Haratik

She's gorgeous. Would be nice if Bungee attempted a model.

I or Talos have access to the plans for American ships. Photobucket in its infinite wisdom decided to charge for 3rd party, so I'll be working to adjust my collection thread so the images are more readily available. That being said, and as much as I champion American ships, my vote is NO to the Ohio. She does look like a damn bathtub. Not elegant in the least. Not to mention she's a damn shotgun with all those heavy guns. Edit: The model of the Ohio is based on her appearance in 1841, not to mention I have reason to believe her first rate status was achieved well outside the timeframe (late 1830s), as such she should enter the game as a third rate, NOT a first rate. The only American line ships I would champion are the earlier America and the 1799 plan that eventually turned into the Franklin; those two designs had their own issues and would probably not receive much consideration for entry into the game. The Continental/United States Navy is best represented by her formidable frigates and smaller vessels.

People are too damn sensitive nowadays. Too mollycoddled and forgot how valuable a thick skin is. Back on topic: The American Frontier theoretically started in the very early 17th century and didn't end until the first quarter of the 20th century. That being said, and while I'm all for a Wild West setting, your images seem to hint at an earlier period in the timeline. Hence my proposal. My mind went blank (not to mention distracted by my current interest in nautical history and research), else I'd go into detail.

San Telmo:

Might suggest playing in a time period just before or during the French and Indian War (1750's or prior). This was the true American Frontier when the Native Americans still actively roamed the Appalachians and valleys.

Did he discover the fountain of youth as well?

I'm of a like mind with masterviolin. At some point during the WWI arms race between Britain and Germany, a number of the capital ships built were still strong enough to compete decades later during the second world war. I wouldn't personally put the limit at 1939 (maybe mid 1920's?), but if admin and the team feel balancing won't be an issue, then let's see what happens.

It's first on the list dude. How do you miss that? Lmao

The Spanish relied on their warships more for convoy duty during this period rather than duels between opposing squadrons and fleets; the French were better suited for such endeavours. I covered this topic briefly in another thread: Spain was still smarting and recovering from the loss of the Armada years ago, and was more focused on protecting her overseas Empire and trade routes than challenging the British for naval superiority. Therefore most of the Spanish vessels built of 70 gund were designed for convoy protection duties. I need to reread a bit to discuss the larger 80 and 112 gun vessels, but Spain was definitely not interested in risking the loss of another fleet to British superiority.

Ship suggestion was closed already, sorry bud

I would love to see her modeled, and in the game itself

You know as well as I the majority of the playerbase will never be able to debate possible new ships like this. I do agree though, it is refreshing.

It does say completed as...

A quick check showed 8 ships of the Pluton design built in the Netherlands and turned over or abandoned to the Dutch.

If it were a matter of choice, it would probably come down to Temeraire or Pluton. The former is the more famous of course, but the smaller version being specifically designed for more shallow waters is significantly more appealing.

No I'd rather not. It's a grand ship to be sure, revolutionary even, but the French ships need to take a back seat for this poll. Doesn't matter if they were built under contract in another country, they're still French in origin. We need a ship from an underrepresented nation before we need more French or British ships. Another Spanish ship would not hurt, but I implore people to vote for a Dutch, Portuguese, Venetian, or Maltese ship first. Game staff primarily want those to be considered first, let's choose one.

Admin said they were specifically looking for underrepresented nations. Spain would fit in there, but honestly if a Dutch, Portuguese, Venetian, or Maltese vessel is not a primary pick then I will be very put out. Essentially what would be the point of asking specifically for those national ships if you're going to allow suggestions of other nations that are already well represented?

Seriously? No disrespect intended mate, I'm all for the Spanish, heck, MOST nations here, having a much more full representation of their naval glory. That being said, belittling the achievements of other seafaring nations is not the way to trumpet your cause. A little history for you: The Knights of St John were long a bastion of Christianity against the Muslims, and eventually the Turks, long before the Spanish even mattered, and long after the Templars were ousted by the French. Before they were at Malta, they were based on Rhodes. Both locations are islands that were of significant importance: located on trade routes, naturally defensible, and boasting excellent harbors. They fought on land and at sea. Their history is little known after the Crusades because in the grand scope of nations, they held little in the way of territory, yet were always on the front lines of policing the Mediterranean. Unsung heroes if you will. They deserve as much representation as any major nation. Venice was long a maritime economic power in the Mediterranean before Napoleon's forces overran it. I don't need to go into detail here because Fluffy Fish already has, if you'd like to take some time to actually read about one of the greatest Italian city-states and the influence it wielded. The one that bugs me the most though in your reply is Portugal. The only other great naval power with a trade empire as expansive as Spain's (one could argue the Dutch or British, but for the sake of the thread, let's keep it simple) is its very own neighbor to the west. Surely you don't hold the Portuguese in such great contempt that you'd make a mockery of its naval prowess? Need I remind you that while some aspects of the Spanish Navy were indeed glorious (such as their shipbuilding), there were many that were just as damning. Portugal boasted a fine navy during the Napoleonic period as well, even if it was significantly smaller than Spain's. They were active in the war on the water as well, patrolling the English Channel and assisting the British in the chase of Napoleon to Egypt. More than the other two nations, specifically preferred and especially for this time period, for the sake of participation, I believe Portugal deserves to be represented. I do applaud you for your national fervor Intrepido, but I do ask you to actually do some cross referencing and study the navies belonging to other nations before making such a bold statement. I enjoy my own nation's naval history and will champion several ships belonging to it that would be nice to sail in this game, but I'm a lover of history beyond my own shores too and it's because of this that I feel the need to champion these smaller, but no less important nations. Haratik PS - *waving dutch colors*

If those plans exist they might be in Brazil (Rio de Janeiro Naval Museum), seeing as she became part of the Brazilian Imperial Navy after Brazil broke from Portugal. Granted, by that point she was no longer a 90 gun vessel, but they might have them regardless.

Add a Dutch vessel, a Portuguese vessel, and either of the Austrian, Venetian, or Maltese vessels with a staff chosen wildcard (I'd prefer the Montañés, but it's not my vote) and we're done here. Why are there French and British ships listed? Does nothing to emphasize the need for representation from other seafaring nations. Not to mention they're wasted votes when the emphasis was on underrepresented nations.

Your title says plan though...where are the plans? No plans, no ship!

Yeah, photobucket just shafted itself apparently.

Playing catch up here, but while Fluffy is providing extensive background for his arguments, I'm seeing very little counter argument being done, would either of you gents mind providing an equally extensive background to your counter arguments please, for the sake of someone who's new to this particular bit of history?

Aye, and I wish they could do the same thing here with Naval Action. Wonder what it will take for them to make pirates, pirates, and hang the community?

I just want my Cursed Blade the way it used to be pre nerf. Oh wait, wrong game. Don't you mean mechanics? At this point it seems to be beating a dead horse and not getting anywhere. I'm just eating my popcorn and waiting til Friday to see what goes down. It'll be interesting for sure.