freely with who they want to talk with. But in all cases we demand a minimum of respect and efforts from our discussion partners. I hope you can understand that. Fair winds captain! PS: "WE WILL SEE IN BATTLE" We still hope for that.

The US Navy is celebrating their victory over the pirate plague, their next destination stays unknown...

Congratz that you survived my cynic & prepotent person there. For me its daily life/experience reading all that within the chats & forums. Maybe cynicism and strictness helps me to survive all that. (I hope u got the joke) Fair winds to you.

I´m again sorry for your view of things. But the good thing is, we never met and wont ever meet.

True words hurt your feelings, right? I´m sorry to tell you that we are just players as everyone else and if we meet bad attitude from another nation we don´t reward that with that amount of respect you demand for yourself. Or to say it in these words: don´t demand what you are not willing to give others. F.e. don´t invite foreign diplo`s to your server to kick them afterwards. Or don´t blame diplomats personal for the decisions of their councils. And maybe also don´t do flame wars in global chat and forums. Once you respect that you can claim the moral high ground towards me and I will show you the amount of respect you deserve for your mutual behavior. About the content u post here, it´s pretty much the opposite of what your diplomat celtiberofrog stated in forums and personal talks. He also showed better attitude btw, so maybe let him do the diplo work.

Maybe next time have the balls to create a public war declaration.

That happened how often? 1 time, 2 times? Swedes are friends of brits, but no official allies. And if I remember correctly, most of the time in the Antilles war 15-20 spanish ships were screening for the french without war declaration towards dutch and/or swedes. PS: Sometimes it helps if a nation has diplomats who collect some information and invest time in bilateral relations.

Dutch honored the defense pact with the british/US by joining into this war, so they should have a voice here too, isn´t it? And as dutch we are simply tired I would say, of all that flame wars, propaganda, "national pride I do not surrender"-stuff and so one... That´s why we leave you alone with that here. We already had that a few weeks ago and do not need more of it. If the spanish nation wants to invest in our bilateral relationship, we would welcome them on our teamspeak.

Well, basically it was not intended to have peace talks at that day at all but somehow spanish side moved in to that while the true motivation was to better the understanding between all participants. An investment to the relationships of the participating communities so to say. The US came on spanish server because I asked them to do so if they like. In first place I was curious how the situation of the spanish community is and what needs you guys have, cos lot of spanish captains were complaining about the current situation here in the forums and in global chat and some stated they would even leave the game. I knew that US and Brits would support a fair war where no side get destroyed and since both of them are direct neighbors of for the spanish nation, they both affect your borders such that it becomes important, that both are on the table with the spanish nation. However, if spanish disliked that idea, we could have had split the talks but it wouldn´t have been proper peace talks then. And last but not least you forget that we asked for your needs, not for a peace and shared the needs of the british side. If the spanish would be in favor of just continuing, to have a gentlemen´s war or a truce or whatever, we could have had a discussion about/agreed upon that. With all that in mind you hopefully understand my frustration about the next flame and propaganda war certain captains started here. kind regards

We never changed our allies cos of a server balance issue, we just chose a new ally based on that issue. At least we can remember who our allies are, Anolytic. We might stop here at that point, cos we would discuss the same circles over and over again.

This humiliating terms would be, that spanish nation gets 6 ports instead of the demanded 30. All ports the dutch conquer will be given back to the spanish side if spanish nation agrees to a treaty. Don´t see a profit for us here good sir.

With british and US diplomats as witness, there was no arrogance happening from our side at all good sir. Actually the spanish side recorded the talks, so its quite easy to proof that. With making use of chat history I could bring a proof that there was just one single chat with a spanish person today where I asked what he tried to tell me with sending a "seriously?". I was just asking what he was talking about and still don´t understand with his further answers. But maybe the person who felt insulted should just post the chat content here, since you complain in public about it. Anyway, the dutch diplo corps has get a very strict point of view in terms of disrespect from another nation, we simply do not invest further time and efforts. We inform our council about the diplomatic trends and pass through the will of our council with the tone and measure of strictness intended by our council. Since we gone from a very neutral point of view into the talks without any bad emotions towards the spanish side, we are now very disappointed that it failed so fast and that we obviously made the same experiences like US and british made before. Maybe it´s (like with parts of the french community in the past) cos of some kind of language barrier where the problems are coming from, we don´t know. However, to demand 30 ports; to expect that in a full war the opponent has to stick to own given self-limitations, meant as a good sign, while spanish side is making no step forward at all; to kick foreign diplos from the server because they would be spies or this time because they would have been arrogant in a chat with a spanish captain... Sorry, all that sounds very strange and reminds us about another nation, which created a lot of frustration within our nation in the past. We are not willing to spend our time with that. The dutch respect the spanish captains, you fight bravely in the battles and it´s a pleasure to contest you guys. In terms of diplomacy we obviously can´t help your nation currently and hope we can just agree upon that we disagree instead of starting another flame war here in the forums. kind regards

Ehm, what?! I was pretty much alone in my channel good sir. Once your new elected spokesman came in and we had no problems. Sorry, that is pretty much ridiculous what you are saying. Anyway, once the spanish nation sorted out their internal problems and are able to speak through true representatives, we can come back to the negotiation table. Till that, we will leave you alone, cos time investments seem to be a waste currently. Good day captains

I would like to add one more point. It´s not showing good will and diplomatic efforts to continuously kick foreign diplos from the server, when these guys are actually there by invitation and to offer a open ear for the other side needs. That`s really bad attitude and leaves the impression, that this side is not interested in mutual talks at all. If the spanish nation wants to come back to a respectful contact with the dutch, we would invite their representatives to come to our ts.

The women hopefully do mate...

Announcement by the Dutch War Council Today a first Iteration of some kind of peace talks took place in Havana, involving the Spanish Crown and representatives of British, US and Dutch West Indies Councils. The British Crown offered to guarantee the spanish claims over the western part of the Gulf of Mexico and Cuba, with the exception of the very southern coast of the Island. This is demanded in order to have sufficient security for their core territories on Jamaica and are already conquered by british and dutch forces. The Spanish Crown refused this reasonable proposal and demand half of the Cayman Islands and half of the southern Coast of Cuba. Additionally the Spanish Crown demand whole Yucatan and more, till Troxillo, such that around 30 british ports in total would have to be handled over to the Spanish Crown. These Demands were rejected by the representatives of British, US and Dutch West Indies Councils. The Dutch War Council is disappointed about this unreasonable demands from the Spanish Crown as the dutch tried to mediate in that conflict in favor for the Spanish Crown. As an direct reaction to that the fleets of the Dutch West Indies Consortium will stop their granted self-limitation to Santa-Cruz and got order to take over spanish ports on cuba coast if possible and to support british activities in that area. This is decided in order to convince the Spanish Crown and their diplomacy corps to provide a reasonable proposal for the future legal relations in that area. The Dutch Forces guarantee to handle over all ports back to the former owner, the spaniards, which were captured by dutch fleets, if a future treaty does not tell otherwise. It is ordered to prevent any harm towards the spanish population. The Admiralty of the Dutch Fleets of the West Indies Consortium, empowered by the Staaten General of the Zeven Vereinigde Provincien

Dutch do not look for a "wipe", nor the brits do. Pls leave war efforts & diplomacy to your responsible nation officers.

Do u think the situation within the dutch is much different. Have a look on the amount of players online on the server. Reduce this by 20-30% for guys fishing or being afk. The rest you can divide by the 8 factions. Thats the average amount of players u have "online" within ur nation. Some percentages of this are PvP guys u need to organize.

French could go the northern Hispaniola route. French could attack the late timer ports and hold them together with danes and spaniards and could use the cool down time to a jump for Cuba. French could have some gentlemen fight with the danes to train their PB fleet or anything. French could provide screening help for the spaniards. Pls do not play the "poor victim" propaganda card tenakha, it´s rly not helping the french and it´s not what we expect from you after all the proper talks we had in the recent past. All nations have their problems with inactivity, all nations give their best in the war, all nations are investing a lot. But only few nations consider their personal problems as more important and ignore that some of them could be solved by themselves. Since I´m playing that game I heard of internal problems, implosions, rogue clans... within the french nation. So the problems might come from within the nation itself.

Thank you very much for that post LV. I would be very glad to hear the contact person you had within the french nation. You can do this via PM if you want. Maybe I could reward you for that info...

I wasn´t online that day when the flag was crafted. Once I heard of it the next day, we wrote an announcement instantly and tried to come in touch with spanish diplomats on your server. We are very sorry for that delay and I tried to come in touch with you guys over several days but couldn´t get a diplomat, so we apologized towards several spanish clan officers and asked them to pass that through. Today we had a talk with celtiberofrog and we repeated that apologize. But once again, we feel honestly sorry for that delay, we totally missed to make a proper announcement in advance. Too many of us thought that this would be unnecessary since Spaniards were already hostile towards us for a long time and so they thought we already would have been in a status of war. We are honestly sorry for that. The rest of your comment is very questionable. You seem to be a rather toxic person for our bilateral relations, so I kindly ask you to pass ur requests through ur nation diplomats to avoid any unnecessary issues. A good day captain One might argue that there was never a peace treaty after the last spanish-dutch war and that the massive spanish support for the french in the eastern war would legalize any similar actions from our side.

On one hand the spanish nation complains about her strategic situation, on the other hand there are no/low efforts in diplomacy to better it. What we told the french, we gonna tell you guys, its not about the ordinary captain we meet and respect in a battle. Its about ur decisions and actions as one of the 8 nation we have on the server. If you want safety for cuba, maybe start to come in contact with the brits and/or dutch to discuss about that topic, mhm? I don´t think the spanish nation has that bad emotions towards the dutch, that this would be an impossible thing to do. But we simply can´t help your nation if we get responses like that: "I hope to meet you sometime around your capital, we visit often lately." So I might kindly request a personal diplomatic contact within the spanish nation to have a chat about the situation. EDIT: @Celtiberofrog: Thank you for the nice talk we had. We are looking forward to continue that and hope to see the spanish diplomatic corps to be more present to discuss on a better level certain issues and how to solve them.

Congratz that ur clan could muscle the same amount of RvR players like a whole nation could. I don´t think that the 2 nations who currently fun-fight the pirates (US, Swedish) would have the goal to reduce u to a one port nation. Brits and dutch are currently busy around Jamaica/Haiti to hold that position ag spaniards, french, danes and some pirate clans. So keeps me wonder why pirates are loosing so many ports currently. But since ports do not matter, just enjoy the fights eh. To have all nation focused here in the middle of the map makes the situation quite dynamic and interesting.